# Obama Stands With Mexican Prez, Against Az Law **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 19, 2010, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050 "2010-05-19T20:23:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/141 "2010-05-20T03:14:50Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Illegal immigrants are coming here for jobs to support their families in Mexico. Most of them don’t want to stay here, they would rather be in Mexico if there were jobs. They are not going to stay here without a job on the slim chance that some day in the future there may be an amnesty. Citizenship is not attracting them to America; illegal jobs are. Put out the candle, and the moths will go away. Actually, people who come here to work hard and make a better life for themselves and for their families are the people who built this country. Not only should we be welcoming the current crop of such immigrants, we should be saying, “Hey! Take off your coat and stay awhile. Bring the wife and the rugrats! Make yourself at home.” ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/142 "2010-05-20T03:23:54Z")
> [@matt\_mcl](#): > > Canada is separated from you by an ocean now? > > So that’s what all those rumbling noises last month were. And you wouldn’t _believe_ the size of the saw we had to use. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/143 "2010-05-20T03:34:24Z")
> [@matt\_mcl](#): > > Canada is separated from you by an ocean now? > > So that’s what all those rumbling noises last month were. Why is anyone pretending that the flood of illegal immigrants into the USA is from anywhere other than south of the border? Sure, there’s some exceptions, but by and large…um, yeah, Shoe fits, wear it. Now what to be done about it (if anything), now there’s a political firepoker! ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/144 "2010-05-20T04:02:39Z")
If I’m gettin’ what the OP is laying down, then this is what Obama really should have said, > [@](#): > > Originally Not Said by [[del] **Da Nazz** [/del]](http://www.informer.org/nazz.html) **Da Prezz** > > “Hipsters, flipsters and finger-poppin’ daddies: knock me your lobes. In the United States of America, every law-abiding person, be they an American citizen, a legal immigrant, or a visitor or tourist from Mexico or any of them other far-out far out countries, should always be subjected to suspicion simply because of what they look like.” In which case (with the exception of visiting tourists and touring visitors, 'cos tourists are money!) I, for one, heartily agree! It’s about fucking time, some folks, finally get to fucking learn what life is really fucking like, when you don’t have your fucking White Skin Privilege. CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/145 "2010-05-20T04:05:18Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > That makes no sense at all. > > The whole racism angle is not only irrelevant here, it is also a losing political strategy. Most people think advocating open immigration is vaguely treasonous, but they are told that it is impossible to enforce immigration laws without being racist. Waitaminute. How did a characterization of “open immigration” find its way into the discussion? My first inclination is to suspect that it was introduced by someone interested in dishonestly trashing the President, by associating him with the concept of disloyalty to the land of his birth. But do feel free to disabuse me of such a cynical notion, **Hyperelastic**. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/146 "2010-05-20T13:51:00Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > You’re saying that people want to stop illegal immigration from Mexico because they want to exploit their labor. Clearly this is counter-productive. The reality is that most of the country’s citizens, once again, what illegal immigration stopped, yet we have a government that isn’t lifting a finger to stop it. I believe that in GWB’s case this was because he felt the country benefitted from their labor, and in Obama’s case it’s because like most liberals he thinks that any attempt to make minority people obey the law is racist. But in neither case is it the country’s populace who want to allow illegal immigration to continue, and it isn’t the country’s populace who is attempting to profit from their labor. To the contrary, most are perfectly willing to see the country do without their labor in order to bring illegal immigration under control and put a stop to it. Looked at another way–the harsher our treatment of discovered illegal immigrants, the more of a stick is available to the unscrupulous who would hire said immigrants–“Here’s your forged social security number. We’re going to wink at it now, but one step over the line or one complaint about how hard we work you and we’ll ‘discover’ the error and turn you over to border patrol.” is the implied threat in any law that addresses the illegal immigrant without also addressing employers of illegals. Frankly, as a center-left guy, we need the two-pronged approach, I just don’t think stopping people randomly is going to do it. We should be hunting illegals exactly like we hunt prostitutes and johns–sting operations in both directions, and busting both when we catch 'em. We’d dry up illegal immigration a lot faster if illegals can’t get jobs over here, and the best way to do that is to look for employers (preferentially, perhaps, in industries that typically hire illegals) and then not only bust the employer but round up his illegal workforce and send them home. This serves several functions: - removes the implicit racism inherent in checking papers randomly (sure, most illegals are hispanic, but a good portion of legal citizens down that way are also hispanic). - stops the problem at the source of the “carrot” as you said before–the problem here is the employers are the supplier of the cash that the illegals want. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/147 "2010-05-20T13:59:53Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > dishonestly trashing the President, by associating him with the concept of disloyalty to the **land of his birth**. > > \*\*. Johny Carson Voice: Mexicans can swim all the way to Kenya or Hawai? I did not know that. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/148 "2010-05-20T14:10:20Z")
