# Obama, The Weasel! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 25, 2010, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299 "2010-04-25T12:42:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/41 "2010-04-26T07:39:30Z")
> [@pedescribe](#): > > So…what’s so bad about ACORN? Acorns become trees that those Dirty Bleeding-Heart Liberal Hippies want to hug! ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/42 "2010-04-26T12:15:22Z")
Some of you people, I won’t bother to mention names, seem to be entirely devoid of the ability to recognize nuance. I am not a Libertarian. I’m a confessed Altruistic Libertarian (and, which no one has bothered to mention, a Conservative Anarchist). First of all, that’s an oxymoronic joke. I’m for a single-payer health care system, close govt regulation of banks and other corporations and confiscatory taxes on the wealthy. Does that make me a Libertarian? I don’t think so. My main problem with Obama, Constitutional lawyer and community organizer that he is, is that he is well aware that our problems today are systemic and rooted in corporate control of our govt thru the “privatization” of its functions and deregulation of its abuses and yet fails to bring that forcefully to public attention. I like **IMM** ’s expose of Obama’s pre-election resume > [@](#): > > But honestly, it was all there for anyone to see all along. The 20 year association with Rev Wright, the campaign kickoff in the living room with former domestic terrorists, the victimization shakedown racket of ‘community organizing’ in Chicago, Van Jones, ACORN, the double-talk about trade with Canada before the election, and my personal favorite…the debate with Hillary with Charles Gibson where he said he didn’t care if high tax rates resulted in lower overall government revenue, as long as it addressed inequality. Pretty much why I voted for him. But does he offer a platform to representatives of the more than 50% of US doctors who favor a SPHCS? Fuck no. He does a backroom drug deal with Big Pharma for its support of a 15 yo Pub health plan which the Pubs now oppose. Can anyone call this a democracy? It’s a fucking Corporate Kleptocracy and _that’s_ the issue and that’s all I’m saying. Until people wake up to that fact, they’ll be arguing among themselves about how to best address each of the multitude of inequities the past 30 years of deregulation and privatization have produced in this country and around the world. Wake.the.fuck.up. And you call me naive. One last thing. I participate in local elections. The only reason I bothered to vote for Obama is because I had previously registered Green in 2006 to vote on a state initiative to legalize marijuana. (It went down 2-1 but I’ll keep votin’.) So, in 2008, I said, why not? I should have spared myself the hope and anguish. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/43 "2010-04-26T13:49:42Z")
Do you have a citation for that 50+% of doctors favoring single-payer healthcare thing? ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/44 "2010-04-26T13:59:18Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Do you have a citation for that 50+% of doctors favoring single-payer healthcare thing? Here you go. [http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN31432035](http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN31432035) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/45 "2010-04-26T14:13:55Z")
Interesting. I didn’t think the AMA’s position was representative but I didn’t realize it was that far off. ---
**Author:** ![put\_down\_the\_sabre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/da6949/32.png) [@put\_down\_the\_sabre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/put_down_the_sabre)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/46 "2010-04-26T15:34:53Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > What they have and we want doesn’t matter. Tell the damn truth! Sucks to be those who can’t handle it. > > If someone had a gun to my head and told me to say black was white, I’d do it. Is that a white lie? Heh. > It doesn’t change the colour of black or white, though. People respect those who tell the truth and find it hard to respect those who don’t. I find it hard to respect those who only tell the truth when it furthers their interest, also. Unfortunately when you are a politician and sworn to advance the interests of your people, it pretty much is like the other person having a gun to your head. America is not as powerful as many Americans think – Turkey could cause a **lot** of problems for you. They could ally with Iran and block a major chunk of the flow of oil to the West, and maybe cause a Kurdish uprising in Iraq. Just for starters. Of course, you could still beat them in a war. But that’s not an outcome anybody wants. pdts ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/47 "2010-04-26T15:59:35Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > First of all, that’s an oxymoronic joke. I’m for a single-payer health care system, close govt regulation of banks and other corporations and confiscatory taxes on the wealthy. Does that make me a Libertarian? I don’t think so. > > My main problem with Obama, Constitutional lawyer and community organizer that he is, is that he is well aware that our problems today are systemic and rooted in corporate control of our govt thru the “privatization” of its functions and deregulation of its abuses and yet fails to bring that forcefully to public attention. > > I like **IMM** ’s expose of Obama’s pre-election resumePretty much why I voted for him. > > But