# NYTimes obtains partial 1995 Trump tax records **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 2, 2016, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444 "2016-10-02T01:56:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/121 "2016-10-02T22:01:27Z")
I don’t think a hunch from Talking Points Memo is an example of things getting better and better. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/122 "2016-10-02T22:01:50Z")
There are so many meaningful targets for Trump. Why dilute them with garbage? He’s been audited and continues to be. The IRS is aware of what has been written off and what has not been and of what the laws are. If he broke tax laws then they’d gotten him on it by now much more than likely. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/123 "2016-10-02T22:08:14Z")
I am a bit concerned that the New York times got an 80 year old CPA to get himself into trouble by speaking about Trump’s taxes though. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/124 "2016-10-02T22:13:04Z")
> [@Corry\_El](#): > > Trump has said just about everything on all sides of all kinds of issues. He’s also said certain rich people ('carried interest treatment) ‘get away with murder’ on taxes which sounds more like the liberal he presented himself as for most of his public adult life. The quip making the rounds is, _the last time Trump paid taxes, he was a Democrat._ ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/125 "2016-10-02T22:14:06Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > The quip making the rounds is, _the last time Trump paid taxes, he was a Democrat._ And on his first wife. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/126 "2016-10-02T22:15:15Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > So you think he hasn’t made a total of more than $916 million in the last 20 years? But oh yeah, according to Trump he’s worth over $4 billion now. So by his own estimate he should have paid tax on $3 billion income (at least) over the last 20 years. Yes I know it’s not that simple but it’s absurd to think that he still has a net loss from 1995 if he’s worth even half of what he says he is. Let me explain, you can have net worth on paper that isn’t taxed because you haven’t made a transaction that requires taxation. For example I buy a share of Microsoft for $5. In 10 years it grows to $100. Do I pay taxes on my new net worth? No. There is not a general wealth tax. If I sell the asset I now may have to pay taxes on the gain. So in Trump’s case the majority of his net worth may not be from income. It may be from appreciation of assets. If what Trump is doing is legal, not that that matters for the political class, than he is smart for using a loss for his benefit. Anyone on this forum who had enough money, which given the superior intellect of those who post here I am surprised it’s not everyone, would do the same. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/127 "2016-10-02T22:18:01Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > More funny ironic Trump tweets: > > “Mitt Romney,who totally blew an election that should have been won and whose tax returns made him look like a fool, is now playing tough guy.” (Replace “Mitt Romney” with “Donald Trump”) > > “To the geniuses at ‘Americans United for Change’: the more you tax me the less people I employ. Get it?” (his improper use of fewer vs. less is disqualifying, as far as I’m concerned. But, you didn’t pay any income tax, so why are you complaining, exactly?) > > “In this time of economic turmoil where millions of Americans are unemployed, our tax dollars are paying @BillMoyers’ big @PBS salary!” (Who is “our”? You didn’t pay a dime.) > > “The hedge fund guys (gals) have to pay higher taxes ASAP. They are paying practically nothing. We must reduce taxes for the middle class!” (They’re stupid for paying “practically” nothing, and I’m smart for paying “actually” nothing!) In total taxes, Trump probably pays a few orders of magnitude more than you. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/128 "2016-10-02T22:20:07Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > If what Trump is doing is legal, not that that matters for the political class, than he is smart for using a loss for his benefit. Anyone on this forum who had enough money, which given the superior intellect of those who post here I am surprised it’s not everyone, would do the same. It’s smart if you’re a sociopathic Scrooge McDuck whose goal is to maximize profit at all cost. It’s dumb as shit if you want to be president. Hell, even Romney had the decency to pay some pittance in taxes for the single year that he showed us (though admittedly it had some sort of clawback in it that he has no doubt taken advantage of). ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/129 "2016-10-02T22:21:17Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > In total taxes, Trump probably pays a few orders of magnitude more than you. Cite? There is no evidence that this is true. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/130 "2016-10-02T22:23:45Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Cite? There is no evidence that this is true. Just in sales tax and real estate tax he probably pays more than the average income of a doper. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/131 "2016-10-02T22:23:52Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > I am a bit concerned that the New York times got an 80 year old CPA to get himself into trouble by speaking about Trump’s taxes though. He’s in trouble? He didn’t release the forms. He’s retired. All he did was say it looked legit and explained the font issues on the document. I guess if he was still working his wisest response would have been “no comment” ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/132 "2016-10-02T22:25:18Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Just in sales tax and real estate tax he probably pays more than the average income of a doper. You’ve used the weasel word “probably” twice now. So, no cite then? ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/133 "2016-10-02T22:26:20Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > He’s in trouble? He didn’t release the forms. He’s retired. All he did was say it looked legit and explained the font issues on the document. I guess if he was still working his wisest response would have been “no comment” Not that I’ve seen, but the day ain’t over yet. There has to be some sort of confidentiality clause, no? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/134 "2016-10-02T22:29:54Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > You’ve used the weasel word “probably” twice now. So, no cite then? How can there be a cite when Fiveyearlurker’s tax return isn’t published? You know your tax return though and you know whether or not I am right. You pay how much in taxes? What do you think the property taxes on Trump’s holdings are? He spends a lot of money. You don’t think he pays sales tax? He employs a lot of people. You don’t think he has to pay any payroll taxes? That jet of his uses a lot of fuel. What’s the tax on a gallon of jet fuel? ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/135 "2016-10-02T22:34:11Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > How can there be a cite when Fiveyearlurker’s tax return isn’t published? You know your tax return though and you know whether or not I am right. You pay how much in taxes? What do you think the property taxes on Trump’s holding are? He spends a lot of money. You don’t think he pays sales tax? He employs a lot of people. You don’t think he has to pay any payroll taxes? That jet of his uses a lot of fuel. What’s the tax on a gallon of jet fuel? You don’t need a cite for my numbers. You need a cite for his numbers. And, since he hasn’t released them, you have zero evidence he paid any of these taxes you’ve outlined above that he “probably” paid. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/136 "2016-10-02T22:34:54Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > I am a bit concerned that the New York times got an 80 year old CPA to get himself into trouble by speaking about Trump’s taxes though. How is Jack Mitnick in trouble? For what? He did not _reveal_ any confidential information. He merely confirmed that a document was real and discussed how such a loss could be used afterwards (in a period during which he was not hired by Trump). What law or even official code of conduct does that break? This apparently is the same Mitnick who [testified in court](http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/06/15/new-evidence-donald-trump-didn-t-pay-taxes.html) that somehow his signature was on a 1984 return that neither he nor his firm prepared. > [@](#): > > Mitnick testified that he was “thoroughly familiar” with the Trump tax returns and all aspects of the finances of Trump Tower, which were central to the appeal. > > But when shown a photocopy of Trump’s 1984 tax return, Mitnick testified that “we did not” prepare that return, referring to himself and his firm, and he said did not know who did. However, Mitnick did not dispute that it was his signature on the photocopy. The gist of the article, written back in June, BTW was that “the record shows Trump paid no income tax in 1984.” ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/137 "2016-10-02T22:48:37Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > In total taxes, Trump probably pays a few orders of magnitude more than you. If this is the line you’re taking, maybe you should answer this question: > [@Ravenman](#): > > So when Trump lamented that half of Americans pay no income tax despite “crippling” national debt, was he including himself in that criticism? Or did we just misunderstand his tweet, and these Americans are “smart” for legally not paying income taxes? ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/138 "2016-10-02T22:49:03Z")
[Watch Donald Trump Lecture Americans For Not Paying Taxes](http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/10/donald-trump-taxes-50-percent-Americans-dont-pay) Some quotes… > [@](#): > > Well, I don’t mind sacrificing for the country to be honest with you. But you know, you do have a problem because half of the people don’t pay any tax. And when he’s talking about that he’s talking about people that aren’t also working, that are not contributing to this society. And it’s a problem. But we have 50 percent. It just hit the 50 percent mark. Fifty percent of the people are paying no tax. On Romneys 47% comment… > [@](#): > > He should never apologize. Actually bring on this discussion…It’s a discussion that maybe should be had. You do have a large percentage of people not paying taxes. You do have a large percentage of people that feel they’re entitled. And one more… > [@](#): > > The problem we have right now—we have a society that sits back and says we don’t have to do anything. Eventually, the 50 percent cannot carry—and it’s unfair to them—but cannot carry the other 50 percent. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/139 "2016-10-02T23:19:33Z")
Since he doesn’t pay taxes, should we treat him like a NATO member and remove his Secret Service detail? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2016, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444/140 "2016-10-02T23:37:05Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > If this is the line you’re taking, maybe you should answer this question: The Donald is a blowhard. We all know that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/nytimes-obtains-partial-1995-trump-tax-records/767444.md?page=8)