# Obama Spending Two Million to Hide His Records **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 5, 2011, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618 "2011-03-05T22:01:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/21 "2011-03-07T13:16:03Z")
**Obama Spending Two Million To Hide His Records** The $2 million figure seems a bit high, but I have it on excellent authority that he’s trying to hide a lot of records, including [this one](http://www.amazon.com/Physical-Olivia-Newton-John/dp/B000002PC6/ref=sr_1_13?ie=UTF8&qid=1299503475&sr=8-13). and [this one.](http://www.amazon.com/Frampton-Comes-Alive-Peter/dp/B000009HF2/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1299503714&sr=1-1) If word leaked, the consequences wouldn’t be pretty. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/22 "2011-03-07T15:07:21Z")
Frampton Comes Alive? That practically defined my generation! I think the record he’s really trying to hide is Leo Sayer - that would be embarrassing. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/23 "2011-03-07T15:12:59Z")
The problem is this the whole premise is illogical. The records belong to the government of Hawaii who have the responsibility to hold and maintain them and divulge them only to qualified parties - ie., under privacy laws, the persons mentioned in the documents. All the lawyers in the world don’t change that one way or another, so how does “spending millions” on lawyers “to hide” it make a difference? Of course, when you have 10% or more of the population apparently convinced of a patently moronic lie, what are the odds that one person, for some reason, would NOT go into the semi-deserted stacks of old documents and remove/destroy critical information? I have not heard that Hawaii immediately put a “collect and lock it up” order on the birth certificate, so it was in a deserted archive with millions of others, free for the taking. Considering that the governor said they can’t find it now, it would not surprise me if that has happened. OTOH, it was Napoleon who once said (IIRC) “never ascribe to malice what can best be explained by incompetenece.” What are the odds the Hawaii records are in very good shape? The moronic part of the whole birther conspiracy is that I have not seen a shred of evidence that an 8-month pregnant woman abandoned her studies and flew half-way around the world in 1960 (remember DC6 prop planes? I flew on a DC3 outside of North America in 1961) to the 3rd world to give birth, nor any evidence that she or her son spent any time away from Hawaii. In fact, IIRC, therse was an interview with a nurse who worked at the Hawaii hospital and remembered Obama’s birth. (Not too many white women having black children in those days…) Plus, the birth announcement in the Hawaii papers. All the OP can eventually prove is that a presidential candidate needs to spend serious bucks on legal help, whether he’s Obama, McCain, Kerry, Clinton, or Bush A or B. It’s part of everything from filing documents for candidacy to signing leases for offices and contracts for advertising; not to mention legal documents for campaign finaicing rules, audits of money, etc. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/24 "2011-03-07T15:32:03Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > I think the record he’s really trying to hide is Leo Sayer - that would be embarrassing. He makes him feel like dancin’! ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/25 "2011-03-07T17:08:21Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > For the last couple of years, ever since Obama became a serious candidate, the birthers have charged that he has paid his lawyers huge sums of money to hide his birth certificate and all his other records. Looks like you [better add SCOTUS](http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/03/07/supreme-court-rejects-appeal-from-birther-advocate/?hpt=T2) to this list of payoffs. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/26 "2011-03-07T17:17:22Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > The problem is this the whole premise is illogical. Didn’t you read the part in the OP when I said explicity that I don’t want a debate on the birth certificate, I just wanted facts? > [@](#): > > OTOH, it was Napoleon who once said (IIRC) “never ascribe to malice what can best be explained by incompetenece.” Oh. Well, if this is what you think of as a fact, then you shouldn’t ever be posting in GQ. ---
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/27 "2011-03-07T18:21:11Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > OTOH, it was Napoleon who once said (IIRC) “never ascribe to malice what can best be explained by incompetenece.” I was under the impression that earlier versions of this quote go all the way back to Egypt’s Bent Pyramid. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2011, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/28 "2011-03-08T03:06:21Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Didn’t you read the part in the OP when I said explicity that I don’t want a debate on the birth certificate, I just wanted facts? > > Oh. Well, if this is what you think of as a fact, then you shouldn’t ever be posting in GQ. Cliff notes version, then: Lawyers doing what exactly? Birth certificates are protected by privacy laws. No lawyers needed. A significant number of people either believe this claptrap, or see political advantage in promoting this while knowing it is claptrap. Some of the people who feel one of those ways likely have access to the Hawaii archives. If so, any surprise if the records have disappeared. The governor of Hawaii mentioned the record cannot be found. The missing records could be incompetence or disorganization… Such things happen in government sometimes. Side note - zero evidence that Obama or mother left country when he was due. Plenty of other evidence that Obama was born and spent formative years in Hawaii - so again, what are all those high priced lawyers working on? A presidential campaign uses lawyers for a lot of things. Lawyers cost money. If a presidential campaign costs hundreds of millions, any surprise if part of that goes to lawyers? Much of that money has very little to do with finding, showing, hiding or counterfeiting birth certificates. I listed some. I bet you can think of others. In a self-fulfilling prophecy, some of this money is spent defending against suits brought by those cynically malevolent or seriously delusional types who find this kind of distraction amusing or convenient. Have I covered enough points? ---
