# NY AG Letitia James drops the (civil) hammer {On Trump & Family} \[9/21/2022\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [September 21, 2022, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991 "2022-09-21T16:13:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 64
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1262 "2023-11-08T17:02:49Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > One wonders if Ms Vrablic is on the witness list… > Trump’s longtime family banker, former Deutsche Bank Managing Director Rosemary Vrablic, will testify later. The Frankfurt-based lender decided to cut ties with Trump following the deadly riots at the US Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021. [**SOURCE**](https://finance.yahoo.com/news/ex-deutsche-bank-risk-manager-223621727.html) ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1263 "2023-11-08T17:04:47Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Ah, so she’s playing the same card as the rest: “I’m too stupid to remember what my job was or what I did.” " I relied on smarter people to tell me where to put my name on the paperwork. I’m not even sure if these are my own pants I’m wearing right now." ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1264 "2023-11-08T17:07:24Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > “…I’m not even sure if these are my own pants I’m wearing right now.” The “I was just obeying _haute couturiers_” defense? ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1265 "2023-11-08T17:21:58Z")
Ooof…I’m no fan of the trumps. But do you really want their underage kids driven by him in his current condition? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1266 "2023-11-08T17:24:16Z")
I was hoping it would help him with his rehab. ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1267 "2023-11-08T17:27:25Z")
If anything, it might help the Trumplstiltskins develop the empathy their elders never learned. Assuming they lived through the experience. ---
**Author:** ![CoolHandCox](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coolhandcox/32/16233_2.png) [@CoolHandCox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CoolHandCox)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1268 "2023-11-08T17:32:50Z")
I found this exchange funny (per NYT): > After looking over an exhibit on the Old Post Office, Ivanka Trump holds up it up, laughing and says it “brings back a lot of memories.” The attorney general’s lawyer says she made the same statement a year and a half ago. Reminds me of the line from the movie Best in Show: > Buck Laughlin: I don’t think I could ever get used to being poked and prodded like that. I told my proctologist one time, “Why don’t you take me out to dinner and a movie sometime?” > > Trevor Beckwith: Yes, I remember you said that last year. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1269 "2023-11-08T18:13:28Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > They’ve really latched onto the whole “I’m not hear to listen to what he has to say” thing. Can you fill me in on this one? I don’t remember seeing it anywhere. (And for the record, I am not now, nor have ever been, a member of Trump Org.) ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1270 "2023-11-08T18:20:28Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Can you fill me in on this one? I don’t remember seeing it anywhere. Trump was giving a political speech. Engoron was like “oh my god, control your client.” The lawyers were all, “um, don’t you want to hear what he has to say?” Engoron then said something to the effect of, “I’m not here to listen to what he has to say. I’m here to listen to him _answer questions._” ---
**Author:** ![Tride](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tride/32/13907_2.png) [@Tride](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tride)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1271 "2023-11-08T18:22:10Z")
When trump was bloviating in the morning and Engoron was trying to get Kise to control him, he or Habba told the judge he should just listen to what Trump wants to say. Engoron told them in so many words he wasn’t interested in listening to Trump’s speeches–he wanted him to answer the damn question. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1272 "2023-11-08T18:29:03Z")
I have to wonder. The individuals named in the NY AGs action are Donald, Don, Jr., Eric. Also making a cameo is Ivanka, but as a witness – not a defendant. The (only) other named Defendants are Allen Weisselberg and Jeffrey McConney. What if this is as simple as the Trumps pinky-swearing to throw Weisselberg and McConney under the bus. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1273 "2023-11-08T18:30:49Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > What if this is as simple as the Trumps pinky-swearing to throw Weisselberg and McConney under the bus. Not sure it matters even if it did shake out that way. It’s still the corporation that’s liable. But they haven’t been throwing those two under the bus. Their whole defense, such as it is, is resting on “the accountants knew what they were doing because we said we were liars.” ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1274 "2023-11-08T18:42:56Z")
Yes, that’s the sub-text of DJT’s speechifying about his perfect disclaimers: « No-one should have believed anything in our documents. Buncha suckers! » ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1275 "2023-11-08T18:44:50Z")
I certainly get that point, but has either Weisselberg or McConney taken the stand in this case yet? Though the Trump’s have yet to point the fingers _directly_ at anybody, knowing that they knew who was testifying when, they may have simply decided that appearances matter, and that the last two – the Trump Org money guys – would be left holding the bag … As long as no Trump broke ranks. It would be indirect, not direct, but … And I also understand that the penalties still inure to the Corporation, but I wonder if the Trumps are in “avoid criminal prosecution” mode. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1276 "2023-11-08T18:47:01Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > Their whole defense, such as it is, is resting on “the accountants knew what they were doing because we said we were liars.” And also “Who is that person sitting near the judge? Let’s throw shit at her to try to get a mistrial” ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1277 "2023-11-08T18:57:31Z")
Um. We may have a “Ruh-roh.” > [@](#): > > Donald Trump’s oldest daughter took the stand to testify about the Trump Organization’s business practices. Ivanka Trump was presented with an email conversation she had with one of the company’s lawyers. > > The lawyer, Jason Greenblatt, was worried about a 2012 deal with Deutsche Bank for the purchase of the Doral golf club in Miami, which required Donald Trump to maintain a minimum net worth of $3 billion. This requirement “would seem to me to be a problem?” he asked Ivanka. > > Ivanka replied this was something they “have known from day one. We wanted to get a great rate and the only way to get the proceeds/term and principle where we want them is to guarantee the deal.” So … sure, we’re lying, but we want to make more money, so it’s okay. Hm. She doesn’t seem to address directly the “problem” that Greenblatt’s asking about. > **[This Ivanka Trump Email Could Undo Her Family’s Entire Defense](https://news.yahoo.com/ivanka-trump-email-could-undo-173105901.html)** > > Ivanka Trump took the stand in the New York fraud trial—and was reminded about an old email she sent. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1278 "2023-11-08T19:03:31Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > And I also understand that the penalties still inure to the Corporation, but I wonder if the Trumps are in “avoid criminal prosecution” mode. They most certainly are which is why they gave a lot of “I don’t remember” or “that was someone else” answers. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1279 "2023-11-08T19:05:43Z")
I just have to wonder how far the Money Guys would get if they try to use the exact same technique of radically distancing themselves from all the bogus numbers. It isn’t plausible to me that the Trumps didn’t _all_ have direct knowledge of every single bit of this, but ISTM that they have a non-zero chance of convincing somebody of that, while the Money Guys … do not. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1280 "2023-11-08T19:14:08Z")
weisselberg has taken the stand. not sure about mcconney… quick check, and it turns out he did. mcconney had emails going to and fro with eric trump. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2023, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1281 "2023-11-08T19:15:58Z")
Thanks for that. I’m still not dissuaded from that basic idea: the Trumps have a much better shot at plausible deniability than the money guys do. They may not be able to save their holdings, but damage control may indicate that they put everything they’ve got toward reducing the likelihood that Alvin Bragg files criminal charges against a Trump. This might just be criminal musical chairs in action. Y’know … maybe 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=63) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=65)