Bad boys, bad boys
whachya gonna do
whachya gonna do
when they come to your nice home because a neighbor reported what might be a break in and the cops show up to protect your property?
Whataya think? A little clunky, huh?
Which is interesting since the 911 call came in at 12:45. So Figueroa is the second officer in the house, Crowley is already there, a full minute before Lucia Whalen ever dialed her phone. It’s like… magic!
Both reports state that they heard an “ECC broadcast” at “approximately 12:44”.
So in BRICKER world absolutely nothing would have sufficed. No ID can be trusted. His luggage was simply for gathering loot. The neighbors could not be trusted. What a crock. Master criminals that got Gates regular ID ,his school Id and then were smart enough to bring luggage for the loot, knowing he was returning from a long trip, are a believable scenario to you. These are some master criminals. If you believe that crap, it would be shocking. He gave him 2 pieces of ID.
Of course as a lawyer you know in Mass. Creating a disturbance requires
- you created a dangerous condition and it served no legitimate purpose
- You caused a disturbance which inconvenienced the public and caused alarm
3.In Mass. Yelling at a cop is not disturbing the peace.
A school ID shows that he is in the proper area. The school residences are not everywhere you know. What should be clear to you is that he could have asked a neighbor to ID him. Flashing cop car lights do draw a crowd. I am sure they did not go there for the express purpose of Identifying Gates. But in the interest of justice ,Crowley could have asked if anyone knew if he lived there. But he had no interest in getting the facts.,not when he could drag an uppity black to jail for having the nerve of defending his rights.
His point was that crooks wood bring luggage regardless—to carry stuff.
Not according to the cops. Only one—without his address.
Surely you realize that one could do #3 as they satisfy #1 or #2? If the logic of that escaped you, now you know.
No address. The “area” wasn’t being broken into, a residence was.
They were inside the house. The crowd was out at the curb. One of the neighbors, the one who called in the break-in, evidently didn’t recognize him. Seems to make infinitely more sense for him to do what cops across the county do: check his driver’s license.
Yes. And a belligerent man yelling at the cops adds to the spectacle. The cop cars were not an option. His belligerence was.
:rolleyes: This may be the stupidest thing you’ve said on this to date, Kreskin. And that’s saying something. I’m sure this was a plot hatched well in advance. Whalen was probably in on it. And the lady who asked her to call. and Figueroa. And the black cop (forgot his name). Tell me, how long do you think this plan was afoot? maybe we need to get Woodward on it.
Again, they were inside the house. Non-asshole people usually comply with cop’s request to show ID with their driver’s license. How was Crowley to know that this Gates guy was a belligerent dick. Do you fault him for not being a mind reader?
He sought to get the facts. By asking. Gates chose to get like Sharpton on crystal meth. Crowley warned him to control himself. Gates was unable or unwilling to and got himself a free ride with the po-pos.*
FUCK! I just realized I wasted my time with this post because it was completely unnecessary as your contributions have been thoroughly poisoned:
Just in case you missed it.
*Language intentionally chosen in honor of the attitude of the esteemed Professor Henry Gates.
I imagine Prof Gates has as much familiarity with the phrase “po-po’s” as I do, being something I saw on TV.
That’s the point. It was a nod to his racist stereotyping. I got it from The Wire.
It’s amazing to me, the alacrity with which you will call Gates racist, but the great reluctance you show to using the same word for, say, Pat Buchanan, even when he says overtly racist things. I guess Gates can say racist things and he is a RACIST, but Buchanan says racist things, it’s complicated. You really do pick and choose where you see complexity in a person who makes racist statements, and where you feel free to label someone, as a whole, a RACIST. You have said that you think an accusation of racism is a very damaging label, so why be hypocritical and paste it on Gates when you are otherwise so cautious in using it? If Pat Buchanan is a complicated person who sometimes says racist things, then why can’t you admit the same thing could be true about Gates?
Why do you continue quoting the cop like he has a shred of credibility. He lied in the report. He does not tell the truth. He manufactured a case against Gates. But for some thick headed reason you quote him like anybody somebody should accept his viewpoint or his version.