There’s not going to be a pony after all, is there? Not even the sweet potato pie Obama promised. Damn Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![heatmiserfl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/df705f/32.png) [@heatmiserfl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/heatmiserfl)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/149 "2010-05-20T14:29:25Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > As expected, a bunch of posts from people who Don’t Get It. > > You’re going to be in for a surprise in November, and it ain’t going to be extra marshmallow on your sweet potato casserole. I’m not quite sure I get it yet. Is the sweet potato casserole a dig at soul food that the Black president is force feeding us? If so, what does the extra marshmallow mean? Is that supposed to make it more soul-like or does it have something to do with marshmallows being white to make white people accept being force-fed soul food? Anyway, I want a pure white pony with blue eyes. ---
**Author:** ![campp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@campp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/campp)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/150 "2010-05-20T14:35:16Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > If it’s that bad, and that rampant, and has been for any length of time, then this new law won’t fix anything. In fact, I want to know just what the fuck The Law has been doing so far. Nothing, if it’s that bad already. Well, nothing so far. But we can all start checking for numbers after July 29, 2010. That’s when the new law _begins_. ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/848f3c/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_Dunlop)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/151 "2010-05-20T14:38:35Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > I continue to be bewildered (albeit pleased) as to why the Republicans continue to shoot themselves in the foot re Hispanics. There’s a natural affinity for the party with many Hispanics, at least the devoutly religious and/or conservative types. Enough of an affinity that I think the GOP could pull fairly close to a 50-50 split of the Hispanic vote if they quit kowtowing to the Know Nothing wing of the party. Some people look at projections for long-term demographic trends and ask, “How can we win the increasingly important Hispanic voters’ loyalty?”, others ask, “Is there any way we can force these people out of the country? They’re pretty much all illegal, right? Right?” ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/152 "2010-05-20T14:42:56Z")
> [@heatmiserfl](#): > > Anyway, I want a pure white pony with blue eyes. And a brown-skinned stable boy to cheaply clean up after it. ---
**Author:** ![heatmiserfl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/df705f/32.png) [@heatmiserfl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/heatmiserfl)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/153 "2010-05-20T14:50:18Z")
> [@descamisado](#): > > And a brown-skinned stable boy to cheaply clean up after it. Oh yes. I’d pay him well though. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/154 "2010-05-20T14:54:32Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > And we won’t do either one for the same reason; we don’t actually want to hamper illegal immigration; we want them to come here illegally because that makes them easier to exploit. And this isn’t about illegal immigration anyway. It’s about racism. Jesus Christ, man. Not only are you a frothing lunatic, you’re not even _internally_ consistent. We pass laws targeting illegals and yet we want them here to abuse them. If it’s the right that’s passing laws discouraging immigration to America, then the people that want illegal immigrants so they can be abused must be the…:eek:! Unless of course you think the law won’t be enforced. In which case, how can you think anyone will be harassing anyone else? > [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Yeah, sure; right until they have to pay more for food and pay more taxes to make up for it. Aha! I see now! I’m actually _for_ illegal immigration. It all makes so much sense now. I _clearly_ never considered the effect on taxes because there’s no way I’d _ever_ pay more taxes so that the law can be enforced. It’s not like I favor having police forces, FBIs, FDAs, DEAs, or anything like that, right? Fucking moron. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/155 "2010-05-20T14:58:19Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > So Hyperelastic has been here a long time for me to just notice he’s a moron. This. I was like, “I thought he wasn’t a crazy person!” ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/156 "2010-05-20T15:02:10Z")
