# Obama speaks: 'people, due to the extent of damage from \[insert event\], the election is cancelled' **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 27, 2012, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444 "2012-06-27T10:33:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![benbo1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19adc/32.png) [@benbo1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/benbo1)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/1 "2012-06-27T10:33:54Z")
So let’s say in the summer or fall, we have a big terrorist attack or natural disaster (say the Cascadia fault goes active, which it does every 300 years, last time early 1700s). The damage is enormous: 1,000s dead, millions of acres destroyed, rescue infrastructure (equipment, food, medicine, etc.) stretched to the limit. The Big O goes on tv and says that due to technical considerations, logistix, inability to spare anyone from the rescue/damage control operation underway, there simply is no way to prepare the voting system in time for Election Day, and the election is suspended indefinitely until further notice. Even if he’s wrong on the constitutionality (take the example of Obamacare), if Holder supports him (being the top law enforcement official), and Congress is too bz/disorganized to try to impeach, could this happen? We’ve had prez elections everytime since the 1st one, even thru WW2 and the Civil War, when Lincoln and Davis were both re-elected (and of course, the Lincoln election was only held in the Union states). Is there any provision specifically prohibiting an acting prez from suspending elections? Assuming voting is impractical say in Washington state & Oregon due to the damage & logistix, is there a requirement for all states to participate in the electoral college? Or, could he just sensibly say that all states where a voting infrastructure is in place can vote, assuming they get enough pollwatchers, registrars, etc.? Is there any precedent for this, if not here, then another democratic country that holds free elections? In WW2, the occupied countries couldn’t, but I mean has there been any democratic country that suspended an elected leader election? ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/2 "2012-06-27T10:51:59Z")
There is zero chance of this happening and it grows a bit tiresome to answer the question every few years. It doesn’t even matter who is in power this pops right up. Obama cannot, unilaterally, suspend a federal election. If he attempted to do so he’d get injunctioned out the ass in a damn heartbeat. Election’s happened during the Civil War and they’d happen in event of disaster. HOW they happen is a state issue and not one for the federal government to answer. But there’s no chance that they wouldn’t. ---
**Author:** ![GreasyJack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/df705f/32.png) [@GreasyJack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreasyJack)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/3 "2012-06-27T11:02:16Z")
I would imagine that what would be more likely than cancelling the elections outright would be to have all the other states go ahead and vote and allow the affected states a couple of weeks to get reorganized. As much as I dislike the electoral college, I suppose it could come in handy here too-- if things were really bad, the state could just allow the electors to vote whichever way they thought things were going to go. It would be a very unideal situation, but at least in the Cascadia scenario, there probably wouldn’t be much doubt as to which way that was. Unless things were so bad that people in the liberal west half of those states no longer outnumbered those in the east… ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/4 "2012-06-27T11:03:29Z")
The office of the president has no participation in the mechanics of a presidential election. The president has no power or authority to stop it from happening. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/5 "2012-06-27T11:52:03Z")
Presumably such a “decree” would have to be a law signed passed by congress and signed by the president. Even then, as others pointed out, IIRC the mechanics of it is that there are 50 state elections and the agreement of the states is needed? Conceivably the states not directly affected could go ahead. Of course, they can’t really “allow” or “direct” electors from affected states to vote, because there is no electoral college until the vote. AFAIK the last election’s electors do not get to stay in power and vote again. They’re done in 2008/2009. Not sure what the law says on them, but I presume since it’s never happened, that the governor of the affected state cannot appoint them. Maybe the local election commission can? Sounds like the process is so complicated that nobody is going to make a wholesale change of date any time. Has there ever been a case of snowstorm, flood, or hurricane etc. that postponed or extended any signicant part of an area’s federal election? As for the snide about Obamacare, that too was voted on and passed by a majority of both houses and signed into law. It was not a presidential decree, so I fail to see what the point was in tossing it in. If a majority of 500-plus politicians think something is legal under the constitution, either the system is in dire need of reform or _ **more likely** _, it’s sufficiently close to the line that there is a valid argument to be made about its legitimacy from either point of view. That is why the final decision is up to an even handed, impartial, non-partisan group who do not bring their personal political views into the decision, eh? ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/6 "2012-06-27T12:09:34Z")
