# NY AG Letitia James drops the (civil) hammer {On Trump & Family} \[9/21/2022\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [September 21, 2022, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991 "2022-09-21T16:13:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 80
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1582 "2023-11-23T15:22:43Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Is that an example of American exceptionalism? Or simple universal human nature? In all seriousness I suspect that it’s a combination of US population size (ten times the population of Canada) plus social media allowing anybody, no matter how off the rails, to build up a critical mass that matters. Pre-social media there may have been the same wack-jobs but they couldn’t find each other as easily. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1583 "2023-11-23T15:23:01Z")
Counsel for the Attorney General may have demonstrated why, in fact, Mr McConney had tears in his eyes; there are indications Mr McConney may have committed perjury. In examination in chief, here’s how he said that the financial statements were approved: > [@](#): > > The spreadsheet czar had testified on direct examination Monday that he would review each year’s draft net-worth statement with Weisselberg, who would then give the approved draft to the outside accounting firm, Mazars USA, which would print the final statement. In other words, a completely Trump-free process. No Donalds or Erics were harmed in the creation of these statements. Well yes, but then that pesky counsel for the AG NY started asking questions in cross-examination. He put a document to Mr McConney. It’s an initial draft of a financial statement, and in blue-ink, it’s got this notation: “DJT to get final review”. He asked Mr McConney if he knew who wrote that little note; Mr McConney admitted that he did. > [@](#): > > “Donald Trump would get final review?” Andrew Amer, the state’s lawyer, asked McConney. > > “That was my understanding, yes,” McConney answered from the witness stand, his voice gruff. > … > This chain of command — McConney to Weisselberg to Mazars — leaves out one very important link, as the state’s lawyer, Amer, pointed out on cross on Tuesday. > > “I believe there was a step in between that involved Donald Trump prior to 2017?” Amer said to McConney, who appeared uncomfortable on the stand as he said Trump indeed did the ultimate signing off. But wait, there’s more! Further down on the document, there’s more hand-written blue notes: > [@](#): > > But McConney’s blue-ink handwriting is all over the net-worth statement drafts, showing he revised language and even added cautionary notes that were then passed along for Trump’s “final review,” as McConney said in his own description of the drafting process. > > In one key cautionary note from the 2015 draft, McConney made a notation in ink that “this computation also includes forecasted deals that have not signed yet.” In the note, McConney asked whether Trump wanted to exclude some $151 million in as-yet-fictional assets from the net-worth statement. > > The final version of [that year’s net-worth statement](https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/23942284-nyag-v-trump-sofc-2015-210922) shows McConney’s suggestion was ignored, possibly by Trump himself. The AG alleges that Trump routinely padded out his net-worth statements with the same sorts of nonexistent assets. So, his own internal accountant flagged that the draft included $151 million dollars in assets that did not yet exist, and asked if those non-existent assets should be included. They were. Who decided to overrule Trump Org’s own accountant, I wonder? Full story here: > **[Donald Trump has worst day yet in NY civil fraud trial as underling's...](https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-worst-day-ny-fraud-trial-thanks-to-defense-witness-2023-11?international=true&%3Br=US&%3BIR=T)** > > In testimony Tuesday, Jeffrey McConney linked Trump directly to the fuzzy math. Oh, and one other point: in his deposition, _this very document_ was put to Trump, and he was asked if he recognised the handwriting on the notes. Trump said “No”. “Blue-ink guy? Never heard of him.” ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1584 "2023-11-23T15:43:02Z")
It’s the strategy of “we all blame someone else, and then everyone goes free because they can’t prove who did it.” ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1585 "2023-11-23T16:00:59Z")
And in a criminal trial, that might work to bring in reasonable doubt - but in this case, it just further proves that they were ALL engaged in a conspiracy of fraud. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1586 "2023-11-23T16:55:00Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Is that an example of American exceptionalism? Or simple universal human nature? Whether such ideas exist is human nature. Whether they take root in the political system is another matter. I’ve argued in previous threads that in other systems, notably parliamentary systems with strong parties, it’s much more difficult for there to be a “hostile takeover” of a party, the way Trump has done. Won’t say anything more here to avoid hijacking the thread, but wanted to reply to your question. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1587 "2023-11-23T17:35:35Z")
> [@](#): > > In one key cautionary note from the 2015 draft, McConney made a notation in ink that “this computation also includes forecasted deals that have not signed yet.” In the note, McConney asked whether Trump wanted to exclude some $151 million in as-yet-fictional assets from the net-worth statement. McConney made a notation on the draft report asking Trump if he wanted to keep these assets in the final version. It sounds as if they were kept, which certainly seems to implicate Trump. I wonder if it’s known who put those assets in the draft before it got to McConney. Not that it would excuse Trump, but in the process of preparing their case I wonder if the prosecution knows who prepared the draft, or if it matters. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1588 "2023-11-23T18:05:32Z")
