# Obama is not a Socialist **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 21, 2016, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527 "2016-08-21T18:09:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2016, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/21 "2016-08-21T23:13:21Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > Private sector control of a nationalized healthcare system is the definition of fascism. fas·cism ˈfaSHˌizəm/Submit noun an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. synonyms: authoritarianism, totalitarianism, dictatorship, despotism, autocracy; More (in general use) extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practice. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2016, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/22 "2016-08-21T23:16:27Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > Ok. > > How bizarre the insular extreme right of the americans are. How bizarre the insular extreme right of **some** americans are. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/23 "2016-08-22T02:29:18Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > Former Marxist, current libertarian, professor of economics, Thomas Sowell, explains that President Obama is in fact not the socialist that many conservatives accuse him of being. In reality he is a [fascist.](http://jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell061212.php3#.V7nuJz9Fy-o) Another label-fail, **drewder**? You should go with a less specific word that doesn’t make you look like you don’t know these political terms mean. Something like “doodyhead”, or maybe “poopypants”. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/24 "2016-08-22T02:53:56Z")
Hm… Who else liked to accuse his political opponents of being “fascists”, regardless of whether the label made any sense or was in any way actually applicable? Someone who was an iron-fisted dictator, and had a very distinctive mustache? Stalin, of course! Thomas Sowell is a Stalinist. Q.E.D. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/25 "2016-08-22T04:30:32Z")
Fascism is a radical authoritarian nationalism. It is typically headed by a populist leader who argues that a certain class of people are inferior, blaming them for all the problems and proposing himself as the solution. A free-market controlled nationalized healthcare system would be democratic socialism, I think. Honestly, the description seems contradictory. ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/26 "2016-08-22T05:17:33Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Communism - Socialism - democratic socialism - moderate leftists - moderate right - far rights - fascist > [@raventhief](#): > > fas·cism > ˈfaSHˌizəm/Submit > noun > an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization. > synonyms: authoritarianism, totalitarianism, dictatorship, despotism, autocracy; More > (in general use) extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practice. I cannot understand how the myth of fascism being a right-wing ideology got started. It is an extreme **LEFT** -wing ideology. It’s next-door to communism. Communism, fascism, and nazism all have one thing in common – they glorify the power and well-being of government above all else. That is the very definition of left-wing thought. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Understander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3da27b/32.png) [@The\_Understander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Understander)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/27 "2016-08-22T05:24:51Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > Private sector control of a nationalized healthcare system is the definition of fascism. Cite or GTFO ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/28 "2016-08-22T05:37:09Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Communism, fascism, and nazism all have one thing in common – they glorify the power and well-being of government above all else. That is the very definition of left-wing thought. No it isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/29 "2016-08-22T05:40:51Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > I cannot understand how the myth of fascism being a right-wing ideology got started. It is an extreme **LEFT** -wing ideology. It’s next-door to communism. > > Communism, fascism, and nazism all have one thing in common – they glorify the power and well-being of government above all else. That is the very definition of left-wing thought. Joseph de Maistre, Oswald Spengler, and Carl Schmitt would all like to have a word with you. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Understander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3da27b/32.png) [@The\_Understander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Understander)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/30 "2016-08-22T05:41:31Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > Private sector control of a nationalized healthcare system is the definition of fascism. > [@Lemur866](#): > > No it isn’t. butbutbut HANNITY SAID SO YOUR wrong ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/31 "2016-08-22T14:54:03Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Fascism is a radical authoritarian nationalism. It is typically headed by a populist leader who argues that a certain class of people are inferior, blaming them for all the problems and proposing himself as the solution. I’m glad we don’t have anyone like _that_ running for president! Oh, wait… ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/32 "2016-08-22T21:49:26Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > Former Marxist, current libertarian, professor of economics, Thomas Sowell, explains that President Obama is in fact not the socialist that many conservatives accuse him of being. In reality he is a [fascist.](http://jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell061212.php3#.V7nuJz9Fy-o) He makes some very good points. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/33 "2016-08-22T22:08:43Z")
Of course Obama is a socialist! His final term is about to end and we have socialized roads, socialized schools, socialized water, socialized sewers, and socialized electric power in some places. Most of the military and even the aircraft carriers are socialized! 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/34 "2016-08-22T22:18:53Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > Communism, fascism, and nazism all have one thing in common – they glorify the power and well-being of government above all else. That is the very definition of left-wing thought. Both left and right wing regimes have to become more and more authoritarian the further they move away from the center, because the center is where most people want to be - you have to use force to move your society away from it in whatever direction. Extreme left regimes are authoritarian because they’re _extreme_, not because they’re left ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2016, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/35 "2016-08-22T22:19:28Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > He makes some very good points. That’s pretty much all the additional evidence I need to know Sowell’s spouting his usual bullshit… ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/36 "2016-08-23T10:05:30Z")
Does Sowell think Obama is uniquely fascist among American presidents, or more of the same? > [@Flyer](#): > > Communism, fascism, and nazism all have one thing in common – they glorify the power and well-being of government above all else. That is the very definition of left-wing thought. The concept of the left/right political spectrum is from the French Revolution. The right supported the monarchy, nobility, and tradition. The left didn’t. But how can that be, if glorifying the government is the root of left wing thought? What’s more glorious than the divine right of kings? Are they leftists too? Your view would render the ideological clash between communism and fascism incoherent, let alone the Cold War. There would be no such thing as right wing dictators, just various flavors of left wing autocrats. In this lens, the right has been historically impotent. I’m curious what you think a right wing government looks like. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/37 "2016-08-23T11:33:51Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > He makes some very good points. Good points = “derogatory things about Obama and the left that make me feel good when I read them because I hate Obama and the left.” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Understander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3da27b/32.png) [@The\_Understander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Understander)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/38 "2016-08-23T12:23:34Z")
> [@Aspidistra](#): > > Both left and right wing regimes have to become more and more authoritarian the further they move away from the center, because the center is where most people want to be - you have to use force to move your society away from it in whatever direction. > > Extreme left regimes are authoritarian because they’re _extreme_, not because they’re left That’s an interesting model. What do you think about models which show political orientation and tendency toward authoritarianism as separate axes on a Cartesian-style grid? ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/39 "2016-08-23T12:51:04Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > That’s pretty much all the additional evidence I need to know Sowell’s spouting his usual bullshit… No, you should try actually reading the article for comprehension. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527/40 "2016-08-23T14:08:49Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > No, you should try actually reading the article for comprehension. I read it _with_ comprehension-works much better. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-not-a-socialist/763527.md?page=3)