# Obama and his "czars"... **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 13, 2009, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667 "2009-06-13T16:04:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/41 "2009-06-14T02:32:08Z")
> [@](#): > > When did the executive branch receive the power to bail out private business with taxpayer money without a vote of the people, then take over the private business they bailed out and dictate to them what they would do, how they would do it, how many of their stores could remain open and how much their executives would be allowed to make? Exactly what date did that happen? Because somewhere along the line, I must have missed it. To answer your question, the United States was established as a representative democracy back in 1789 - we delegate our power to our elected representatives in Congress. As others have pointed out, the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act was enacted by Congress last October. Some people may argue about whether that law is constitutional, but the Supreme Court has now had eight months to declare it unconstitutional and has not done so. So all three branches of the government are on board with this and everything has been done in accordance with the Constitution. If you feel that the Constitution itself is wrong, then you’ve moved beyond the realm of this thread and should probably start a new one. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/42 "2009-06-14T03:17:15Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Some people may argue about whether that law is constitutional, but the Supreme Court has now had eight months to declare it unconstitutional and has not done so. Although that being said, the Supreme Court can’t just unilaterally declare a law unconstitutional. It can only rule in response to a case that comes before it. So it’s possible that, should a case dealing with the law come before it, that it might declare it unconstitutional. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/43 "2009-06-14T03:50:45Z")
True. But the Court has literally thousands of cases submitted to it each year. I think it’s a pretty safe bet that some of the cases submitted this year have involved challenges to the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/44 "2009-06-14T05:24:45Z")
But it could be, **Little Nemo** , that no such cases have yet made it through the trial and appellate court processes to the point where certiorari has even been sought, let alone granted, let alone leading to a decision on the constitutionality of the law. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/45 "2009-06-14T09:41:16Z")
I cannot tell you how afraid I am to click on any “She’s alive” Zsa Zsa link. **squeekster** , would you be less frightened if the name “czar” were changed to something else such as “supervisor” or “chairman”? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/46 "2009-06-14T15:08:56Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > **squeekster** , would you be less frightened if the name “czar” were changed to something else such as “supervisor” or “chairman”? Nah, it doesn’t have the same ring to it. I know ! How about “Dark Lord” ? “Today on CNN : President Obama announces the appointment of his Dark Lord of Energy Policy.” ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/47 "2009-06-14T15:24:20Z")
> [@squeekster](#): > > What say all of you? Well, speaking only for myself, I say “They are wrong. There IS such a thing as a dumb question.” ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2009, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/48 "2009-06-14T15:36:26Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > “Today on CNN : President Obama announces the appointment of his Dark Lord of Energy Policy.” An increased use of lightning being shot out of our hands WOULD reduce America’s dependence on foreign oil. ---
**Author:** ![gustp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/fbc32d/32.png) [@gustp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gustp)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2009, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/49 "2009-06-15T19:26:07Z")
> [@squeekster](#): > > Can anyone list one good reason why Obama feels the need to appoint so many different “Czars”? These “Czars” don’t have to answer to _ANYONE_ but him. Not the Congress. Not the Senate. Certainly not the PEOPLE. These select few can tell people how much they can earn, what car they will drive…the list goes on. And what they decree can not be appealed in any way. > > For the life of me, I can only think of one reason for these positions. **UNHINDERED CONTROL AT THE HANDS OF A DICTATOR**. > > What say all of you? The president of the United States can run the Executive branch of the government however he sees if. If he appoints a “Czar” to do a job or fill a function that is outside of the constitutional role of the Chief executive, then the supreme court is there to stop it. Have you never noticed that all the departmental heads are not elected but appointed ny the president. In Canada all the ministers of the crown are elected members of parliment even though it’s not a requirement. It’s just politically dangerous to appoint an unelected person to the position. So they are calling these people Czars. In Canada the top people in the public service are called “Mandarans”. They have great power but ultimately are under the athority of the Minister of whatever department they are attached to. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2009, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/50 "2009-06-15T19:36:26Z")
> [@gustp](#): > > In Canada all the ministers of the crown are elected members of parliment even though it’s not a requirement. It’s just politically dangerous to appoint an unelected person to the position. Some cabinet members are from the Senate. Most visibly, there’s Marjory LeBreton (Leader of the Government in the Senate) and probably some others which I’ll look into when I get home. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2009, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/51 "2009-06-15T20:45:02Z")
> [@Uosdwis\_R.Dewoh](#): > > I suggest Zsa Zsa Gabor to become Czar Czar. She’ll be known as Czar Czar Zsa Zsa Gabor. What about her sister Czar Czar, Czar Czar Brie-Anne? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2009, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/52 "2009-06-15T20:48:55Z")
On further examination, Marjory LeBreton is currently the only Senator in the Canadian cabinet. In 2006, though, Michael Fortier was appointed Minister of Public Works and Government Services at a time when he was neither an MP nor a Senator. He was hastily appointed to the Senate soon afterward, and later briefly held the post of Minister of International Trade. Senator/Ministers aren’t as common as they once were (except for the specific post of Leader of the Government in the Senate, natch). There have also been several Prime Ministers who were Senators, the most recent being Mackenzie Bowell in 1896. [Reference](http://www2.parl.gc.ca/Parlinfo/compilations/Senate/SenatorsInCabinet.aspx?Language=E) ---
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2009, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/53 "2009-06-15T22:37:37Z")
> [@Rhythmdvl](#): > > BACHMANN: What provision in the Constitution could you point to to give authority for the actions that have been taken by the Treasury since March of '08? > > ``` > GEITHNER: Oh, well, the -- the Congress legislated in the Emergency Economic Stabilization Act a range of very important new authorities. > > BACHMANN: Sir, in the Constitution. What -- what in the Constitution could you point to to -- to give authority to the Treasury for the extraordinary actions that have been taken? > > ``` What I wish Secretary Geithner had said: Representative Bachmann, with all due respect, it is my understanding that you are a lawyer yourself, and thus have taken studied constitutional law, such that you could probably answer that question yourself. If you cannot do so, then I suggest you consult one of the roughly 1M people in this town of Washington DC who are lawyers. I personally am not a lawyer and my other habits are good, and it is unfair not to mention mean-spirited of you to expect me to be able to answer it. I am a finance man, a money manager, not a lawyer, so don’t ask me for my legal opinion. I’ve got enough problems without being accused of practicing law without a license. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelQReilly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@MichaelQReilly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelQReilly)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2009, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667/54 "2009-06-15T22:55:27Z")
> [@squeekster](#): > > I realize that this is a rather liberal board, but maybe someone can tell me this. > > When did the executive branch receive the power to bail out private business with taxpayer money without a vote of the people… Uhhh… TARP was voted on by our elected representatives in Congress and signed into law by our elected president. :smack: [quote … then take over the private business they bailed out and dictate to them what they would do, how they would do it, how many of their stores could remain open and how much their executives would be allowed to make? Exactly what date did that happen? Because somewhere along the line, I must have missed it.[/QUOTE] It’s called the Commerce Clause, and it’s been expanding in scope since John Marshall got ahold of it in 1805. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-his-czars/499667.md?page=2)