# NY AG Letitia James drops the (civil) hammer {On Trump & Family} \[9/21/2022\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [September 21, 2022, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991 "2022-09-21T16:13:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 110
**Author:** ![StraightTalk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/straighttalk/32/9982_2.png) [@StraightTalk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StraightTalk)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2182 "2024-02-17T01:44:08Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > > [@Atamasama](#): > > > > I too am curious if it turns out that Trump having a massive debt that he **must** pay for legal reasons ends up like yanking the bottom out of a house of cards, where he has a bunch of properties he’s in debt for defaulting one after another. How would that all play out? > > Well, the man has declared bankruptcy more than once in the past. Truth be told, I’m not either financially or legally knowledgeable to opine if that is an option for him, but I’m sure others here may have better sources than I. > > Press on. Has he personally declared bankruptcy or was it various businesses? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2183 "2024-02-17T01:47:10Z")
Doesn’t matter - he can’t discharge **these** debts thru bankruptcy. But to answer the question, it was always businesses that went tits-up, **after** he had gotten all the money possible out of them. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2184 "2024-02-17T02:04:39Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > The whole point for Trump is to stretch everything out, delay, delay, and hope he gets elected King For Life. Delay what though? Is there a chance at getting a stay pending appeal? I never got the impression that it was on the table. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2185 "2024-02-17T02:06:31Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Is there a chance at getting a stay pending appeal? Typically, everything is on hold during appeal if a bond is posted. (but as I have said, I have no experience in NY courts, or a case like this). ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2186 "2024-02-17T02:25:19Z")
NVM, covered upthread ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2187 "2024-02-17T02:25:48Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > What’s all this about Engeron being reversed? Back in October or November, Engoron issued a court order that said, “_STOP BLORTING ABOUT MY CLERK / STAFF!_” because his people were receiving threats. An appeals court issued a ruling that said the blortings were protected by 1A (staying/reversing Engoron’s order). ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2188 "2024-02-17T03:00:44Z")
We all knew there would be a spin from Fox, and here it is: > [@](#): > > Experts say large penalty in Trump fraud case could trigger New York business exodus That is their leading headline. I’m not going to link to the actual article, since it is such bullshit. Let me rephrase it a bit: **If you want to commit fraud in NY, you should expect large penalties. Florida welcomes you with open arms** For fuck’s sake. If you don’t want to have large penalties levied against you, maybe don’t do a bunch of fraud. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2189 "2024-02-17T04:04:25Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Delay what though? AIUI delay going to jail. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2190 "2024-02-17T04:09:18Z")
That’s not an issue in this case, since it’s civil, not criminal. But hoping to delay execution of the civil judgment while _something-something_ happens, maybe? ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2191 "2024-02-17T04:31:51Z")
I think the Trump interpretation is that if he can delay this until after the election, his magical President powers will make it go away. The fact that this has no basis in law, logic or reality does not stop Trump from believing it with all of his existence. ---
**Author:** ![anny\_m](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@anny\_m](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anny_m)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2192 "2024-02-17T05:10:34Z")
I’m sure someone here knows enough about banking law to answer this. Engeron’s order says that Trump, the Trump organization, etc., etc. > are hereby enjoined from applying for loans from any financial institution chartered by or registered with the New York Department of Financial Services for a period of three years What does it mean for a financial institution to be registered with the Department of Financial Services? I’m thinking that any state might require registration for any company (even those chartered in other states or countries) to be allowed to provide financial services within its boundaries. How else can the state work to assure the protection of its citizens? I mean, can the First National Bank of Freedonia (R. T. Firefly, CEO) just open an office in Manhattan and start doing business? Does Axos have to be registered in New York to do business there? If there’s reciprocity between states for registration of financial institutions, would that mean that Axos (presumably registered in CA) would be legally (albeit indirectly) registered in New York and therefore Trump couldn’t apply for a loan from them? ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2193 "2024-02-17T06:03:30Z")
