# NY Post's Clinton headline **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 30, 2014, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021 "2014-09-30T21:58:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/41 "2014-10-01T18:26:39Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > [What a good thing we have video](http://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2013/12/30/pure-class-msnbc-panel-mocks-romney-familys-black-adopted-child-n1770040), and don’t need to rely on memories: They weren’t mocking the baby for being born brown, you idiot. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/42 "2014-10-01T18:34:06Z")
Found the link, at least he did that, and from a strictly unbiased and non-partisan site. Well, sorta kinda. Couldn’t seem to find this, or perhaps didn’t look… > **[Melissa Harris-Perry: 'I AM SORRY'](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/melissa-harris-perry-apology-romney-grandchild_n_4523545)** > > Melissa Harris-Perry: 'I AM SORRY' \*\* Melissa Harris-Perry: ‘I Am Sorry’ For Romney Grandchild Comments\*\* > [@](#): > > Melissa Harris-Perry apologized Tuesday for a controversial segment on her show about Mitt Romney’s adopted grandson, Kieran, who is black… ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/43 "2014-10-01T18:56:40Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > _Tu quoque_ is a logical fallacy when it is used as an ad hominem attack. > > It’s not a logical fallacy in the following hypothetical conversation: > > ANDREW: Americans are so much more rude at sporting events than Brits. > > REGGIE: That’s not true. Both countries produce rude people in generally equal proportion. > > ANDREW: Oh, yeah? Well, it was at an American sporting event that a fan chucked a full can of beer at an Iowa State University cheerleader’s head because he favored the rival team. > > REGGIE: Yes, and British soccer hooligans have been arrested overseas for much more serious acts of violence! > > ANDREW: Tu quoque! Tu quoque! > > Andrew is wrong. At the risk of sounding pedantic, do you see why? > > Answer: because the subject under discussion is precisely the presence of misbehavior by both Americans and Brits. It’s absolutely relevant, and not remotely an ad hominem attack, to point out instances of misbehavior by Brits to counter the argument that such misbehavior is only, or largely, confined to one side. Thank you. BTW, I was serious when I said: > [@kaylasdad99](#): > > I often look to you for enlightenment wrt some of the more esoteric concepts I encounter here on the Dope, btw. Could you indulge me with an explanation of the correct meaning of _tu quoque_? ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/44 "2014-10-01T19:10:05Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Found the link, at least he did that, and from a strictly unbiased and non-partisan site. Well, sorta kinda. > > Couldn’t seem to find this, or perhaps didn’t look… > > [Melissa Harris-Perry: 'I Am Sorry' For Romney Grandchild Comments | HuffPost Latest News](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/31/melissa-harris-perry-apology-romney-grandchild_n_4523545.html) > \*\* > Melissa Harris-Perry: ‘I Am Sorry’ For Romney Grandchild Comments\*\* …and the Boston Globe apologized - kind of - for the watermelon joke. Wait - what thread is this? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/45 "2014-10-01T19:10:07Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > They weren’t mocking the baby for being born brown, you idiot. :smack: What do you think they were mocking the child for, then, and for what reason did one of the panelists feel moved to apologize? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/46 "2014-10-01T19:15:27Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Really? > > When have I ever rested any argument on something like that? > > _Tu quoque_ is a logical fallacy when it is used as an ad hominem attack. > > It’s not a logical fallacy in the following hypothetical conversation: > > ANDREW: Americans are so much more rude at sporting events than Brits. > > REGGIE: That’s not true. Both countries produce rude people in generally equal proportion. > > ANDREW: Oh, yeah? Well, it was at an American sporting event that a fan chucked a full can of beer at an Iowa State University cheerleader’s head because he favored the rival team. > > REGGIE: Yes, and British soccer hooligans have been arrested overseas for much more serious acts of violence! > > ANDREW: Tu quoque! Tu quoque! > > Andrew is wrong. At the risk of sounding pedantic, do you see why? > > Answer: because the subject under discussion is precisely the presence of misbehavior by both Americans and Brits. It’s absolutely relevant, and not remotely an ad hominem attack, to point out instances of misbehavior by Brits to counter the argument that such misbehavior is only, or largely, confined to one side. It is however, not a sound argument, when the things aren’t remotely the same. Like MSNBC making fun of the GOP’s lily-whiteness, isn’t the same thing as the general conservative douchebaggery that happens daily. Your misuse of “youuu dooo it tooooooo!!11” isn’t because you’re not doing it as a personal attack. It’s because you generally flail around and grab anything that looks, to your beady little ideological eyes, as vaguely similar. When, in fact, it is often not. Your sniveling victim mentality is what drives this. We’re all against you, boo hoo. No we’re against stupid arguments in support of shitty policy. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/47 "2014-10-01T19:16:48Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > What do you think they were mocking the child for, then, and for what reason did one of the panelists feel moved to apologize? They were mocking how lily white the GOP is. She apologized because it was unseemly for a journalist. