# Obama attempts to "modify" the BIG THREE entitlements, I will remove his 2012 sticker from my Jeep! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 23, 2011, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118 "2011-07-23T23:05:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/81 "2011-07-25T23:27:03Z")
> [@samclem](#): > > Of course, Social Security was signed into law in 1935, Medicare and Medicaid in 1965. Minor point, but “The New Deal” is credited with starting programs like Social Security Medicare, and Medicaid. FDR was elected in 1932, that was when the work began. ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/82 "2011-07-25T23:29:55Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > If he wanted to work with the Republicans, he would have ask the Democrats in the house and senate not to stick pork onto his health care package. > I am annoyed that Hillary campaigned that everyone must pay in the health care plan, and Obama said not everyone should-until he was elected and had to implement it. You are echoing my concern. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/83 "2011-07-25T23:36:57Z")
> [@Cyclone](#): > > You might want to check with a Constitutional attorney on that. The Declaration of Independence is the primary document laying down the legal principles of our government. I will leave it to you to do your own Google research. Speaking as an attorney who did fairly well in Con Law: No. It don’t even get **mentioned.** I’m sure you could find passages quoted in court opinions, but only as dicta without precedential effect. ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/84 "2011-07-25T23:37:31Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > :rolleyes: You are also on record as being [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=616990) [kind](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=617289) of “Democrat.” Yes, please stay away from the polls for the rest of your life. You would really make a better Republican, they like people who march in step. The point of being a Dem is that we let it all hang out, and then solve the problem together. BrianGlutton, your contribution seems to be spouting party platitudes and singing “Kumbaya..” Real politics is “where the rubber hits the road.” We are talking decision making in the trenches. I am very concerned about over-population and illegal immigration. I get get the impression you offer little more than prayer to solve tough world problems. You need to focus on the hard ball politics of the decision making process and leave your bleeding heart with idealistic liberal college students where it belongs. ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/85 "2011-07-25T23:40:31Z")
> [@robby](#): > > Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid are all headed towards insolvency, just like the rest of the federal government. Something has to change–either more money needs to be put in, or fewer outlays need to be distributed. It’s that simple. > > However, go ahead and don’t vote…and watch the Republicans simply dismantle them instead. > I’m a veteran, and I’m not scared to death…mainly because I don’t get a check from the federal government. Not all veterans pull retirement, you know. > > No–the DOI states that “it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish” the government if the government becomes destructive to the people’s rights, which include “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” > > How is modifying Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid, or failing to send out checks on August 3 “destructive to the people’s rights”? Tax the rich what they rightfully owe - problems with the BIG 3 will disappear. ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/86 "2011-07-25T23:42:04Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Rants belong in The BBQ Pit. Reality check please. Ask anyone over 60 what they think. There is no rant here. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/87 "2011-07-25T23:46:25Z")
[QUOTE=Cyclone] I am beginning to wonder if there is a difference between President Obama and a Republican. [/QUOTE] Then there is something seriously wrong with you is all I can say. Up the voltage and get out a little bit…leave the basement and go forth to see the real world. > [@](#): > > Since 1932 the Democratic Party has stood for giving people a helping hand to stay on their feet. Sure they have. 😛 What they have stood for is election. > [@](#): > > When single payer went down the drain, I wondered if President Obama was really a Democrat. Yeah, he’s really just like Bush because he didn’t push through something that was pretty obviously not going to fly. He should have stuck to his guns and not budged a bit, done exactly what his base was telling him to do regardless of the effect and regardless of how stupid it was. THEN he WOULD have been just like the fucking idiotic Republicans who are currently doing exactly the same thing. How’s that working out for them so far? What do you suppose that sticking to such a hard line will do to them when Obama is clearly holding out a compromise and they aren’t taking it? Are you people stupid or just blind? I really, REALLY want to know because it’s baffling to me. Do you not understand that not only does Obama have to get stuff through the Republicans, a nearly impossible task in the current political environment, but that there are a lot of Democrats who aren’t fucking flaming left wing loonies??? And that he’s not a fucking god nor a king?? What…the…fuck…is…wrong…with…you…people!!! Gah! > [@](#): > > Now, Obama is playing poker with the BIG 3 - Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid. Really? And how much of that has actually happened you moron? Have the Republicans actually compromised and agreed to tax increases? Do you not get that he’s setting them up for the long drop?? Are you so blinded by your silly partisan idiocy that you don’t see what he’s doing? If he didn’t agree to some sort of compromise (vague and to be determined cuts to your fucking sacred cows) then he’d be seen in the same light as the Republicans are being seen…that is, unwilling to compromise for the good of the country, being lead by the nose by a radical faction of the party. Guess what? The left does not reflect the majority opinion of the country, just like the idiotic tea party doesn’t reflect a majority opinion. :smack: By compromising he is showing himself to be the only