**Author:** ![toadspittle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@toadspittle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toadspittle)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2011, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/29 "2011-03-08T03:35:20Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > Have I covered enough points? He wasn’t asking you to cover points. Or to disprove the birther conspiracy theories. He’s trying to do some historical (etymological?) sleuthing, so he can find out the source of the meme that “Obama has spent $x million on lawyers to keep these documents hidden.” The OP doesn’t care that the premise of the birther claim about the lawyers is absurd. He just wants to know where it started. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2011, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/30 "2011-03-08T13:47:06Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > The governor of Hawaii mentioned the record cannot be found. Cite? I’ve heard that said before but haven’t been able to find a source. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2011, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/31 "2011-04-07T19:34:49Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > Cite? I’ve heard that said before but haven’t been able to find a source. It comes from here: > [@](#): > > Mike Evans told [FoxNews.com](http://FoxNews.com) on Wednesday he was remorseful and embarrassed that he appeared to have given the impression that he had discussed the search for Obama’s birth certificate with Hawaii Gov. Neil Abercrombie. > > Evans, who says he has been a close friend of Abercrombie since the 1980s, appeared on Minnesota’s KQRS radio last week and said he’d been told by the governor himself that Obama’s birth certificate was nowhere to be found. . . > > “I was on 34 radio stations that morning. That was the only station where I said, instead of saying ‘the hospital said there’s no birth certificate’ I misspoke and said Neil said that,” Evans said. “I misspoke and I apologize for that. I apologize to Neil.” > > [http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01/26/celebrity-journalist-says-he-never-talked-hawaii-governor-obama-birth/#ixzz1IrjCYIh2](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01/26/celebrity-journalist-says-he-never-talked-hawaii-governor-obama-birth/#ixzz1IrjCYIh2) Abercrombie was friends with the Obamas during the President’s childhood, and initially said he would go further than previous Republican Hawai’i Governor Linda Lingle, and not just release a statement, but release additional documents that would prove Obama’s birth occurred in Hawai’i. Ultimately, whether he was able to find anything or not, he was reminded by the State’s Attorney General that privacy laws forbid him from releasing anything even if he did find something. But the fact is, there is no “long form” birth certificate in existence anywhere on the planet. There are no shelves with boxes of documents being warehoused somewhere that someone could just dig through and find this elusive form. That’s because Hawai’i started transferring all their paper Vital Records to digital format in the 1990s, copying documents to microfiche, entering the data into a computerized system and destroying all originals. The computerized system went fully into use for recording all births in Hawai’i in 2001, so no one born in 2001 or after will have ever even _had_ a “long form” birth certificate. Anyone and everyone, including the President of the United States of America, who requests a certified copy of their birth records from the Office of Vital Statistics from Hawai’i, will get a document that looks exactly like the one the President provided during the campaign. Nothing else exists. ---
**Author:** ![Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/96bed5/32.png) [@Patty\_O\_Furniture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patty_O_Furniture)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2011, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/32 "2011-04-07T19:40:22Z")
> [@thelabdude](#): > > As I mentioned in thread on the UK and Holacast… The Spanish broadcasting station? ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2011, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/33 "2011-04-07T19:47:18Z")
Presumed presidential candidate Donald was repeating this nonsence on MSNBC’s _Morning Joe_ today. The conservative members of the show’s panel, including Pat Buchanan, were telling Donald that they supported his ideas and candidacy, but for the Love of God, please drop the birther stuff. But he doubled down, insisting that Obama was born in Kenya and his grandmother said so and the newpaper clippings were submitted by his Hawaian grandparents and yada, yada, yada… It was funny when one of the hosts said “For goodness sake, when _Pat Buchanan_ is telling you to drop it, you know you’ve gone too far.” ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2011, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/34 "2011-04-07T19:50:40Z")
[Politifacts.com](http://Politifacts.com) should have something on this soon, as Donald Trump has recently made the same statement. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2011, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/35 "2011-04-07T20:05:32Z")
