# Obama tells the truth, conservatives cry like little bitches. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 14, 2008, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239 "2008-04-14T01:10:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/181 "2008-04-15T02:07:22Z")
So, you got several people vying to be the most powerful single person in known space. We are to be surprised that such people are egotistical? Tend to regard themselves as part of an elite? Gasp! But what’s worse, a _liberal_ elite, that seeks to express its superiority by caring for and guiding a people, in direct contradiction to the noble and accepted norm, of expressing your superiority by grabbing everything you can get your hands on. Maybe Obama (and Hillary) are as egotisitical and elitist as say, Donald Trump. (OK, we’re playing fast and loose here…) Even so, they’re a damn sight better human beings. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/182 "2008-04-15T02:10:24Z")
I said that most politicians are that way. Obama gains support on his campaign of not being a typical politician. If he has the same attitudes of condescending arrogance towards the people he plans to govern, then some of that support is misplaced. I’m not saying that is the case, by the way, merely that it’s an issue worth exploring. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/183 "2008-04-15T02:12:57Z")
You gotta read what “Fightin’ Joe” Lieberman has to say. I’d tell you, but you’d swear I was making it up. [http://thinkprogress.org/2008/04/14/lieberman-its-a-good-question-to-ask-if-obama-is-a-marxist/](http://thinkprogress.org/2008/04/14/lieberman-its-a-good-question-to-ask-if-obama-is-a-marxist/) ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/184 "2008-04-15T02:32:26Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] You gotta read what “Fightin’ Joe” Lieberman has to say. I’d tell you, but you’d swear I was making it up. [http://thinkprogress.org/2008/04/14/lieberman-its-a-good-question-to-ask-if-obama-is-a-marxist/](http://thinkprogress.org/2008/04/14/lieberman-its-a-good-question-to-ask-if-obama-is-a-marxist/) [/QUOTE] Radical Islam must be tearing its collective beard out. “Excuse me? What is this, the 1950s? Wasn’t I supposed to be the ultimate bogeyman of the 21st century? Remember me? Kaboom? Buildings fall down? You’re supposed to be afraid of the guy because of his name! Obama! O-b-AMA! Hello? Goddamn it.” ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/185 "2008-04-15T03:46:24Z")
[QUOTE=SenorBeef] Anyway, we’d camp and have cookouts and knock back beers and talk. There was definitely a healthy sentiment of distrust of government in that crowd, a lot of libertarian leanings. But the few times I heard someone trying to tell a racist joke or say something along those lines, they’d usually get shut up along the lines of “do you want people to think we’re a bunch of racist rednecks?” [/QUOTE] Interesting that the concern is about being though of as racist as opposed to being concerned about the racism itself. [QUOTE=John Mace] It’s kinda funny to hear Hillary throw the “elitist” label at Obama. Maybe she just thinks all fair in love and politics, since she got a lot of that back when Bill first ran for president. But she exudes an elitist attitude like few people I can think of, and that’s one reason so many people don’t like her, I think. [/QUOTE] Maybe so. But her base seems to be blue collar Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/186 "2008-04-15T03:56:49Z")
[QUOTE=Yookeroo] Interesting that the concern is about being though of as racist as opposed to being concerned about the racism itself. [/QUOTE] I didn’t mean to convey that message. People like me and most of them know that people like Dio will sometimes group us with white nationalist types, and so we’re especially sensitive to being thought of that way. I can’t completely infer the inner workings of most of the people there, but there was very little of any sort of racism and what little I saw (I can only remember vaguely one incident involving a racist joke) was admoninished. So I doubt many of them were racists. Maybe some secretly were, who knows. But the only incident of racism I recall was quickly ostracized. I think you may be trying to infer a distinction that wasn’t there and wasn’t meaningful, but that may be my fault in the way I told it. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/187 "2008-04-15T04:19:04Z")
> [@](#): > > You gotta read what “Fightin’ Joe” Lieberman has to say. I’d tell you, but you’d swear I was making it up. “I’ll see your dumb remark, and raise you a stupid one.” ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/188 "2008-04-15T05:22:32Z")
[QUOTE=Yookeroo] Maybe so. But her base seems to be blue collar Democrats. [/QUOTE] Yeah, I know. It just seems so strange the way things have flipped. She was the one making fun of cookie-baking housewives 16 years ago, and now she’s gun-totin’ Hill, woman of the people. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/189 "2008-04-15T14:46:15Z")
[QUOTE=Gangster Octopus] If he had said, “cling to **issues like** guns and religon and immigration” would that be different? I ask, b ecause his argument is clearly that folks let the issues of those topics guide them, usually being steered along by conservatives, who play up these issues and ignore the issues that affect their ability to lead happy lives. [/QUOTE] No difference. The second sentence in the quote there brings to light another misconception that urbanites have about people in small towns. Guns aren’t a conservative/liberal issue here. For the most part, the Democrats in Montana hunt (and own guns, natch) in Montana just like the Republicans do. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/190 "2008-04-15T14:54:57Z")
[QUOTE=InvisibleWombat] No difference. The second sentence in the quote there brings to light another misconception that urbanites have about people in small towns. Guns aren’t a conservative/liberal issue here. For the most part, the Democrats in Montana hunt (and own guns, natch) in Montana just like the Republicans do. [/QUOTE] But we’re talking about _voting_ issues. As a voting issue, gun rights are definitely a Republican issue. ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/191 "2008-04-15T15:22:36Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Yeah, I know. It just seems so strange the way things have flipped. She was the one making fun of cookie-baking housewives 16 years ago, and now she’s gun-totin’ Hill, woman of the people. [/QUOTE] Whatever gets you through the night, 'sallright. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/192 "2008-04-15T15:31:07Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] Fox News has been beating the word “elitist” into the ground. [/QUOTE] “Elitist” is never gonna fly for that crowd. To please them, you have to be simultaneously elitist _and_ lowest common denominator. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/193 "2008-04-15T15:31:14Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] But we’re talking about _voting_ issues. As a voting issue, gun rights are definitely a Republican issue. [/QUOTE] Well, whose fault is that? Maybe the Dems could pick up more of those “small town” votes if they made it a Democratic issue, too (protecting gun rights, that is). Isn’t that why Kerry had those pictures of him goose hunting and Hillary is now bragging about how she once shot a duck-- an attempt to change that image? ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/194 "2008-04-15T15:36:19Z")