adult at the table. Of course, the left if so fucking stupid that it will probably cost him the election, based on the sheer stupidity I’m seeing here. > [@](#): > > I wonder if Obama has a Wall Street elephant tattooed on his ass, or maybe it is just the letters AIG. Or, maybe you are as stupid as you are ignorant, and you should get your head out of your ass and try and understand the nature of reality, American politics style. -XT ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/88 "2011-07-25T23:47:09Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Rants belong in The BBQ Pit. > [@Cyclone](#): > > Reality check please. Ask anyone over 60 what they think. There is no rant here. > [@Cyclone](#): > > Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid have been Democratic ideals since 1932, and President Obama is willing to play poker with their future? As a lifelong Dem I have stopped contributing to the party, and I am on record that I could be “too busy” on election day 2012 to vote at all! > > These clowns in Washington have nice cushy jobs that require little effort. Neither party is doing their job. SENIOR CITIZENS, VETERANS, AND THE DISABLED ARE BE **SCARED TO DEATH** THAT THEIR CHECKS MAY NOT ARRIVE AUGUST 3. > > Isn’t there something in the Declaration of Independence about “altering or abolishing” our Government if we are unhappy? Better yet, maybe a Democratic Party primary fight could make Hillary Clinton president in 2012! Mr. President the American people are not without options. Shape up. Be a Democrat. That, **Cyclone,** is what we around here call a **rant.** Not a GD OP. ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/89 "2011-07-25T23:48:03Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > No, it won’t. The Democrats are spineless and unwilling to stand up to the Republicans. The Republicans shout “Boo” and the Democrats cower in terror. I don’t think we Dems are afraid to stand up. If anything will get us off our collective asses it should be cutting Social Security, Medicare or Medicaid. I think some liberals do too much whining, and don’t understand the reality of solving problems in American politics. It is so easy to just quote standard liberal platitudes, rather than understand compromise. I will give Republicans credit, they have nothing to sell, and they have Obama on the run. The Democratic Party needs a lesson in how to negotiate in high level politics. President Obama appears to give away the store. ---
**Author:** ![PigArcher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bcef8e/32.png) [@PigArcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PigArcher)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/90 "2011-07-25T23:49:17Z")
> [@Cyclone](#): > > You would really make a better Republican, they like people who march in step. The point of being a Dem is that we let it all hang out, and then solve the problem together. BrianGlutton, your contribution seems to be spouting party platitudes and singing “Kumbaya..” Real politics is “where the rubber hits the road.” We are talking decision making in the trenches. > > I am very concerned about over-population and illegal immigration. I get get the impression you offer little more than prayer to solve tough world problems. You need to focus on the hard ball politics of the decision making process and leave your bleeding heart with idealistic liberal college students where it belongs. So I suppose your approach to solving tough world problems together is similar to your behavior in [your immigration thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=616990)? You know, the one where you claimed the term “anchor baby” was _polite_, threw out some ridiculous numbers from a known hate group, refused to acknowledge the validity of more reliable data provided by other posters, ignored various arguments as to why immigration laws should be changed, tried to frame to argument as a false dilemma, and were generally argumentative and obstinate? If you really expect frictionless agreement with your views, especially ones that are based on invective and prejudice rather than actual facts, then no, I don’t think you’ll be able to contribute much to your fellow democrats in solving tough world problems together. ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2011, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/91 "2011-07-25T23:51:03Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > So why are you blaming Obama for this? Blame your fellow citizens. > > From what I can see, Obama is doing the best he can under the constraints he is under. > In the last election, the American public voted in a bunch of representatives whose mantra is reduce spending with no new taxes. Now they’re finding out what the consequences of that election was. Practically speaking, that means reduce entitlements (as these newly elected representatives seems to be just fine with funding the military). > > This is clearly not Obama’s choice – you just have to listen to his speeches to know that. He’s taking enormous heat from both sides in these debt negotiations. But the people voted and this is what they asked for (although when the entitlement checks dwindle, they may find that’s not what they actually wanted). > > In the meantime, the Dems have been taking every opportunity to make sure that the nation knows exactly why their entitlements are threatened. Obama has been hammering very heavily on the theme of wanting to distribute the sacrifices equally and has been very clear that the GOP members of the House refuse to do so. > > From a public relations standpoint, the GOP is looking very, very bad. They may get what they want (mostly) in this round of deficit reduction negotiations, but the long-term consequences might be severe. It’s really hard to spin driving the nation to the verge of default based on ideological rigidity. In 2008 I thought voting for Obama would be “Boyz in the Hood got to Washington.” Instead it seems we got a watered down version of “Guess Who’s Coming to Dinner.” [http://lacadaisy.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/guesswhoscoming.jpg](http://lacadaisy.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/guesswhoscoming.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2011, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/92 "2011-07-26T00:00:16Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > So you think Obama is a corporatist but you want to vote for Hillary. > > Wut. > > Then again, you could say the same thing about any Dem candidate. Why bother? The LOTE principle is pretty flimsy. Hillary Clinton would not negotiate or as Obama is saying, “modify,” Social Security, Medicare, or Medicaid. Revise, make more efficient - Fine. Anything related to cutting benefits to recipients - no way. Wall Street makes record profits. TARP was $800,000,000,000 to clean up their mess. Make them pay or pull their corporate charters. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2011, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/93 "2011-07-26T00:05:21Z")