If this is the usual paranoia then presumably the president would have declared martial law and suspended the constitution due to some supposed national emergency and then they start taking people away to the FEMA camps. heres a link to the same paranoia about bush suspending the 2008 election: [http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/07/31/2874](http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/07/31/2874) ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/7 "2012-06-27T12:10:14Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > Election’s happened during the Civil War and they’d happen in event of disaster. Well, up to a point; if you have something like a serious asteroid strike or the Yellowstone supervolcano goes off, there may simply be no way to contact any survivors. You’d have to go with something like **GreasyJack** ’s electoral college solution. Although that brings up the question of how much representation a state gets in an election (or after) if there’s literally no one left alive there. ---
**Author:** ![Alley\_Dweller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alley_dweller/32/430_2.png) [@Alley\_Dweller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alley_Dweller)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/8 "2012-06-27T12:21:49Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > Of course, they can’t really “allow” or “direct” electors from affected states to vote, because there is no electoral college until the vote. AFAIK the last election’s electors do not get to stay in power and vote again. They’re done in 2008/2009. Not sure what the law says on them, but I presume since it’s never happened, that the governor of the affected state cannot appoint them. Maybe the local election commission can? The Constitution of the United States says: > [@](#): > > Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, equal to the whole Number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: but no Senator or Representative, or Person holding an Office of Trust or Profit under the United States, shall be appointed an Elector. > > The Congress may determine the time of choosing the electors, and the day on which they shall give their votes; which day shall be the same throughout the United States. You may remember that in 2000, the Florida state legislature was about to appoint its electors, but the Supreme Court handed down its decision before they finished, making it unnecessary. ---
**Author:** ![Fool\_in\_the\_Rain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8491ac/32.png) [@Fool\_in\_the\_Rain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fool_in_the_Rain)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/9 "2012-06-27T12:21:51Z")
It seems a study was done concerning postponing elections in 2004 by the Congressional Research Service - The Library of Congress Mods: I only took three paragraphs from a 19 page report - of course please edit if need be. From here – WARNING PDF > **[RL32623.pdf](https://sgp.fas.org/crs/RL32623.pdf)** CRS Report for Congress Received through the CRS Web Order Code RL32623 Postponement and Rescheduling of Elections to Federal Office October 4, 2004 > [@](#): > > **Summary** > Because of the fear of possible terrorist attacks which could be directed at > election facilities or voters in the States just prior to or during the elections in a > presidential election year, attention has been directed at the possibility/authority to > postpone, cancel or reschedule an election for federal office. The United States > Constitution does not provide in express language any current authority for a federal > official or institution to “postpone” an election for federal office. While the > Constitution does expressly devolve upon the States the primary authority to > administer within their respective jurisdictions elections for federal office, there > remains within the Constitution a residual and superceding authority in the Congress > over most aspects of congressional elections (Article I, Section 5, clause 1), and an > express authority in Congress over at least the timing of the selections of presidential > electors in the States (Article II, Section 1, clause 4). Under this authority Congress > has legislated a uniform date for presidential electors to be chosen in the States, and > a uniform date for congressional elections across the country, which are to be on the > Tuesday immediately following the first Monday in November in the particular, > applicable even-numbered election years. > [@](#): > > **Current Federal Authority to Postpone** > As noted, the United States Constitution does not provide any express authority > to any federal official or institution to postpone an election for federal office in a > particular State, or in all of the States. Specifically, there is no current constitutional > authority residing in the President of the United States, nor the executive branch of Government, to postpone, cancel, or reschedule elections for federal office in the > various States.15 There might certainly be some potential emergency powers inherent > in the President of the United States, as well as those delegated by statute, but there > is no precedent for such powers being applied with respect to elections held in the > various States for presidential electors,16 authority over which, as to the procedures > and methods, has been expressly delegated in the Constitution to the States.17 It is > possible that some scenarios could be imagined, however, where attacks, disruptions > and destruction are so severe and so dangerous in certain localities, particularly in > crowded urban areas, that the President under a rule of necessity may look to protect > the public safety