# Obama March 18th, 2008 Speech **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 18, 2008, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774 "2008-03-18T14:21:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![stolichnaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@stolichnaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stolichnaya)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/81 "2008-03-18T19:36:18Z")
The problem is that the guy said numerous controversial things and Obama didn’t stomp out in the middle of church and never look back, but instead stayed for 20 years. It is a legitimate question for a curious person to have, and I think it was smart of Obama to answer it basically head on and without guile in this speech. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/82 "2008-03-18T19:40:00Z")
[Classy response](http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/03/hillary_im_glad_obama_gave_tha.php) from Hillary, btw: > [@](#): > > "I did not have a chance to see or to read yet Sen. Obama’s speech. But I’m very glad that he gave it. It’s an important topic. Issues of race and gender in America have been complicated throughout our history, and they are complicated in this primary campaign. > > “There have been detours and pitfalls along the way. But we should remember that this is an historic moment for the Democratic Party, and for our country. We will be nominating the first African-American or woman for the Presidency of the United States, and that is something that all Americans can and should celebrate.” ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/83 "2008-03-18T19:40:55Z")
[QUOTE=stolichnaya] The problem is that the guy said numerous controversial things and Obama didn’t stomp out in the middle of church and never look back, but instead stayed for 20 years. [/quote] That would be demanding a standard that nobody holds for themselves and that they certainly don’t hold for white politicians. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/84 "2008-03-18T19:43:35Z")
If his numbers don’t go up over the next coupl of weeks I’ll be shocked. I don’t think I’ll have to worry too much about being shocked… ---
**Author:** ![stolichnaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@stolichnaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stolichnaya)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/85 "2008-03-18T19:48:55Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] That would be demanding a standard that nobody holds for themselves and that they certainly don’t hold for white politicians. [/QUOTE] If you think that the clips of Wright on TV don’t make some right-thinking people wonder what Obama is doing at that church, and if you don’t think that’s a legitimate question for them to have given limited information, you’re probably not the target of his speech today anyway. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/86 "2008-03-18T19:50:15Z")
[QUOTE=Sampiro] I had an image of Hillary Clinton watching the speech while in the Velma Kelly role from _Chicago_ as Roxie announces she’s pregnant and Velma just says “Shit!” [/QUOTE] My imagination is having the best time it’s had since I quit smoking on Sunday trying to picture Clinton singing “I Know A Girl”… ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/87 "2008-03-18T19:54:07Z")
[QUOTE=stolichnaya] If you think that the clips of Wright on TV don’t make some right-thinking people wonder what Obama is doing at that church, and if you don’t think that’s a legitimate question for them to have given limited information, you’re probably not the target of his speech today anyway. [/QUOTE] I think that right thinking people know better than to assume the sum total of a religious leader can be reduced down to a few particularly incindiary sound bites. I also think that right thinking people understand that they can better understand what a candidate thinks and believes by what he says _himself_, not by what a pastor at his church once said. And I am positive that no right thinking person could possibly believe that Barack Obama hates America or that he wants to kill whitey. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/88 "2008-03-18T20:01:40Z")
I think you’d be hard-pressed to find a thinking person who agrees with every canonical tenet of their religion, let alone every opinion held by their clergy. I’m really failing to see the big honkin’ deal here. ---
**Author:** ![athelas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5e9695/32.png) [@athelas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/athelas)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/89 "2008-03-18T20:10:13Z")
[QUOTE=DianaG] I think you’d be hard-pressed to find a thinking person who agrees with every canonical tenet of their religion, let alone every opinion held by their clergy. I’m really failing to see the big honkin’ deal here. [/QUOTE] There’s a slight difference between “agreeing with every canonical tenet of their religion” and actively agreeing to listen to this God Damn American and KKKA nonsense. I hope everyone noticed that bit of false moral equivalence that Obama tried to slip into his speech, and wasn’t taken in by it. The only acceptable response to Rev. Wright’s hate-speech, besides walking out of that church as soon as he heard about it, would be to outright denounce him, and that didn’t happen today. By refusing to take that step (and compounded by the Ferraro flap, and so on), Obama has fallen into the Clinton trap, painting himself as “the black candidate.” I won’t say that he’s through, since he currently still has a commanding popular lead, but this failure significantly weakens his candidacy. ---