> [@Cyclone](#): > > Hillary Clinton would not negotiate . . . What makes you think **that?!** ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2011, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/94 "2011-07-26T00:07:19Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > You fucking retards. > > Of course, Cyclone is an obvious troll. He’s as much a life-long Democrat as Rand Rover. > > If you don’t want Obama to have to compromise with the Republicans, the thing to do is not to allow a Republican to win the White House, you fucking retards. The thing to do, is to work to elect more Democrats to the House and Senate, and then Obama won’t have to compromise. > > Only a fucking retard wouldn’t understand that the Republicans hold a majority in the House. The President shouldn’t compromise? How does that work, you fucking retards? All spending originiates in the House. This is what happens when you elect Republicans to the House, they control spending for the next two years. This is the Constitution. > > You don’t like it? Then stop being such fucking retards whining about the President, and get off your fucking asses and start figuring out how to volunteer to defeat the Republcans who control the house. Start manning the phone banks. Start calling people. Start knocking on doors. Start putting up signs. Start writing letters to the editor. Start attending speeches by your least-favorite Republican and start heckling them until security throws you out. Start donationg money. Start calling people and organizations that supported these guys and demand that they reconsider. > > Or you could just bitch and whine about how the President isn’t “tough” enough. That sounds easier. You are way out of line. I have been a DNC member since I was 18. Do you even know what the DNC is? Sounds to me like you are a complainer. What are your contributions to the Democratic Party? I have eleven photos from Ted Kennedy to Barrack Obama thanking me for the sweat of my brow for the Democratic Party. I actually go door-to-door instead of just emptying my brain in a message board. :dubious: We Dems will take your vote, but only DNC members get you a seat at the adult table! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2011, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/95 "2011-07-26T00:11:00Z")
Oh my god use the fucking multiquote ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2011, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/96 "2011-07-26T00:16:00Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Well taking off that bumper sticker will show him! I’m thinking that if Romney gets the Republican nod and chooses a responsible VP that I might vote for him and support him. He is to the left of Obama. Obama is getting help simply by my driving through my Republican neighborhood in Santa Monica. Few people have stickers, let alone the Obama 2012 DNC sticker. The point is removal will be a gesture, if I decide to remove it on August 3. More than the stickers, Obama does not get my checks, and come election day he may not get my vote. President Obama needs a course in LISTENING, a clear majority of the population agree with me on no cuts to the BIG 3. In my life I have never, to date, cast a vote for anyone but a Dem. I may have to resign from the DNC, but I will be in super company. ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2011, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/97 "2011-07-26T00:21:20Z")
> [@Scuba\_Ben](#): > > Seeing as the OP hasn’t come back to this thread yet, I strongly doubt it. > > (My post self-graped for old times’ sake.) I can not believe there have nearly been a hundred posts here, since I posted the OP 24 hours ago! I am impressed with the number of \*\*practical \*\ ***liberal** **Democrats** in The Straight Dope as opposed to those who merely spout liberal platitudes with no real-world solutions to political problems. Kuddos - The Straight Dope. ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2011, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/98 "2011-07-26T00:23:11Z")
> [@kenetic](#): > > Wha? Can you cite a single example demonstrating that the “Declaration of Independence is the primary document laying down the legal principles of our government”? Sorry, I am not going to research for one person who is not up to speed. Thank you for your consideration. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2011, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/99 "2011-07-26T00:26:26Z")
> [@Cyclone](#): > > You are way out of line. I have been a DNC member since I was 18. Do you even know what the DNC is? Easily more than you do, if you think you did more than simply register to vote as a party member (if you even did that). The DNC has only a few hundred members nationwide, and all of them earned those positions of trust by working their asses off for the party for many years. IOW we’ve seen your brand of laughably-bad liar many times before. Now you can kindly go back and tell your Freeper friends how much you pwned us. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Cyclone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/db5fbb/32.png) [@Cyclone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyclone)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2011, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118/100 "2011-07-26T00:27:17Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > Dear Obvious Troll, > > ``` > You're Obvious. > > ``` > > Regards, > > D I never fail to be amazed about people who use the word “troll” and do not seem to know what it means. It means you do not have an intelligent argument to post, so you default to kindergarten. :rolleyes: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-attempts-to-modify-the-big-three-entitlements-i-will-remove-his-2012-sticker-from-my-jeep/590118.md?page=6)