# NY AG Letitia James drops the (civil) hammer {On Trump & Family} \[9/21/2022\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [September 21, 2022, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991 "2022-09-21T16:13:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 125
**Author:** ![anny\_m](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@anny\_m](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anny_m)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2024, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2482 "2024-02-25T22:45:52Z")
I have no idea how many of these licensing agreements Trump has, but I’m pretty sure there are quite a few. Grab the revenues from all of them and you might be well into eight figures. I never meant to imply that this would pay off his debt. But a few million per year while the property seizures and whatever make their way through the courts might come in handy. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2024, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2483 "2024-02-25T23:26:34Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > there will be no cash payout to Carroll on March 10th, there will be no bond paid paid in the New York civil fraud case, and AG James will start the collections process late next month. Wouldn’t that trigger the default provisions in the loans he currently has outstanding? Wouldn’t his whole house of cards then collapse? ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2024, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2484 "2024-02-25T23:31:54Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Wouldn’t that trigger the default provisions in the loans he currently has outstanding? Wouldn’t his whole house of cards then collapse? Not clear, at least not immediately. How long would it take AG James to obtain an estimate of Trump’s personal cash position or net worth? Also, not clear how fast his lenders want to push him into default. I suspect the house of cards has collapsed, but whether the Trump can kick the can to Nov 4 depends upon the common sense of his supporters and sometimes supporters, not a given. ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2485 "2024-02-26T03:26:44Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > We don’t know whether Trump’s net worth is even positive in actuality. I’m beginning to wonder if it even matters. What matters is Trump’s public image of being rich, not the actual math of his net worth. He has already gone bankrupt many times. We have seen his proud name publicly removed from gaudy casinos, and the buildings were physically demolished. Now the threat is that the sign with his name will be removed from Trump Tower. Or a bunch.of obscure legai documents pertaining to ownership of 40 Wall Steet will be filed . We Dopers are all salivating with anticipation, but what difference will it really nake? Trump will still claim to be rich, and his voters will still believe it. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2486 "2024-02-26T03:33:31Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > He has already gone bankrupt many times. Just to be clear: Trump has [filed bankruptcy _for some of his business concerns_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_career_of_Donald_Trump#Business_bankruptcies) (hotels and casinos) six times. He has never filed for personal bankruptcy. ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2487 "2024-02-26T03:48:21Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > He has never filed for personal bankruptcy. Not yet. We’ll see if he does it before March 12th to delay things. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2488 "2024-02-26T10:34:43Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Emphyteutic lease > [@Spoons](#): > > Understanding that is beyond my pay grade. ☹ Hell, _pronouncing_ that is beyond my pay grade. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2489 "2024-02-26T15:47:31Z")
Trump’s attorneys officially file their notice of appeal [Donald Trump appeals $454 million judgment in New York civil fraud case (msn.com)](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/donald-trump-appeals-454-million-judgment-in-new-york-civil-fraud-case/ar-BB1iUGt2?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531&cvid=829566349f16406582e02f6702ba03be&ei=35) ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2490 "2024-02-26T15:50:27Z")
So has he had to put any money down? ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2491 "2024-02-26T15:52:38Z")
> [@Cardigan](#): > > Trump’s attorneys officially file their appeal > > [Donald Trump appeals $454 million judgment in New York civil fraud case (msn.com)](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/donald-trump-appeals-454-million-judgment-in-new-york-civil-fraud-case/ar-BB1iUGt2?ocid=entnewsntp&pc=U531&cvid=829566349f16406582e02f6702ba03be&ei=35) But critically as described [here](https://www.cnbc.com/2024/02/26/trump-appeals-new-york-civil-fraud-verdict.html?utm_source=fark&utm_medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark): > The notices do not indicate that Trump has secured an [appeal bond](https://www.cnbc.com/2024/02/21/trump-faces-obstacles-to-securing-an-appeal-bond-in-fraud-case-.html), which is required in order to pause the judgment from being enforced. So he can appeal all he wants, but it won’t stop them from taking his stuff to pay the judgement. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2492 "2024-02-26T15:52:46Z")