The Democrats would do well to start protecting gun rights, I could almost vote for Obama if not for that issue. But what do I know, I’m just a bitter person clinging to guns and religion. Praise the lord and pass the ammunition! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/195 "2008-04-15T15:47:44Z")
[QUOTE=control-z] The Democrats would do well to start protecting gun rights, I could almost vote for Obama if not for that issue. [/QUOTE] You assume that they would gain more votes than they would lose. I’m not so sure. The NAACP, which represents parts of the core Democratic constituencies, is firmly in favor of gun control (because they believe it leads to marginally less inner-city violence). Many liberals feel the same way. Only a tiny fraction of Americans wants less strict gun control than we have now, and a plurality want more strict control. That’s not a good way to determine people’s rights, but it is a good way to get their votes. Perhaps not as many of them are single-issue voters are NRA people are. But there is little doubt that it is a divisive issue on which Democrats drive people out of the party either way. A pro-gun stance might get more votes in Ohio and Virginia, but lose them in Florida and Oregon. ---
**Author:** ![stolichnaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@stolichnaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stolichnaya)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/196 "2008-04-15T15:47:51Z")
It seems like the Dems should do with guns what the Republicans allegedly want to do with the gays- become all “Federalist” on guns. Attitudes about guns are very different from region to region, as is the utility of owning a gun. I’m trying to imagine _not_ having several guns in an environment in which I am responsible for a lot of land (for example) and I just can’t do it. So let’s leave it to the localities, the municipalities, and the states. Then folks can essentially vote with their feet once the issue is settled locally. This seems like a tenable position for a Democrat to have on gun control that does not threaten them in their base urban environments. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/197 "2008-04-15T16:00:16Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] But we’re talking about _voting_ issues. As a voting issue, gun rights are definitely a Republican issue. [/QUOTE] Again, you need to get out of the city once in a while. In our last election here in Montana, every Democrat running for Congress (and the Democratic Gubernatorial candidate) had at least one picture circulating of them carrying a gun, either hunting or target. Democrats here are not anti-gun, and gun owners are not viewed as “clinging to the issue because they’re depressed and bitter over losing their jobs 20 years ago.” Having a gun in this area is like having a tractor or a snowblower or a weedeater. It’s a tool. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/198 "2008-04-15T16:13:50Z")
[QUOTE=InvisibleWombat] Again, you need to get out of the city once in a while. In our last election here in Montana, every Democrat running for Congress (and the Democratic Gubernatorial candidate) had at least one picture circulating of them carrying a gun, either hunting or target. Democrats here are not anti-gun, and gun owners are not viewed as “clinging to the issue because they’re depressed and bitter over losing their jobs 20 years ago.” Having a gun in this area is like having a tractor or a snowblower or a weedeater. It’s a tool. [/QUOTE] What makes you think I haven’t been out of the city? I know plenty about small towns. My wife is from a small town (she’s from the town in that “Jesus Camp” movie, so that shows you how conservative it is) and I’ve been going there multiple times a year for almost two decades. I sometimes go out on my wife’s parents farm and shoot targets. Obama wasn’t saying people cling to guns because of economic depression, he was saying they gravitate to social issues _in the voting booth_, because they _don’t believe Democrats really want to help them_. Obama’s full remarks have been almost univerally truncated to remove that critical point. He was being critical of his own party and saying he understood why people would be skeptical of his message. He wasn’t saying people turn to guns and religion because they’re bitter, but that their bitterness and skepticism makes them turn a deaf dear to promises of economic change and that they vote on social issues instead because they think they acn have more of an influence on those things. ---
**Author:** ![stolichnaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@stolichnaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stolichnaya)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/199 "2008-04-15T16:25:49Z")
I happen to agree with you on his meaning, but still I can see how it would be honestly interpreted as a slight. In any event, it’s a valuable conversation to have if your goal is really to change how things work and upset what politicians take for granted. It may have been a mistake to say it, but I think we’ll be glad that we’re talking about it in the end. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2008, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239/200 "2008-04-15T17:14:54Z")
[QUOTE=stolichnaya] It may have been a mistake to say it, but I think we’ll be glad that we’re talking about it in the end. [/QUOTE] I think that, presuming that Obama survives this, and I’m pretty sure that he will, Obama is demonstrating that it is possible to challenge the conventional framework of acceptable “discussion” when it comes to political campaigns. If he continues to pull this off, I will become very optimistic about the possibility of real substantive change coming about in our country. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-tells-the-truth-conservatives-cry-like-little-bitches/445239.md?page=11)