> [@heatmiserfl](#): > > I’m not quite sure I get it yet. Is the sweet potato casserole a dig at soul food that the Black president is force feeding us? If so, what does the extra marshmallow mean? Is that supposed to make it more soul-like or does it have something to do with marshmallows being white to make white people accept being force-fed soul food? > > Anyway, I want a pure white pony with blue eyes. That’s it! Sweet potato pie being “shoved down everyone’s throats” just like mandatory tonsillectomies. We don’t want your forced health care either! We want to die in the streets, like our fathers did before us! They were REAL 'Muricans. And marshmallows are a metaphor for – well – oh, I forget what, but _something_ liberal and awful. Can I have the other pony, the one with the funny foreign name? Cause I have a hard and thankless job for him… ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/157 "2010-05-20T15:04:48Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > Jesus Christ, man. Not only are you a frothing lunatic, you’re not even _internally_ consistent. We pass laws targeting illegals and yet we want them here to abuse them. If it’s the right that’s passing laws discouraging immigration to America, then the people that want illegal immigrants so they can be abused must be the…:eek:! It’s the anti-Mexican xenophobes that are inconsistent. They have not examined the unintended consequences of getting rid of all the illegal labor in Arizona. When the economy stalls because [agriculture is no longer bringing in billions of dollars](http://www.tucsonweekly.com/TheRange/archives/2010/05/13/what-will-sb1070-do-to-arizona-agriculture)from the harvest by illegal workers, conservatives will reconsider, and beg the Mexicans to come back. Arizona is in for a bumpy ride. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/158 "2010-05-20T15:05:55Z")
. > [@Arizona is out of control](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arizona-is-out-of-control/537171/552): > > But meanwhile we still have a huge coyote/drug/drug war/kidnapping/torture/death/border problem. Tired of it. > [@descamisado](#): > > Can you give us some numbers here? > > I’m thinking you should probably separate the “drug/drug/war/kidnapping/torture/death/[general-other-than-petty-crime”] numbers due to illegal drug running (which should be pursued too), from any concerning illegal immigrants crossing the border. I have a feeling this rampant crime everybody is screaming about is not as prevalent as we’re being lead to believe. > [@campp](#): > > Are you kidding? It’s pretty bad. I’m not at all interested in finding cites for all of that, but it is daily life here. Kidnapping capital of the US. Running gun battles on US Interstate freeways between gangs fighting for who “owns” the human cargo they are smuggling. Family members being tortured for money and afraid to come forward. Drop houses hiding in plain sight with sometimes a hundred undocumenteds hiding inside. Small vehicles pulled over with 20 illegals who scatter into the bushes. Asswipes walking across the border and [killing US ranchers](http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/03/29/20100329rancher-killed-at-arizona-ranch.html)and then walking back across. Arizonans afraid to go camping or fishing or boating or anything off-road in the southern part of the state. > [@SteveG1](#): > > If it’s that bad, and that rampant, and has been for any length of time, then this new law won’t fix anything. In fact, I want to know just what the fuck The Law has been doing so far. Nothing, if it’s that bad already. > [@campp](#): > > Well, nothing so far. But we can all start checking for numbers after July 29, 2010. That’s when the new law _begins_. If we don’t start checking numbers until after the law goes into effect, we won’t know if those numbers represent a change from what’s currently happening. So, despite your disinterest in “finding cites for all that,” it’s reasonable to ask you to provide a baseline. Meaning statistics-based cites, not headline-grade anecdotes. Good luck. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/159 "2010-05-20T15:06:00Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > Who thinks that America is incapable of racism? Um…let me rephrase that. Who that is sane thinks this? > > -XT Obviously the OP. He thinks it’s unamerican for Obama to stand with a foreign head of state and trash an American law. That’s bullshit. It’s a god damn racist law. He could stand with Martians and trash it for all I care. The America I know doesn’t condone racism. In fact, to me it makes Obama MORE American because he’s able to recognize that just because something has American origins, doesn’t mean it’s not full of shit. If he wants to stand with Calderon or the Communist Party of China, then it would STILL be a shitty racist law and Obama would STILL be more American than the asshole racists who voted for this law ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2010, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050/160 "2010-05-20T15:12:22Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > And marshmallows are a metaphor for – well – oh, I forget what, but _something_ liberal and awful. You FORGET??!!?? [Please tell me that you’re kidding about that.](http://thecraptastics.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/staypuft.jpg) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-stands-with-mexican-prez-against-az-law/540050.md?page=9)