That one very important detail is not addressed in the linked story. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2493 "2024-02-26T15:56:04Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > So he can appeal all he wants, but it won’t stop them from taking his stuff to pay the judgement. How long until he says something along the lines of “I filed for an appeal and now they’re telling me I have to pay $454 million dollars for an appeal. Can you believe that? They’ve never made any one else in the history of the courts pay that much money just to appeal a ruling from a crooked judge…and these windmills, have you seen these windmills, or ‘bird graveyards’, as I like to call them…”. And watch how fast the right reacts to him complaining about having to put up the money. Now, to be fair, I think that caught a lot of us off guard, but then we realized it’s part of how the appeal system works, not that he’s being treated differently. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2494 "2024-02-26T15:56:25Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > Good ol’ Vlad…he"s our best friend! Vlad the defenestrator? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2495 "2024-02-26T15:57:11Z")
> [@Cardigan](#): > > That one very important detail is not addressed in the linked story… Yes, I noted that in the CNN story as well. I guess one can appeal without putting up a bond or cash? But perhaps this just means that after 30 days, the State of NY can begin putting liens on property and going after the judgement. And Trump’s lawyers will tie this process up in knots, given the mortgages on the properties, the tangle of corporate ownership and the fact that many of the buildings are not owned by Trump, he just sold his name. Trump really is trying to run out the clock. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2496 "2024-02-26T16:05:20Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I guess one can appeal without putting up a bond or cash? But perhaps this just means that after 30 days, the State of NY can begin putting liens on property and going after the judgement. That’s my understanding as well. And without a bond, and presumably without any actual cause for appeal (from what I can see it’s mostly griping about bias, probably because the judge wouldn’t let Trump say or do anything he wants in court, including rambling about political crap) there won’t be anything stopping or even slowing down the state from taking his stuff. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2497 "2024-02-26T16:07:26Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > How long until he says something along the lines of “I filed for an appeal and now they’re telling me I have to pay $454 million dollars for an appeal. Can you believe that? They’ve never made any one else in the history of the courts pay that much money just to appeal a ruling from a crooked judge…and these windmills, have you seen these windmills, or ‘bird graveyards’, as I like to call them…”. I’m sure he’s saying it already, this is why these civil and criminal court cases matter. What he says, what Fox news says, what the spineless sycophants in the GOP say, none of it matters. Only what the judge the juries and the law says matters. I do want to know if there is any come back for him here, legally speaking. Is there a reasonable path to Trump not paying the bond and not having his stuff seized while he appeals? What I’m reading says no, but IANAL and random internet opinions do not the law make. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2498 "2024-02-26T16:08:10Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Trump really is trying to run out the clock. I’m curious if he thinks this started the 30 days over? What’s the strategy for filing the appeal without the money? If he doesn’t put the money down and doesn’t appeal the case, it’s going to look like he didn’t have it (not that that’s not a fair assumption), but if you don’t have the money, why file the appeal and if you have the money, why not do it all at once? ETA, the only thing I can think of is that he does have the money, but wants to keep it in his personal bank accounts accruing interest (or the bond holders account so it’s not accruing interest) with the intention of getting the rest of the paperwork filed and transferring the money at the last minute. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2499 "2024-02-26T16:09:40Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > I’m curious if he thinks this started the 30 days over? What’s the strategy for filing the appeal without the money? If he doesn’t put the money down and doesn’t appeal the case, it’s going to look like he didn’t have it (not that that’s not a fair assumption), but if you don’t have the money, why file the appeal and if you have the money, why not do it all at once? Same here. I will always choose the “he’s not very bright and doesn’t have good lawyers” option over “he’s playing 12 dimensional chess while everyone else is playing checkers” option. As he is in fact not very bright and has awful lawyers, but still… ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2500 "2024-02-26T16:10:25Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > but if you don’t have the money, why file the appeal Filing the appeal has PR value (especially in a campaign). Also, it’s unlikely they will seize _all_ the money before the appeal is over. (he doesn’t have $500M net worth). Plus, I guess they’d have to give it back if he won the appeal. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2024, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/2501 "2024-02-26T16:11:03Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > What’s the strategy for filing the appeal without the money? I believe it’s the “toss everything at the problem and hope you get extremely lucky” legal strategy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=124) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=126)