# NY AG Letitia James drops the (civil) hammer {On Trump & Family} \[9/21/2022\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [September 21, 2022, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991 "2022-09-21T16:13:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 177
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2024, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3522 "2024-05-06T16:31:12Z")
On Friday the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) charged the auditing firm for Trump’s social media company and its owner with “massive fraud.” The SEC called BF Borgers a “sham audit mill” and said it “deliberately systemically failed to conduct” audits and reviews that were filed with the SEC between January 2021 and June 2023. Those reports are supposed to inform investors about the value of companies. The SEC fined the company $14 million and banned it from practicing accounting. Its owner, Benjamin Borgers, did not admit wrongdoing but accepted the judgment. Hammers are falling… ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2024, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3523 "2024-05-07T16:59:12Z")
From what little I’ve read, that firm has had other issues in the past, so it’s not as if they’re new to criming. ---
**Author:** ![Toxgoddess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Toxgoddess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toxgoddess)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2024, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3524 "2024-05-07T20:25:01Z")
They’re just not very good at it. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2024, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3525 "2024-09-26T16:08:09Z")
the appeal is being televised! team trump is up now. the appeals court could: up hold the judgement reduce the judgement toss the judgement cnn is showing the appeal argument. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2024, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3526 "2024-09-26T16:10:58Z")
I read yesterday that it will take about a month for the verdict (so before the election) but it can be appealed beyond that and then again to SCOTUS. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2024, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3527 "2024-09-26T16:22:17Z")
oh my, team trump just said mar-a-lago has been used by trump as a private residence from 1995. this was in response to a question about valuation and restrictions. interesting, i remember that mr trump lives there as an employee, not as a private residence. team ny up now. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2024, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3528 "2024-09-26T16:24:43Z")
> [@rocking\_chair](#): > > oh my, team trump just said mar-a-lago has been used by trump as a private residence from 1995. this was in response to a question about valuation and restrictions. > > interesting, i remember that mr trump lives there as an employee, not as a private residence. I’d say that this should come back to bite him, but I’m not holding my breath. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2024, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3529 "2024-09-26T16:29:07Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > I read yesterday that it will take about a month for the verdict (so before the election) but it can be appealed beyond that and then again to SCOTUS. Time from argument to issuing the decision varies widely from case to case. If “about a month” is average for this court (I have no idea) then before the election is not a sure thing. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2024, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3530 "2024-09-26T16:30:47Z")
very, very, new york accents flying in court. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2024, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3531 "2024-09-26T16:34:13Z")
The article indicated that it would be before the election but in any case the next appeal would push it past the election. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2024, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3532 "2024-09-26T16:34:40Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I’d say that this should come back to bite him, but I’m not holding my breath. From what I recall, the whole thing about him being an employee was a legal maneuver to allow Palm Beach to let him live there. > **[Trump Can Legally Live At Mar-A-Lago, Palm Beach Says](https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2021/05/07/trump-can-legally-live-at-mar-a-lago-palm-beach-says/)** > > Whether the ex-president can reside at the club had been a subject of debate thanks to a 1990s-era agreement. > “lf [Trump] is a bona fide employee of the Club, absent a specific restriction prohibiting former President Trump from residing at the Club, it appears the Zoning Code permits him to reside at the Club,” Randolph wrote in the February [memo](https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/20469997-jcr_memo_re_mar-a-lago). He’s already in a spat with them about it so I don’t know if it’ll make things worse than they already are. > **[Palm Beach to review legal options, including closing club, over Mar-a-Lago...](https://www.palmbeachpost.com/story/news/local/westpb/2024/08/14/could-palm-beach-close-trumps-mar-a-lago-club-florida-over-road-shutdown/74795178007/)** > > Palm Beach directed staff to see what can be done in response to the closure as season nears, traffic increases, raising safety concerns. Then again, maybe this will give them the basis to shut it down. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2024, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3533 "2024-09-26T17:44:20Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > The article indicated that it would be before the election but in any case the next appeal would push it past the election. I don’t doubt that. I just doubt _their_ confidence. Here’s what CNN is saying in their article today: > No decision is expected before the election, and the appeals court ruling can still be appealed to New York’s highest appellate court. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2024, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3534 "2024-09-27T08:26:51Z")
