# Obama and Iran: The 400 million was for prisoner release **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 18, 2016, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240 "2016-08-18T23:36:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/21 "2016-08-19T14:27:29Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > The $400M was money _we already owed them_. As long as we’re going to be paying it anyway, it makes sense to add contingencies. > > What do you think the response would have been if we had repaid it without securing release of the prisoners? The Republicans would be clamoring for hearings about how we gave up our best leverage. No other President found it necessary to turn this money over to this terrorist regime. We should have continued to sue Iran for every terrorist act we could dig up on them until the money was gone. Instead they now have an agreement to continue working on nuclear [del]weapons[/del] research along with the funding to go with it. Obama has done everything possible to hand Iran a nuke. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/22 "2016-08-19T14:30:56Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > No other President found it necessary to turn this money over to this terrorist regime. We should have continued to sue Iran for every terrorist act we could dig up on them until the money was gone. Reagan gave them weapons. Did you prefer that to giving them back money they paid us years ago? > [@](#): > > Instead they now have an agreement to continue working on nuclear [del]weapons[/del] research along with the funding to go with it. > > Obama has done everything possible to hand Iran a nuke. Not according to nearly every nuclear weapons proliferation expert. But what do nuclear weapons proliferation experts know about nuclear weapons proliferation? ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/23 "2016-08-19T14:31:22Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > No other President found it necessary to turn this money over to this terrorist regime. We should have continued to sue Iran for every terrorist act we could dig up on them until the money was gone. > > Instead they now have an agreement to continue working on nuclear [del]weapons[/del] research along with the funding to go with it. > > Obama has done everything possible to hand Iran a nuke. This is absurd. Pretty much every expert has said Iran is now further from a nuke, and the conditions of the agreement–to which they are adhering, makes it so they do not have the capability to “rush to the finish line.” If they decide to break the agreement and start work towards a nuke again, we would likely have _over a year to respond_. We actually had agreed years ago to international arbitration over this money, and all evidence was we were going to lose, and lose big. Because we basically stole this money from Iran. We ended up settling for like $1.5bn (the $400m is just a partial payment), and some have speculated we might have owed as much as $10bn if we hadn’t agreed to this. Sure, we could’ve ignored the result of the international arbitration, but for a country like the United States that ostensibly lives by the rule of law that would be a questionable diplomatic decision. Plus, Iran has itself entered into an agreement in which it accepts lawsuits for some of its actions–and has paid out tons of money, including to the Iran embassy hostages and others. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/24 "2016-08-19T14:47:24Z")
Steps to giving Iran a nuke: 1. Take away all their nuclear material. 2. ??? 3. Profit ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/25 "2016-08-19T14:51:34Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > In the grand scheme of things, I applaud efforts to improve relations with Iran. I have no illusions about Iran being a “good guy” or anything, but on the spectrum of good guys \<-----\> bad guys, they’re closer to the good side than Saudi Arabia is. I don’t see that we need to be so intensely antagonistic towards each other. Iran directly supports international terrorism and has designs on the region. Saudi Arabia has rogue regime elements who support international terrorism, but it is not government policy, and the Sauds are pretty content to just run Saudi Arabia rather than nations beyond their borders. Iran is definitely the bigger problem. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/26 "2016-08-19T15:04:57Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Iran directly supports international terrorism and has designs on the region. Saudi Arabia has rogue regime elements who support international terrorism, but it is not government policy, and the Sauds are pretty content to just run Saudi Arabia rather than nations beyond their borders. Iran is definitely the bigger problem. Tell that to Yemen. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/27 "2016-08-19T15:27:30Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Steps to giving Iran a nuke: > > 1. Take away all their nuclear material. > 2. ??? > 3. Profit 1. give them the green light on nuclear research 2. hand them 400 million dollars 3. Loss ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/28 "2016-08-19T15:39:52Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > 1. give them the green light on nuclear research > 2. hand them 400 million dollars > 3. Loss They were already doing nuclear research – with tons and tons of nuclear material and zero inspections. Now they can conduct peaceful research, with nearly zero nuclear material and tons of inspections. Without this agreement Iran would be guaranteed to get nukes. With the agreement, there’s no chance for at least 15 years or so. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/29 "2016-08-19T15:44:27Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > This is absurd. Pretty much every expert has said Iran is now further from a nuke, and the conditions of the agreement–to which they are adhering, makes it so they do not have the capability to “rush to the finish line.” If they decide to break the agreement and start work towards a nuke again, we would likely have _over a year to respond_… The agreement doesn’t provide for on-demand inspections. It’s specific to agreed-upon locations. A year to respond? What does that mean exactly? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/30 "2016-08-19T15:45:01Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > It’s money we owed them anyway. More accurately, it was _their_ money. If anything, we placed conditions on them getting their own money back; _they_ were the ones paying a ransom. It’s a stupid, non-story. Obama makes the BEST deals. This is what winning looks like. Trump is just jealous. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/31 "2016-08-19T15:47:47Z")