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/48 "2014-10-01T19:18:22Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > What do you think they were mocking the child for, then, and for what reason did one of the panelists feel moved to apologize? They felt the need to apologize for how their words were taken, but it was rather obvious that they were comparing the rarity of the color of the baby in the family to rarity of the same color in the party. It was more a mocking of the party by using the baby as an example. edited to add: Whether your point is valid or not, are you sticking with your “They do it tooooo, so it’s o.k. if weeee do it!” excuse? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/49 "2014-10-01T19:30:08Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > They felt the need to apologize for how their words were taken, but it was rather obvious that they were comparing the rarity of the color of the baby in the family to rarity of the same color in the party. It was more a mocking of the party by using the baby as an example. > > edited to add: Whether your point is valid or not, are you sticking with your “They do it tooooo, so it’s o.k. if weeee do it!” excuse? That was never my point. I don’t agree it’s OK for anyone to do it. You’ll search in vain for a single post of mine that expresses the sentiment, “They do it tooooo, so it’s o.k. if weeee do it!” Which post of mine were you paraphrasing with that line, by the way? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/50 "2014-10-01T19:33:43Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > She apologized because it was unseemly for a journalist. Then presumably she should have been apologizing to the general public, or MSNBC. She apologized [to the Romneys](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/31/melissa-harris-perry-apology-romney-grandchild_n_4523545.html). ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/51 "2014-10-01T19:36:09Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > That was never my point. I don’t agree it’s OK for anyone to do it. You’ll search in vain for a single post of mine that expresses the sentiment, “They do it tooooo, so it’s o.k. if weeee do it!” > > Which post of mine were you paraphrasing with that line, by the way? Post #14, where you brought forth the (so far) imaginary “Sarah Palin Faked Her Pregnancy!” headline as a counterexample of the other side supposedly doing the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/52 "2014-10-01T19:53:36Z")
Speaking as a bleeding heart NYC liberal, I thought it was a pretty classic Post headline. The do _so_ love a pun at The Post, godbless their blackened, shriveled little hearts. It was no “Headless Body in Topless Bar” or my more recent fave “Cloak and Shag Her” (“CIA Boss Petreus quits over affair”) but it wasn’t far from clever. Never change Post, never change. ---
**Author:** ![Randolph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Randolph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Randolph)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/53 "2014-10-01T19:56:31Z")
Some comedian had a line like, “The New York Post is what you get if someone half-reads a real newspaper and then texts you the gist.” ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/54 "2014-10-01T20:05:25Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Then presumably she should have been apologizing to the general public, or MSNBC. She apologized [to the Romneys](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/31/melissa-harris-perry-apology-romney-grandchild_n_4523545.html). I don’t think that’s true. If I make a joke about your family, I’d apologize to you. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/55 "2014-10-01T22:21:52Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Post #14, where you brought forth the (so far) imaginary “Sarah Palin Faked Her Pregnancy!” headline as a counterexample of the other side supposedly doing the same thing. There were a number of links posted citing the reality. It certainly was not imaginary. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/56 "2014-10-01T22:23:18Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > I don’t think that’s true. If I make a joke about your family, I’d apologize to you. I thought the problem was that it was “unseemly for a journalist.” Hard to keep the lies straight? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/57 "2014-10-01T22:49:19Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > There were a number of links posted citing the reality. It certainly was not imaginary. It was certainly not a headline. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/58 "2014-10-01T22:50:50Z")
This is just the New York Post being the New York Post. I don’t see any reason to be upset with it. And it’s not mocking the baby. It’s mocking the Clintons. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/59 "2014-10-01T23:52:16Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I thought the problem was that it was “unseemly for a journalist.” > > Hard to keep the lies straight? It was unseemly for a journalist to make the joke you stupid cumpig. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2014, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021/60 "2014-10-01T23:54:45Z")
> [@andros](#): > > It was certainly not a headline. That’s true. And it used different letters, and it was published at a different time on a different day. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ny-posts-clinton-headline/700021.md?page=4)