**Author:** ![stolichnaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@stolichnaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stolichnaya)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/90 "2008-03-18T20:10:47Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] I think that right thinking people know better than to assume the sum total of a religious leader can be reduced down to a few particularly incindiary sound bites. I also think that right thinking people understand that they can better understand what a candidate thinks and believes by what he says _himself_, not by what a pastor at his church once said. And I am positive that no right thinking person could possibly believe that Barack Obama hates America or that he wants to kill whitey. [/QUOTE] So why give a speech? It seems that Obama acknowledges that there is a problem of appearance with Wright, and I happen to think that anyone who wonders about the clips they saw is not automatically an idiot or a racist. And I think it was an excellent act of political aikido to steer his reaction to this controversy into a positive extension of the discussion of race in america. But we obviously disagree on this. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/91 "2008-03-18T20:13:10Z")
[QUOTE=athelas] The only acceptable response to Rev. Wright’s hate-speech, besides walking out of that church as soon as he heard about it, would be to outright denounce him… [/QUOTE] If, hypothetically, Obama had already denounced him you would be totally satisfied? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/92 "2008-03-18T20:13:50Z")
[QUOTE=athelas] The only acceptable response to Rev. Wright’s hate-speech, besides walking out of that church as soon as he heard about it, would be to outright denounce him, and that didn’t happen today. [/QUOTE] He’s done that repeatedly over the last few days. ---
**Author:** ![ZebraShaSha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/eada6e/32.png) [@ZebraShaSha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZebraShaSha)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/93 "2008-03-18T20:14:36Z")
[QUOTE=Marley23] He’s done that repeatedly over the last few days. [/QUOTE] But did he denounce AND reject? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/94 "2008-03-18T20:15:05Z")
Obama said just what he needed to say, and said it well. Good on him. Generally, I wouldn’t attribute the views of any rabbi, priest, minister or imam to a politician who attended that religious leader’s house of worship, and Obama properly distinguished his own views from those of his pastor. ---
**Author:** ![Crown\_Prince\_of\_Irony](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ed655f/32.png) [@Crown\_Prince\_of\_Irony](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crown_Prince_of_Irony)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/95 "2008-03-18T20:20:46Z")
Haven’t seen the speech yet, but I read the transcript online and I **had** to weigh in, even though I shy away from discussions around current events in politics. I am a white man, but I’ve had a glimpse of the challenges black people face - before I met my wife, I lived with a black girlfriend for about 6 months. In that time, in the **very** liberal town of Eugene, OR, I saw examples of both overt and subtle racism (from both whites and blacks), from being called a n\*\*\*\*r-lover by complete strangers, to being asked by a “friend” if she was a jungle-woman in bed, to being accosted by a black acquaintance of hers who didn’t approve of my skin tone. Even so, I freely admit I still have slightly less than an inkling of the issues that black people (or any minority) face every day. I only had to live with it for 6 months, somewhat peripherally - once she left me (for another, richer, guy), the racism just wasn’t there anymore, like something that had crawled up from the ground, only to burrow itself under again. But I’ve known since then that the racial problems facing our country cannot be solved through simple legislation or litigation, nor can they be solved by simple declaring racism dead and wishing it were true. But I’ve never really been able to articulate what the underlying problems are, and how we might go about solving them. When I read this speech, however, it felt absolutely **right** to me. This guy gets it. And you know what? I could care less what his specific plan is for the economy, foreign policy, or defense. This man shows an innate understanding, to the core, of our country’s brightest virtues and our darkest dilemmas. If - as I’m confident he will - he surrounds himself with policy experts who aren’t afraid to challenge him, or to be challenged themselves, to help begin to set right the mistakes made over the last 10 years, he is capable of leading this great but troubled country through to the next era of our existence. An era when we finally begin to **really** heal the wounds at the core of our nation’s unique but troubled legacy. It all boils down to this - I had a gut reaction upon finishing reading this speech: “If I can’t vote for him, I’m not voting for anyone.” I refuse to vote for another candidate whom I feel does not understand the core of the American experience - I’ve thrown away my votes since Bill Clinton’s second term (I don’t feel the first vote for Bill was wasted, but I voted for Nader in '96). And in my opinion, Hillary seems to me to be indistinguishable from any of the other seasoned Democratic professional politicians, in that she plays “the game” well, but doesn’t really inspire greatness. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/96 "2008-03-18T20:20:59Z")