> [@Shayna](#): > > But the fact is, there is no “long form” birth certificate in existence anywhere on the planet. There are no shelves with boxes of documents being warehoused somewhere that someone could just dig through and find this elusive form. That’s because Hawai’i started transferring all their paper Vital Records to digital format in the 1990s, copying documents to microfiche, entering the data into a computerized system and destroying all originals. The computerized system went fully into use for recording all births in Hawai’i in 2001, so no one born in 2001 or after will have ever even _had_ a “long form” birth certificate. Anyone and everyone, including the President of the United States of America, who requests a certified copy of their birth records from the Office of Vital Statistics from Hawai’i, will get a document that looks exactly like the one the President provided during the campaign. Nothing else exists. My memory was incorrect on this point, I apologize. Hawai’i did copy all vital records to microfiche, enter the data into the computer system, and cease creating paper copies in 2001. However. . . Hawai’i did keep the originals and they _are_ in boxes somewhere. > [@](#): > > The Health Department’s director reiterated yesterday that she has seen Obama’s birth records. > > “I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawai’i State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawai’i State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawai’i and is a natural-born American citizen,” Fukino said in a statement. “I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008, over eight months ago.” > > . . . > > In 2001, Hawai’i’s paper documents were reproduced in electronic format but “any paper data prior to that still exists,” Health Department spokeswoman Okubo said. > > Okubo would not say where Obama’s original birth certificate is, but said “we have backups for all of our backups.” > [Hawaii officials confirm Obama�s original birth certificate still exists | The Honolulu Advertiser | Hawaii's Newspaper](http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2009/Jul/28/ln/hawaii907280345.html) ---
**Author:** ![Spavined\_Gelding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2011, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/36 "2011-04-07T21:29:03Z")
Does anyone else find it ironic that the world’s great religions, on which actual billions base their lives and for which they kill each other, have documentary and historical foundations that are considerably more shaky than the President’s nativity? What do you suppose would happen if Friend Trump decried the lack of corroboration for the birth and paternity of Jesus Christ or Brother Romney announced he wasn‘t accepting any of that Latter Day Saint stuff until he actually saw and hefted the Golden Tablets? Life‘s funny isn‘t it? ---
**Author:** ![CC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f1d935/32.png) [@CC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CC)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2011, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/37 "2011-04-07T22:06:34Z")
Look, people - if \*\*Exapno Mapcase \*\*can’t find something in writing someplace, it doesn’t exist. Next thread. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2011, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/38 "2011-04-08T00:34:32Z")
> [@CC](#): > > Look, people - if \*\*Exapno Mapcase \*\*can’t find something in writing someplace, it doesn’t exist. > > Next thread. I blush. But I also firmly believe that everybody can do more than anybody. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Lynda9596](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bcef8e/32.png) [@Lynda9596](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynda9596)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/39 "2011-04-11T03:15:02Z")
> [@samclem](#): > > Seven replies–seven useless replies. Can anyone help the OP? > > Anyone have any info on the figures? I found this info in regards to the ridiculous figure of $2 million being spent on these alleged court fights. "Obama has spent very little on defending himself in lawsuits. Of the 66 or so lawsuits involving eligibility, only 3 required Obama to personally defend himself. The others were against various state and federal officials claiming Obama (and McCain) were ineligible to be on the ballot or were ineligible Electors. These suits were paid for by the named parties, not Obama. Suits filed after the election have been defended by the Department of Justice. None of the cases ever survived a Motion to Dismiss, many were dismissed without requiring a response from the defendants. In a few cases, the defendants were awarded costs, each under $1000. Law suits are cheap up to that stage – depositions, discovery, and trial are where the real money racks up." There is NOTHING that backs up this claim and it doesn’t matter who says it is true, whether it is Trump, Taitz, or any other RWNJ, until they provide legitimate proof of this claim that our President spent this outrageous sum of money, nothing they say will make it true. Look at how many nonsensical interviews have gone on with Trump and others from the GOP talking about how “if the President would only release his BC, then this matter could be settled”. Even Palin, who up until now wouldn’t touch the issue more than likely due to birth certificate issues relating to her own family, is now saying Trump is absolutely correct in pursuing this theory of his. During the 2008 election, we had two candidates, one of them was definitely born outside the U.S. and yet because his parents were U.S. citizens, he was considered a natural born citizen. This would be true whether he was born on a military base or not. And yet, who is being treated in such a despicable manner, the man whose father was African, whose mother was American and who was born on U.S. soil. The same man who provided his birth certificate is the one criticized and accused of providing a forged copy based on absolutely no evidence whatsoever. The hypocrisy is overwhelming. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618/40 "2011-04-11T17:51:24Z")
Salon has an article about it, they say it originated from a WorldNutDaily article. [http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war\_room/2011/04/11/trump\_palin\_two\_million\_birther/index.html](http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2011/04/11/trump_palin_two_million_birther/index.html) > [@](#): > > While the $2 million figure has now been invoked thousands of times around the Web, it appears to have originated on WorldNetDaily, a right-wing news website that conducts original (and often unreliable) reporting on a variety of conspiracy theories. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-spending-two-million-to-hide-his-records/573618.md?page=3)