Note he kept using tumultuous in the report. That is because it is used in the legal definition. So in order to better create a law breaking offense he used the precise terminology .I am sure you and all cops use tumultuous in your paperwork and conversation . Crowley had some guidelines on what to say to fit Gates actions into the report to enhance his official BS. But he did that clumsily too.
Do you have any neighbor complaining about Gates disturbing the peace? I have seen interviews and speeches in which he is a soft spoken intelligent individual. This is cop creation.
How is “po-po” racist?
Because I believe him. Especially since the other two cops, one hispanic and one black, both back up his version of events that they can attest to. And both say Gates was belligerent. Why do you take Gates’ version of events as gospel. There is no one who backs up the discrepancies he mentions. And everyone seems to agree that he was apoplectic, and jumped and attitude right off the bat. That, and if you look at what we know of the cop’s record, it points AWAY from him being a racist.
Yawn. And if he didn’t use that you’d be jumping on that as proof of some other fantasy you have. Give me a break.
He didn’t get arrested for disturbing the peace in general, or usually. He got arrest for disturbing the peace because that’s what he did when the cops were there. That’s usually how it works, you know. Maybe the next time he will have learned his lesson. If not, another free ride with The Man for the ass.
I don’t think it’s racist, per se, but it does stereotype gates as a ghetto black. Like I said, I got it from The Wire, where it was used by the most unsavory characters. I just highlighted it because if I didn’t, I guarantee you someone would have tried to make something of it.
Why would you want to do that?
Buchanan can say racist things. So can Sotomayor. Or Gates. Or you. Or me. As far as Buchanan, I think I explained myself fully. I also see a rush from the left to try to paint him as a racist time and again. Never mind he chose a black woman to be his running mate, but, but, but… But in that thread I simply evaluated his comments in question. Tomorrow he may say something I do think is racist, and I’ll be happy to characterize it as such. As far as gates goes, I think his actions in this instance were clearly racist. I will admit, I am not reluctant to assume the man is a racist at heart. That is my opinion of many of these elite liberal black studies professors, Gates and Cornell West included. By that I mean all they see his race. I would throw into that category Sharpton (at least until he apologizes for Tawana Brawley), Farakhan, and the king himself, Jesse The Shakedown Artist Jackson.
Can I get an amen?
I do take your words to heart for the though. Seriously. In the heat of passion words can sometimes fly too easily. Thank you for the reminder. Though I think them probably appropriate here.
:rolleyes: As I explained it was an intentional and overt—and highlighted—nod to the the racist and stereotyping actions of Gates. You know, like a joke.
And if you’re tempted to type something like “that’s nothing to joke about”, put it in an envelope and send it to my lawn jockey.*
*Another joke. No, I don’t have a lawn jockey. Now whether that’s only because I don’t have a lawn will have to remain a mystery.
Just as I think Buchanan’s comments on Maddow’s show were clearly racist. But you cautioned, in that thread, that Buchanan is a complex person, and should not be judged wholly racist based on those comments. This is what I am saying to you now. An incident, when he was ill, jet lagged, and freaked out, and showed bad judgment, does not give you license to say that Gates is, overall, in his heart, a racist.
What white people on the public stage do you think are racist? I notice that you can, off the top of your head, label a bunch of high profile African American academians, and several politicians as racist. But I can’t say that about Buchanan without setting you off. You seem to have a bias here, wherein you are quick to point fingers at people of color, but resist mightily having that same label applied to a white person, even one who you admit says racist things.
Pat Buchanan had a black running mate. This means he can’t be a racist. Well, Gates has taken this stance that might complexify him for you:
Does this sound like a person who is racist against white people in his heart? Do you feel comfortable labeling and dismissing him with so much greater haste than you do Pat Buchanan? Why is Buchanan worthy of more consideration and latitude than Gates?
So, maybe Gates is more complicated than this single incident would suggest. I don’t think you know very much about him and are frankly speaking from ignorance. I wish you would show the same flexibility of thought WRT Gates that you show when thinking about Buchanan. If you can’t, I’d like you to articulate why not.
Where I come from, jokes are supposed to be funny. Aso, to serve some purpose, to make some point, the question about which you dodged. Why would you want to paint Gates as a ghetto black, even in jest?