Can anyone fill me in- short version is fine, on why we owed Iran money in the first place? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/32 "2016-08-19T15:47:51Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > 1. give them the green light on nuclear research > 2. hand them 400 million dollars > 3. Loss 1. Red light on manufacturing nuclear weapons. 2. It was their money. 3. Gain. Improved diplomatic relations in country where Russia is competing for the same. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/33 "2016-08-19T15:50:16Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Can anyone fill me in- short version is fine, on why we owed Iran money in the first place? Right before the Iranian revolution (in the late 70s), the Iranian government purchased weapons from us, sending over $400m. Before we delivered weapons, the revolution happened, and relations were cut off. We never delivered the weapons, but we kept the money. ---
**Author:** ![leftfield6](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leftfield6/32/18780_2.png) [@leftfield6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leftfield6)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/34 "2016-08-19T15:54:12Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Can anyone fill me in- short version is fine, on why we owed Iran money in the first place? [ol] [li]We agreed to sell them a bunch of military hardware, planes mostly IIRC.[/li][li]They paid us in advance of receiving the goods.[/li][li]They had a regime turnover, we didn’t like the new leaders.[/li][li]We said “Hey no planes for you, but we will hang on to your money”[/li][/ol] ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/35 "2016-08-19T15:57:16Z")
So, basically, it’s like I make a big order on [Amazon.com](http://Amazon.com), and then the next day have a mental breakdown and become a professional denouncer of [Amazon.com](http://Amazon.com), holding rallies shouting “Death to Amazon!”. Amazon decides that they don’t like me any more, and keep my money but don’t send my stuff. So it’s reasonable that they didn’t send the order, but they should have returned the money. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/36 "2016-08-19T15:57:18Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > They were already doing nuclear research – with tons and tons of nuclear material and zero inspections. Now they can conduct peaceful research, with nearly zero nuclear material and tons of inspections. > > Without this agreement Iran would be guaranteed to get nukes. With the agreement, there’s no chance for at least 15 years or so. Is this anything like the line drawn in Syria and the removal of chemical weapons? How’d that work out? You presume a number of things: -the Iranians got rid of most of their material -they got rid of most of their centrifuges -they no longer wish to build nuclear weapons The agreement made with Iran is worth exactly the paper it’s printed on unlike the 400 million dollars we gave them in cash. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/37 "2016-08-19T16:00:52Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > So, basically, it’s like I make a big order on [Amazon.com](http://Amazon.com), and then the next day have a mental breakdown and become a professional denouncer of [Amazon.com](http://Amazon.com), holding rallies shouting “Death to Amazon!”. Amazon decides that they don’t like me any more, and keep my money but don’t send my stuff. > > So it’s reasonable that they didn’t send the order, but they should have returned the money. Actually it’s more like Charles Manson’s brother making a big order and then refunding the money to Charles Manson for kidnapping people and then exporting terrorism. Giving him the money is going to fuel his efforts. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/38 "2016-08-19T16:01:44Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Is this anything like the line drawn in Syria and the removal of chemical weapons? How’d that work out? Syria’s chemical weapons [were destroyed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_Syria%27s_chemical_weapons). It worked out pretty well, considering the circumstances. > [@](#): > > You presume a number of things: > > -the Iranians got rid of most of their material > -they got rid of most of their centrifuges > -they no longer wish to build nuclear weapons There are actual human inspectors, and they actually can look for stuff like this. There is science and engineering involved. As to Iran’s desire, that’s why we keep inspecting. Don’t trust – verify. That’s what the deal does, according to nuclear proliferation experts. > [@](#): > > The agreement made with Iran is worth exactly the paper it’s printed on unlike the 400 million dollars we gave them in cash. You mean the money we returned to them? But we’ll see. If Iran gets nukes in the next few years, I’ll concede that you might have been right. If they don’t, will you concede that you were wrong? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/39 "2016-08-19T16:03:44Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Actually it’s more like Charles Manson’s brother making a big order and then paying Charles Manson for kidnapping people and then exporting terrorism. Giving him the money is going to fuel his efforts. Who is the US in this metaphor? Manson, or the brother? ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2016, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240/40 "2016-08-19T16:24:55Z")
Iran’s government sucks. But get our people home. Seems favorable to me [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-and-iran-the-400-million-was-for-prisoner-release/763240.md?page=3)