“Not Me was indicted on 13 counts of fraudulent business practices.” [![](https://childhoodrelived.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/family_circus_notme.gif) ](https://childhoodrelived.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/family_circus_notme.gif) ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1589 "2023-11-23T20:56:40Z")
I’m starting to think he doesn’t understand how holiday greetings work. But maybe shitting on your enemies is how his fans want to celebrate. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1590 "2023-11-23T21:26:41Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Trump posts insults toward the court clerk again. What does it say about Trump and his team that he’s getting his ass handed to him by an “incompetent” Attorney General? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1591 "2023-11-23T21:31:37Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > What does it say about Trump and his team that he’s getting his ass handed to him by an “incompetent” Attorney General Without taking the thread too far afield, he can top that. _“I have the distinct pleasure of running against the worst presidential candidate in the history of presidential politics.”_ –Donald Trump. speaking about Joe Biden Imagine how it feels to get your clock cleaned by that guy 😉 ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1592 "2023-11-23T21:33:59Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > _“I have the distinct pleasure of running against the worst presidential candidate in the history of presidential politics.”_ > > –Donald Trump. speaking about Joe Biden “I know I am but what about you?” Okay, Joe would never say that… ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1593 "2023-11-23T23:02:35Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > … Imagine how it feels to get your clock cleaned by that guy 😉 But he didn’t: he won all 50 states by bigly margins! ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1594 "2023-11-23T23:12:47Z")
> [@OttoDaFe](#): > > But he didn’t: he won all 50 states by bigly margins! Indeed, losing to Biden is part of what made that narrative so crucial. It’s bad enough that the media were saying Trumpie lost, since Trumpie is a #Winner, and winners never lose, but what was far worse was losing to an old fart that Trumpie had maligned as “sleepy”, and an Obama protege, too. The ketchup must have been flying that night! ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1595 "2023-11-23T23:41:54Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > … Xcreting … Thank you. I sincerely hope that this replaces “tweet” for posting on X-formerly-known-as-Twitter. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2023, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1596 "2023-11-27T23:27:41Z")
FWIW, I just heard [**Neil Katyal**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neal_Katyal) ‘predict’ (on MSNBC) that the Gag Order – even if shaved down a bit – will stand. Which … would be A Very Good ThingTM. Also, Eric and TFG coming back to the stand in a week and two weeks (do I have that right), respectively. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2023, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1597 "2023-11-27T23:39:25Z")
Was this posted yet? > **[Office of judge presiding over Trump’s New York trial bombarded with threats](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/nov/22/new-york-trump-trial-judge-arthur-engoron-clerk-death-threat)** > > Judge Arthur Engoron and his clerk have also received antisemitic abuse since a gag order imposed on the ex-president was lifted > Transcribed voicemail messages, disclosed in [court filings](https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/nyscef/ViewDocument?docIndex=inVGdvHSdXKWMxr30v8AXw==), revealed the extent of the abuse directed at the pair. Alongside racist and sexist attacks the messages contain several death threats. “I mean, honestly, you should be assassinated,” said one. “You should be killed. You should be not assassin executed [sic]. You should be executed.” > > Another said: “Resign now, you dirty, treasonous piece of trash snake. We are going to get you and anyone of you dirty, backstabbing, lying, cheating American. You are nothing but a bunch of communists. We are coming to remove you permanently.” ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2023, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1598 "2023-11-27T23:39:28Z")
Love katyal. I’m sure team New York will be happy to cross examine him again. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2023, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1599 "2023-11-27T23:45:22Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > Was this posted yet? Yes it was. > [@NY AG Letitia James drops the (civil) hammer {On Trump & Family} \[9/21/2022\]](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1567): > > So … that whole stochastic terrorism thing seems to be coming along rather nicely: We’re handily past ‘sickening’ at this point. I wonder where we go next. ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2023, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1600 "2023-11-27T23:57:28Z")
The Trump fan I shared Thanksgiving with served in the Navy and his father was an actual WWII hero. This is a man in his 70’s. When I mentioned that Trump was threatening judges, his response was basically, Oh so what, judges get threatened all the time. I am so dumbfounded by this response. I just don’t know what to make of it. I feel like I’m losing faith in humanity. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2023, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991/1601 "2023-11-27T23:59:54Z")
I’m sure judges do get threatened frequently. And just as frequently, the result is for the threatener to be found in contempt of court and jailed. I’m OK with this precedent. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=79) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-ag-letitia-james-drops-the-civil-hammer-on-trump-family-9-21-2022/971991.md?page=81)