> [@rocking\_chair](#): > > the appeal is being televised! team trump is up now. > > the appeals court could: > > up hold the judgement > reduce the judgement > toss the judgement > > cnn is showing the appeal argument. From what I’m reading right now, the appeals court judges are expressing “skepticism” about the amount of the judgment and are likely to greatly reduce it, with some possibility it might be thrown out altogether. At least one judge suggested that the banks were sophisticated entities that had a responsibility to do their due diligence, which sounds like a really bizarre argument to me – AFAICT the judge seemed to be saying that if Trump tried to defraud the banks, the banks should have figured that out, and therefore Trump is innocent. 🙄 If this goes the way it seems to be going, then truly Trump was born with a lucky horseshoe up his ass, with everything always falling his way and no consequences for anything. [https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-ask-new-york-appeals-court-toss-nearly-500-mln-civil-fraud-judgment-2024-09-26/](https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-ask-new-york-appeals-court-toss-nearly-500-mln-civil-fraud-judgment-2024-09-26/) ---
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2024, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3535 "2024-09-27T23:26:21Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > At least one judge suggested that the banks were sophisticated entities that had a responsibility to do their due diligence, which sounds like a really bizarre argument to me – AFAICT the judge seemed to be saying that if Trump tried to defraud the banks, the banks should have figured that out, and therefore Trump is innocent. 🙄 “Well, the bank should have _known_ it was going to be robbed, so they should have taken better steps to make sure nobody could get their money. That poor robber was just doing his job. Case dismissed!” JFC. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2025, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3536 "2025-01-15T10:06:02Z")
In all the talk about Trump’s legal cases being disappeared, I was wondering about this one. I see the last mention about it in the news was right after the election when Trump’s team tried to get James to drop the case in order to unify the country. Yeah, that tracks. > [@](#): > > “In the aftermath of his historic election victory, President Trump has called for our Nation’s partisan strife to end, and for the contending factions to join forces for the greater good of the country,” Sauer wrote. “This call for unity extends to the legal onslaught against him and his family that permeated the most recent election cycle.” > > Sauer’s letter previews that if James does not agree to wipe the [massive judgment](https://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/4901615-trump-ny-fraud-case-judgment-appeal/) and dismiss all claims, Trump’s team [may argue](https://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/4841271-ny-state-lawyers-defend-fraud-judgment/) that the case unconstitutionally interferes with his duties as president. It looks like she has refused so far but how long is that going to last? She’s got to know that she has no chance of collecting a penny of that judgement. [Donald Trump’s legal team pressures NY AG Letitia James to drop fraud case](https://thehill.com/regulation/court-battles/5011884-donald-trump-letitia-james-civil-fraud-case-post-election-victory/) ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Winston\_OBoogie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.winston_oboogie/32/2945_2.png) [@Dr.Winston\_OBoogie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Winston_OBoogie)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2025, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3537 "2025-01-15T17:59:46Z")
been too long since I’ve thought about these judgements… Didn’t they at least get some of the money on bonds from a shady guy in Georgia? So, they at least have something. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2025, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3538 "2025-01-15T22:27:33Z")
> [@Dr.Winston\_OBoogie](#): > > Didn’t they at least get some of the money on bonds from a shady guy in Georgia? The shady guy is from L.A. and there were lots of doubts about the legitimacy of his company. I have no doubt that _if Trump’s appeal ever happens and he loses_, the state of NY would have a hard time getting to the money. I don’t think that will happen, though. Trump will threaten the state of NY and get out of this, too. Fear rules the day now. [Trump’s $175 million bond can stand after attorneys agree to comply with new conditions - CBS News](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-trump-bond-knight-insurance-new-conditions/) ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2025, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3539 "2025-08-21T15:59:55Z")
Never bet _against_ Trump’s uncanny ability to avoid consequences (at least, for now): > **[Trump half-billion-dollar civil fraud penalty thrown out by appeals court](https://www.cnbc.com/2025/08/21/trump-fraud-new-york-appeals.html)** > > The fraud lawsuit against President Donald Trump and others, which led to the penalty, was filed by New York State Attorney General Letitia James. > **Key Points** > > - **A New York state appeals court voided a more than $500 million civil fraud penalty imposed on President Donald Trump.** > > - **The appeals court said “injunctive relief” ordered by the trial judge in the case was “well crafted to curb defendants’ business culture” at the Trump Organization.** > > - **But the order that “directs that defendants pay nearly half a billion dollars to the State of New York, is an excessive fine that violates the Eighth Amendment of the United States Constitution,” the appeals court said.** ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2025, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3540 "2025-08-21T17:44:05Z")
When your business culture is corrupt as all hell, isn’t it important to curb it? Color me not shocked. I wonder what an acceptable fine would be to the appeals court. ---
**Author:** ![xizor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xizor/32/102_2.png) [@xizor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xizor)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2025, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/3541 "2025-08-22T21:09:10Z")
If the fine was excessive, then why not just reduce it? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=176) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=178)