> [@anny\_m](#): > > What does it mean for a financial institution to be registered with the Department of Financial Services? I have been trying to figure this out myself. Axos Financial is the holding company, Axos Bank appears to be the entity that made the prior loan to Trump. [Axos Bank - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axos_Bank) Axos Bank is nationally chartered. Nationally chartered banks are supervised by the OCC and can do business in any state. So they are certainty not chartered in NY (NY does not supervise or regulate them) but it’s unclear to me what the term “registered” in the judgment means. This NY Dept of Financial Services portal has no hits for any Axos entity, but the terminology here is “supervise”, there is no indication of what it might mean for a bank to be “registered” with them. [https://www.dfs.ny.gov/who\_we\_supervise](https://www.dfs.ny.gov/who_we_supervise) My read is that I doubt that NY State has the power to prevent a nationally chartered bank from lending money to Trump outside NY. But if the only collateral that Trump could pledge against a loan is property in NY state, that would obviously require a contract under NY State law. However, as discussed upthread, if the Trump organization found any willing lender against NY property assets for the specific purpose of satisfying the judgment, it would be odd if that loan were disallowed by the judgment. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2194 "2024-02-17T06:05:39Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Unless he has a politically motivated benefactor, he will need to put up collateral worth $400mm that guarantees repayment. If he doesn’t have unencumbered assets worth $400mm, he’s got a serious problem. No worries! A billionaire has already started a gofundme for him. Fundraiser by Elena Cardone : Stand with Trump; Fund the $355M Unjust Judgment ) One of the comments: > [@](#): > > President Trump has done so much to save us, now he needs us to help save him. I am thankful he loves America and is willing to risk all he has to save it. No, honey. He’s willing to risk all _you_ have to save _him_. ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2195 "2024-02-17T06:18:07Z")
> [@aurora\_maire](#): > > No honey. He’s willing to risk all _you_ have to save _him_. B.bb.bbb…bbbut noooooo! Trump is America. We have to save ourselves!!! We all should donate everything we have!!! Just leave a dollar aside, to buy a pack of kool-ade. ---
**Author:** ![Smid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/838e76/32.png) [@Smid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smid)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2196 "2024-02-17T11:59:59Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > Perhaps he can sell Mal-a-Lardo for the **$1.something billion that it’s worth**. I’m seeing a flaw in this outcome… Anyway, if he thinks the Trump brand is the value, and it’s sold, and it’s not Trump anymore, who’d buy it? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2197 "2024-02-17T14:20:16Z")
**Moderating:** Please remember to attribute where the quotes are coming from. We had a flag raised over fair use, that is also being reviewed, but the attribution is a requirement for certain. ---
**Author:** ![StarvingButStrong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/starvingbutstrong/32/335_2.png) [@StarvingButStrong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StarvingButStrong)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2198 "2024-02-17T15:08:21Z")
Trump’s businesses in NY are still allowed to operate normally, though, right? I mean, guests can check into hotels, people can play golf on his courses, if you rent a house or apartment, you keep living there and paying rent? ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2199 "2024-02-17T15:10:13Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > > [@Atamasama](#): > > > > Delay what though? > > AIUI delay going to jail. > [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > That’s not an issue in this case, since it’s civil, not criminal. Aggh, I keep getting everything mixed up. Is there NO way that this track could potentially lead to jail time for trump? What if he doesn’t pay up? What ultimate consequence IS he, in fact, attempting to avoid with all these delays. (Other than just for the sport of it?) ETA: I was going to say “on principle,” but he doesn’t have principles. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2200 "2024-02-17T15:12:47Z")
Yes, for now. They are not being run by anyone named trump, and a third party is overseeing the assets. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2024, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2201 "2024-02-17T15:59:24Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Aggh, I keep getting everything mixed up. Is there NO way that this track could potentially lead to jail time for trump? What if he doesn’t pay up? I know I’ve read of people getting locked up for being in contempt for non-compliance with a civil judgment. There was one guy who went to the slammer for years for contempt, rather than reveal where $$$ ended that his ex-wife had claim to. It was clearly for spite. So, I guess it would be the difference between having difficulty paying because of liquidity, which just slows things down until assets can get sold, and actively obstructing the judgment from being satisfied. But I think we can all agree, Trump would never do something so petty. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=109) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=111)