by federalizing State national guard and restricting movement and > activities in such areas which would obviously affect the ability to conduct an > election at those sites.18 > Unlike the President, Congress does have explicit constitutional authority over > elections to federal office which is of an express, residual nature concerning > congressional elections,19 and a broad implicit authority recognized by the Supreme > Court to legislate to protect the integrity and proceedings of presidential elections > as well as express authority over the date of the selection of presidential electors. > Congress could, therefore, pass legislation regarding dates, and emergency > postponements and/or rescheduling times for elections to federal offices. > > The courts have recognized an expansive authority in the Congress to “provide a complete code” for federal elections within the States, including presidential elections, and, within the parameters of the specific dates for the length and terms of federal offices established within the Constitution, could exercise its legislative discretion with regard to emergency scheduling and rescheduling.22 As noted by the Supreme Court earlier in our history with regard to Congress’ authority over the conduct of elections for federal office in the States: > > _That a government whose essential character is republican, whose executive > head and legislative body are both elective … , has no power by appropriate laws > to secure this election from the influence of violence … is a proposition so > startling as to arrest attention and demand the gravest consideration. > If this government is anything more than a mere aggregation of delegated > agents of other States and governments, each of which is superior to the general > government, it must have the power to protect the elections on which its > existence depends from violence and corruption._ ---
**Author:** ![Alley\_Dweller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alley_dweller/32/430_2.png) [@Alley\_Dweller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alley_Dweller)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/10 "2012-06-27T12:27:19Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > The office of the president has no participation in the mechanics of a presidential election. The president has no power or authority to stop it from happening. Not even in the states covered under the Voting Rights Act? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/11 "2012-06-27T12:59:21Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > There is zero chance of this happening and it grows a bit tiresome to answer the question every few years. It doesn’t even matter who is in power this pops right up. Yeah, really, and I seem to recall even some mumblings of that with Clinton… what’s the matter with this? This is Stupid Internet Meme number howmuch? From all the sources we have, it would take an Act of Congress to postpone the\* date the election results are due in\* for federal offices. A disaster of such scale that you can’t assemble a functioning rump-quorum of Congress in time (and it doesn’t have to be in DC) to do something would be something of a scale as to make it damn obvious to everyone it’s time for desperate measures. ---
**Author:** ![Iggy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iggy/32/3364_2.png) [@Iggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iggy)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/12 "2012-06-27T13:01:53Z")
> [@benbo1](#): > > \ Is there any precedent for this, if not here, then another democratic country that holds free elections? In WW2, the occupied countries couldn’t, but I mean has there been any democratic country that suspended an elected leader election? Yes, there is precedent. On Sept 11-12, 2004[Hurricane Ivan](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Ivan#Cayman_Islands) destroyed much of the infrastructure of Grand Cayman. Elections scheduled, and required by law, for early November 2004 [were suspended.](http://www.destination.ky/government-information-list) New elections were set for May 2005, a six month deferral. About 25% of residences were made uninhabitable. 85% were damaged in some way. Large areas of the island were without electricity and water for at least two months. The population did not in any serious way complain. We were too busy hauling buckets of water to flush our toilets to really care. The two smaller islands, which are about 90 miles to the northeast, were not seriously damaged by the storm. They could have organized a November election with no problem. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/13 "2012-06-27T13:26:33Z")
In Canada, federal elections were postponed for one year during WWI, by vote of the Parliament itself. The election was eventually held in 1917, instead of in 1915 (which would have been the normal four year cycle) or in 1916, which would have been the usual termination for the Parliament elected in 1911. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/14 "2012-06-27T13:27:26Z")
What I find hilarious is the repetition of this request. I registered here in 1999, and don’t recall any such questions about the Bush-Gore election being cancelled. But Bush was going to cancel the '04 and '08 elections, as well as the midterms in '02 and '06, and now Obama is going to cancel the '12. It’s as though the past 213 years of cancel-free elections had never happened. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/15 "2012-06-27T13:41:42Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > It’s as though the past 213 years of cancel-free elections had never happened. But this time it’s fer_reals_. You’re forgetting that every previous president has been a natural born US citizen, a Christian, and a lover of Democracy and America. This Obama guy, however… ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/16 "2012-06-27T13:48:25Z")
