# Obama is vacuous and nebulous **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 14, 2008, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664 "2008-02-14T22:07:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/1 "2008-02-14T22:07:08Z")
I am so tired of hearing this. Every argument as such lists complaints about his lack of experience. He didn’t hold “X” position you’d like him to hold. When you point out what he has done in life, it is either summarily dismissed or someone claims that you can’t really tell where he stands on such issues. Most of these people live in sound bite culture, they haven’t read his issues page in depth. One guy was talking about how he was like a ghost at the University of Chicago because he couldn’t find anything he published, of course a cursory web search turned this up for me: [Barack Obama taught Constitutional Law At Chicago Law School. Dkos diary by one of his students - Democratic Underground](http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4239757#4240471). He didn’t publish because he was too busy working on the street level and running for public office. :rolleyes: I am not complaining about people who have legitimate gripes against Obama. Sam Stone has made some good posts to that effect, I am talking about those who want to paint him as even less experienced than he actually was. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/2 "2008-02-14T22:20:51Z")
But do you think he’s Black enough? ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/3 "2008-02-14T22:21:32Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] But do you think he’s Black enough? [/QUOTE] Yes ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/4 "2008-02-14T22:24:05Z")
I’ve said it twice, I’ll say it again. The only people with any pertinent experience are people running for their second term. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/5 "2008-02-14T22:27:03Z")
> [@](#): > > When you point out what he has done in life, it is either summarily dismissed or someone claims that you can’t really tell where he stands on such issues. And just think how much he’s going to accomplish when he quits the cocaine and leaves the Black Muslims! ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/6 "2008-02-14T22:30:03Z")
[QUOTE=Sampiro] And just think how much he’s going to accomplish when he quits the cocaine and leaves the Black Muslims! [/QUOTE] A lot less probably. Cocaine has made a lot of stock brokers quite wealthy! ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/7 "2008-02-14T22:47:45Z")
[QUOTE=mswas] Obama is vacuous and nebulous [/QUOTE] Cool, our first “space president”! Can we call him “M31” once he’s elected? ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/8 "2008-02-14T22:55:57Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] I’ve said it twice, I’ll say it again. The only people with any pertinent experience are people running for their second term. [/QUOTE] and we can all see how well **that** can turn out. ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/9 "2008-02-14T22:57:55Z")
[QUOTE=mswas] Cocaine has made a lot of stock brokers quite wealthy! [/QUOTE] Coke…is…good! Coke…works! ---
**Author:** ![Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4da419/32.png) [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gala_Matrix_Fire)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2008, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/10 "2008-02-14T23:10:22Z")
I heard he was named after his father, Osama. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/11 "2008-02-15T00:00:52Z")
[QUOTE=Gala Matrix Fire] I heard he was named after his father, Osama. [/QUOTE] And his godfather, Hussein. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/12 "2008-02-15T00:37:42Z")
> [@](#): > > I am not complaining about people who have legitimate gripes against Obama. Sam Stone has made some good posts to that effect, I am talking about those who want to paint him as even less experienced than he actually was. There are valid, political or philosophic reasons for people not to vote for Obama. But his supposed lack of experience is a bonus IMHO…it means he hasn’t been completely captured by the system. Like Hillary…who’s camp (and who) is currently the main source of this kind of attack on the man. -XT ---
**Author:** ![MikeG](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikeg/32/4329_2.png) [@MikeG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeG)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/13 "2008-02-15T00:47:50Z")
I’ve met Barack a couple times in the last 15 years and I wish I had time to go pound the pavement for him. Far from being vacuous, he’s an incredibly smart and thoughtful man whom I think will make a fine president. ---
**Author:** ![FordPrefect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e99b99/32.png) [@FordPrefect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordPrefect)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/14 "2008-02-15T01:21:29Z")
I am not an American, but I think this applies to most, if not all, democracies. > [@Douglas Adams](#): > > One of the many major problems with governing people is that of whom you get to do it; or rather of who manages to get people to let them do it to them: It is a well known fact, that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it. Anyone who is capable of getting themselves into a position of power should on no account be allowed to do the job. Another problem with governing people is people. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/15 "2008-02-15T02:33:10Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] There are valid, political or philosophic reasons for people not to vote for Obama. But his supposed lack of experience is a bonus IMHO…it means he hasn’t been completely captured by the system. [/QUOTE] My sentiments **exactly**! I think not spending decades in Washington, making deals with people who will soon come to collect, is one of his best attributes. Meanwhile…Ford Prefect quoting Douglas Adams. Dude, you just blew my mind! ---
**Author:** ![Anomalous\_Reading](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b3f665/32.png) [@Anomalous\_Reading](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anomalous_Reading)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/16 "2008-02-15T02:42:34Z")
[QUOTE=mswas] I am so tired of hearing this. Every argument as such lists complaints about his lack of experience. He didn’t hold “X” position you’d like him to hold. When you point out what he has done in life, it is either summarily dismissed or someone claims that you can’t really tell where he stands on such issues. [/QUOTE] I’d submit that his speeches have been at least as substantive as his opponents. If you listen to Hillary’s speeches, very often she’s talking very broadly - as is McCain. That’s not to say that they don’t have detailed plans, much the same as Obama. The trick lies in this fact, that he’s able to inspire and rally people. This leaves him with the “poet” label, and we all just KNOW that no poet ever said anything. And especially anything worthwhile… Let’s throw something else in the mix… the President doesn’t create a single bit of legislation. What a President does is propose stuff, haggle with Congress, sign legislation or veto it. Other than that a President sets the agenda with… words to the nation. With symbolic acts. And help to guide the PROCESS. Able to add or subtract transparency. Able to appoint people to positions… That’s what a President does. Given that Obama has a record of working with both sides of the aisle (as does McCain) I’m more inclined to trust him (them) than other candidates. I’m a centrist and an independent. And I like big picture answers - not ideological ones. ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/17 "2008-02-15T02:57:30Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] There are valid, political or philosophic reasons for people not to vote for Obama. But his supposed lack of experience is a bonus IMHO…it means he hasn’t been completely captured by the system. Like Hillary…who’s camp (and who) is currently the main source of this kind of attack on the man. [/QUOTE] Right. And it’s also reasonable to maintain that his lack of experience compared to Hillary or McCain is _not_ a bonus. But as the OP said, it’s pretty damn annoying when people refuse to give him credit for the experience that he does have. (FWIW, I think his non-insider status is a bonus, too.) ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/18 "2008-02-15T03:00:18Z")
[QUOTE=xtisme] There are valid, political or philosophic reasons for people not to vote for Obama. But his supposed lack of experience is a bonus IMHO…it means he hasn’t been completely captured by the system. [/QUOTE] I \*want \*someone who understands the system. Note that Obama is a career politician, not some dude from “outside the system”. He _is_ a bit nebulous, but so are many politcos, including Hillary. Obama is a very charismatic speaker, however, \*much \*more so than Hillary. What annoys me about Obama is not the candidate so much as his supporters, such as on this board. Oh, and “CHANGE!”. Like electing a woman for Prez isn’t “change”. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/19 "2008-02-15T03:02:49Z")
I’m sick of hearing he’s all rhetoric and no specifics. He wrote a 300-page book. It’s not his fault you haven’t read it. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2008, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664/20 "2008-02-15T03:04:09Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] Oh, and “CHANGE!”. Like electing a woman for Prez isn’t “change”. :rolleyes: [/QUOTE] Some people mistake movement for action. /Emerson [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-is-vacuous-and-nebulous/437664.md?page=2)