[QUOTE=athelas] There’s a slight difference between “agreeing with every canonical tenet of their religion” and actively agreeing to listen to this God Damn American and KKKA nonsense. I hope everyone noticed that bit of false moral equivalence that Obama tried to slip into his speech, and wasn’t taken in by it. [/quote] Obama DIDN’T LISTEN to his G-d Damn America sermon. DIDN’T. There was no false moral equivalence in his speech. I guess all the religious right Republicans ought to be excoriated for being associated with anti-America churches, too, huh? How about [this lovely church choir singing](http://www.rightwingwatch.org/2007/09/why_should_god_bless_america.html) “Why Should G-d Bless America” at one of the Republican debates? Lovely. But not media fodder. Hmmmmmm. > [@](#): > > Why should God bless America? > She’s forgotten he exists > And has turned her back > On everything that made her what she is > > Why should God stand beside her > Through the night with the light from his hand? > God have mercy on America > Forgive her sin and heal our land > > The courts ruled prayer out of our schools > In June of ‘62 > Told the children “you are your own God now > So you can make the rules” > O say can you see what that choice > Has cost us to this day > America, one nation under God, has gone astray > > . . . > [@athelas](#): > > The only acceptable response to Rev. Wright’s hate-speech, besides walking out of that church as soon as he heard about it, would be to outright denounce him, and that didn’t happen today. By refusing to take that step (and compounded by the Ferraro flap, and so on), Obama has fallen into the Clinton trap, painting himself as “the black candidate.” I won’t say that he’s through, since he currently still has a commanding popular lead, but this failure significantly weakens his candidacy. Nonsense. One does not have to denounce a human being who is more than 5 minutes of spliced together sound bites just because one disagrees with the content of those 5 minutes over a lifetime of good words and good works. That’s just patently absurd. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/97 "2008-03-18T20:23:05Z")
[QUOTE=jayjay] My imagination is having the best time it’s had since I quit smoking on Sunday trying to picture Clinton singing “I Know A Girl”… [/QUOTE] Whilst I on the other hand Try to say that he stole a speech And I’ll look as pretty as Stacy Keach I, on the other hand Make a qualified White House pitch And look like a middle aged rich white bitch Of course she’s already sung _But I Can’t Do it Alone_ (“Do you know that you would fit into my husband’s old suits just perfectly?”) ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/98 "2008-03-18T20:24:43Z")
What is a church nowadays. ? It it a pastor telling sheepish people how and what to think? Does the church community just receive marching orders from the pastor. ? Is the pastor the church? I think not. People attend church for many reasons. It is not to get political instructions. I have left church and heard parrishoners arguing about the sermon. Disagreements are common. My church had 6 priests giving masses. What was the official church view ,4 out of 6? To say that attending a church means you agree with everything a pastor says is stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Bobotheoptimist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/919ad9/32.png) [@Bobotheoptimist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bobotheoptimist)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/99 "2008-03-18T20:28:03Z")
Jeez, I never really believed the stories about people fainting in his presence until reading this thread. Comparable to the “I Have A Dream” speech? Really? He’s a politician delivering a planned and scripted CYA, not a civil rights leader fighting for the betterment of the nation. Yes, I was unimpressed. “But my Gramma was a racist, too!”… Nice. Compared to Dubya, of course, it was a sterling example of eloquence and honesty, and Hillary would have blamed Rush for the whole thing, but comparing Obama to those two is setting the bar pretty darn low, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Hippy\_Hollow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hippy_hollow/32/4841_2.png) [@Hippy\_Hollow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hippy_Hollow)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2008, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774/100 "2008-03-18T20:29:13Z")
It was a good speech, but I don’t know if it will do much to sway people one way or the other. The vast majority of people giving a thumbs up are Obama supporters. Has anyone changed their feelings about his candidacy because of this speech? This was a speech made out of political expediency. Had it come at a time before a crisis came forth it would have meant a lot more. There were some odd statements - I thought it was strange to paint Wright and his grandmother as holding views he finds abhorrent, but somehow he was above it all. The admission of being in the pews when incendiary sermons were delivered by Wright is way too lawyerly to be parsed as it is here. People will understand him saying that he said he didn’t hear Wright’s sermons, but today he did. The question that this whole issue has raised for Obama is not, as **Diogenes** keeps saying that Obama “hates America and wants to kill Whitey.” It’s that his judgment isn’t quite as sound as he claimed it was. I haven’t heard anyone credible saying that they believe Obama shares the beliefs of Wright. What they have said is that Wright has some upsetting and disturbing views of America and government, and Obama, as a person with good judgment, should have exercised it by a) critiquing these views well before they came to light in the manner they did, b) appealing to his close mentor to tone down his rhetoric, or c) dissociating himself, at least politically, from such a polarizing figure. With Obama, like with McClurkin before and now Wright, these folks were perfectly fine until _someone else_ noted that their words were problematic. That, I feel is the issue that needs to be addressed. (Yes, I know he’s saying he didn’t hear the _specific_ sermons that were broadcast on YouTube, etc. But most people haven’t been paying anywhere near the attention that most of us here have on this issue. And isn’t that parsing a lot like what people disliked about Bill Clinton?) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-march-18th-2008-speech/441774.md?page=6)