> [@Inigo\_Montoya](#): > > But this time it’s fer_reals_. You’re forgetting that every previous president has been a natural born US citizen, a Christian, and a lover of Democracy and America. This Obama guy, however… Good point. We fell victim to one of the classic blunders. Never go up against a Kenyan, when DEATH is on the line. ---
**Author:** ![MikeS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MikeS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeS)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/17 "2012-06-27T13:53:26Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Although that brings up the question of how much representation a state gets in an election (or after) if there’s literally no one left alive there. Well, here’s some armchair lawyering: The Constitution says that they get two senators and one representative, and therefore at least three electoral votes. However, the procedure by which congressional representation is apportioned is set by Congress, not by the Constitution; the Constitution only requires that “representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers.” Currently, it’s done [every ten years on the basis of the decennial census.](http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/2/2a) But theoretically, Congress wouldn’t have to wait for the next decennial census if, say, a meteor wiped out Iowa in 2021; they could pass a law reapportioning congressional representation at any time, such as to reduce the representation of a state whose population had fallen drastically. ETA: If there’s _literally_ nobody left alive, though, and the state is completely uninhabitable? No idea. My guess would be that there would simply be no election in that state, no electors from that state, and whoever got a majority of the other (538-N) electors would gain the presidency. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/18 "2012-06-27T14:34:31Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > What I find hilarious is the repetition of this request. I registered here in 1999, and don’t recall any such questions about the Bush-Gore election being cancelled. But Bush was going to cancel the '04 and '08 elections, as well as the midterms in '02 and '06, and now Obama is going to cancel the '12. > > It’s as though the past 213 years of cancel-free elections had never happened. I remember being told in a very serious manner that there was no way that Clinton was going to give up the presidency. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/19 "2012-06-27T14:58:40Z")
> [@MikeS](#): > > Well, here’s some armchair lawyering: The Constitution says that they get two senators and one representative, and therefore at least three electoral votes. However, the procedure by which congressional representation is apportioned is set by Congress, not by the Constitution; the Constitution only requires that “representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers.” Currently, it’s done [every ten years on the basis of the decennial census.](http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/2/2a) But theoretically, Congress wouldn’t have to wait for the next decennial census if, say, a meteor wiped out Iowa in 2021; they could pass a law reapportioning congressional representation at any time, such as to reduce the representation of a state whose population had fallen drastically. > > ETA: If there’s _literally_ nobody left alive, though, and the state is completely uninhabitable? No idea. My guess would be that there would simply be no election in that state, no electors from that state, and whoever got a majority of the other (538-N) electors would gain the presidency. I see the quote about the constitution did not specify residency requirement. Presumably, the inhabitants of the state on vacation at the time, or recent emigrants to other states could get together and have a set of byelections to fill vacant legislature seats, governnor, etc. and take it from there with a “government in exile”. I assume if even 1 state official is left alive, judge or dogcatcher, they pick up the pieces and run with it? (Yeah, yeah, dogcatcher is city or county… park ranger, then…) Worst case, the people of the state have a constitutional convention to fill in the missing pieces… Depends on the state law and constitution - I asume at least one copy exists somewhere outside the state… If the feds can create states, perhaps they can declare someone governor or recognize a petition to reboot the state constitution in extreme circumstances too? ---
**Author:** ![fiddlesticks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddlesticks/32/18129_2.png) [@fiddlesticks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fiddlesticks)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2012, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444/20 "2012-06-27T15:02:13Z")
Absolutely, you just weren’t reading the right corners of the Internet **Bricker**! The Clintons had Vince Foster murdered (by Hillary’s own hand!) and Ron Brown taken care of along with a bunch of others in the plane crash in Croatia. You think the Clintons were going to let a little thing like the Constitution stand in their way of a leading a One World Goverment? There were FEMA concentration camp being constructed to deal with troublemakers, UN troops would be deployed to occupy the country! I SAW THE MAPS, MAN! [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-speaks-people-due-to-the-extent-of-damage-from-insert-event-the-election-is-cancelled/626444.md?page=2)