I suppose you are on a mission to absolutely destroy any credibility you might have had on this board. How familiar are you with the work of Gates and Cornel West? What, precisely, do you take issue with in their work?
So if one is a “liberal black studies professor” that equates to racist in your book? Where does Orlando Patterson fit? Or John Ogbu? bell hooks? Just trying to get a read on your oh-so-nuanced stance here.
And of course these academics are equal in your mind to Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. I don’t see these gentlemen as boogeymen as you do, but I do differentiate between those who have command of a pulpit and those who have made a career for themselves in the competitive world of peer review in academia.
I don’t recall that Buchanan thread in detail, but I think my point was that what he said was not necessarily racist. That it was being shoehorned into that characterization. And that is not the first time the left has attempted to slap him with that label.
I think Gates actions were absolutely racist. It was all that was on his mind. A white cop shows up to help him ask simply asks for his ID and goes beserk, adopting the ugliest racial stereotypes and accusing a good man of being a racist.
I’m no expert of black studies scholarship, so Gates may not be as bad as I think he is. I’m sure he’s not the worst. But his actions in this incident do say quite a bit. If he says something else tomorrow, perhaps issues an apology and explains his offensive behavior, I will be happy to reevaluate how I feel about him. I must say that the fact that he hasn’t apologized by now does not help his case. Or Obama’s for that matter.
If you didn’t get it from my last response, nothing I say will help. I was throwing his racial stereotyping back in his face. You don’t think it’s funny? Well now you know how I feel with 99% of Luci’s attempts on this board. ::shrugs:: Though today he had a pretty good day. I think it was down to about 97.
Actually, I have a Masters in Black Studies. And Cornell West is my brother-in-law. He told me to never read anything by Ogbu or Patterson, so I know nothing of them.
Seriously, I know very little about black studies. From what I’ve been exposed to on radio and TV I have very little desire to expose myself to more of the nonsense I’ve heard (not that it all is, I’m sure). When it comes to an academic’s take on race relations I do like hearing what John McWhorter has to say. Though he isn’t of exactly the same academic stripe.
But, Jesse Jackson is the worst thing to happen to race relations since the minstrel show.
You’re posting in one right now in the Pit.
You are shoehorning Gates into that characterization based on this one event. Buchanan has made racist statements, but you are not willing to say he is racist. Gates, in your opinion, has made racist statements, but you are very willing to say he’s racist. Why, aside from partisanship, would you defend Buchanan and condemn Gates? I think Buchanan has a much lengthier history of making clearly racist statements, but he gets all kinds of latitude with you. Why?
Have you read any of Gates’ work? Or have you come to a snap judgment about what’s in the man’s heart based on one event? Do you think you’re being fair?
I think Buchanan’s words were absolutely racist. They were also delivered in a rational, thought out manner that suggests that he holds them close to his heart. Gates spoke his in a situation where he was not at his best. Why is it OK to stamp Gates RACIST but not Buchanan? Please, articulate the difference as best you can for me.
Are you a mind reader? You don’t know what was on his mind, only what he said. Have you never freaked out and said things that were exaggerated and meaner than you felt? If so, your canonization is surely pending.
What are these ugliest racial stereotypes? “Are you doing this because I’m black and you’re white?” and “This is how you treat a black man in America,” etc., are not particularly ugly IMO. Buchanan’s words were just as ugly about Sotomayor. I don’t see why one person’s words give you the right to judge and condemn, but another’s have to be viewed with nuance and flexibility. You have a double standard and you have not articulated why you think it’s justified.
Just what do you know about black studies scholarship? What have you read? What qualifies you to judge Gates’ entire life and body of work? Why can’t I judge Buchanan similarly without you getting all up in arms?
What more explanation do you need but that he was sick, tired, jet lagged, confused, and upset? People behave in uncharacteristic ways when they are feeling poorly. Based on this, you can dismiss him and label. Well, sauce for the goose should be sauce for the gander, but it’s not. Not with you.
Please name some white racists that are prominent in academia and national politics. You should be able to do it with ease if you are so attuned to who is racist. Or is it only people of color you think are racist?