does he offer a platform to representatives of the more than 50% of US doctors who favor a SPHCS? Fuck no. He does a backroom drug deal with Big Pharma for its support of a 15 yo Pub health plan which the Pubs now oppose. Can anyone call this a democracy? It’s a fucking Corporate Kleptocracy and _that’s_ the issue and that’s all I’m saying. Until people wake up to that fact, they’ll be arguing among themselves about how to best address each of the multitude of inequities the past 30 years of deregulation and privatization have produced in this country and around the world. Wake.the.fuck.up. And you call me naive. > > One last thing. I participate in local elections. > > The only reason I bothered to vote for Obama is because I had previously registered Green in 2006 to vote on a state initiative to legalize marijuana. (It went down 2-1 but I’ll keep votin’.) > > So, in 2008, I said, why not? I should have spared myself the hope and anguish. Bingo. Couple that with his willingness to continue (and in some cases try to expand) some of the worst Bush-era tactics in the War on Terror (warrantless wiretapping, indefinite detainment, troop “surges” in Afghanistan, prosecution of whistleblowers), and I’m wondering why I thought he’d be any different. I guess for some folks, not being Bush is good enough. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/48 "2010-04-26T17:39:32Z")
> [@put\_down\_the\_sabre](#): > > But that’s not an outcome anybody wants. Ahahahahahaha. Ha. Eheheh. You’re funny. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/49 "2010-04-26T20:54:35Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > I voted for him because I wanted to see people lose their minds over having a black man in the White House, and watch them dream up ways to pretend that’s not why they’re losing their minds. > > I am satisfied. You should be. In spades. ---
**Author:** ![Carol\_the\_Impaler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Carol\_the\_Impaler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carol_the_Impaler)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/50 "2010-04-26T20:58:21Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > One last thing. I participate in local elections. How am I supposed to infer that when you say you gave up on politics after voting in '72 and that you aren’t going to vote anymore? ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/51 "2010-04-26T21:08:08Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > But there is one other thing in which they differ. Bush, while he lied many times in office about how he was going about it, at least did most of what he said he would during his campaign, specifically, make war and fuck the poor. > > But Obama? Fool that I am, I listened to his campaign promises and actually believed he could and would deliver reform and transparency, get us out of war and return power to the people (if they ever had it). [Here’s his latest renege](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/25/world/europe/25prexy.html?partner=MYWAY&ei=5065). I have little interest in the issue raised here and this thread is not about Turkey or genocide. It’s just another example of Obama’s little tap dance while backtracking. So to you, being honest about his evilness is better than trying to do good but failing? Great! If I said I was going to harm you, that’d be ok right? Cause you know, I’m being honest. The truth isn’t a virtue when it’s used for evil ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/52 "2010-04-26T21:10:42Z")
_How foolish is truth when it brings no profit to the wise?_ Bob De Niro - circa Angel Heart ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/53 "2010-04-26T21:14:03Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > Bush, while he lied many times in office about how he was going about it, at least did most of what he said he would during his campaign, specifically, make war and fuck the poor. Really? He said that? Wow. You’d think it would have been reported somewhere if he had. I mean, CNN would have run with that like a bitch in heat. Strangely, not a word was said about it. Which leads us to the conclusion that it didn’t happen, and that you are the liar you claim Bush to be. ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/54 "2010-04-26T22:33:05Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > Bingo. … and I’m wondering why I thought he’d be any different. Write it off to every decent human being’s naive hope that Capitalism can somehow evolve a conscience and that something other than greed will one day govern the world. Greed is a genetic human pathology occurring in about 10% of the population. Many well documented studies show that greed correlates well with violence. Without these diseased motherfuckers, we’d still be hunting and gathering. It has served us well over the past 200,000 years since _homo sapiens_ arose with opposed thumbs and, self-conscious of its own mortality, it occurred to the greedy ones that a quick way to improve it’s own lot was to shorten another’s be it flora or fauna. Greed grew Capitalism, I use the words interchangeably. As some diplomatic wag put it, historically, the 90% grow and grind corn for the 10%. This insane idea was workable until we “discovered” oil. In the past 140 years Capital has turned an obviously finite resource into a globally indispensable commodity and, everyday, encourages an exponential increase in consumption as our supplies begin to dwindle. It is on this sound model that the global economic “system” is based. Imagine living in a $20/gal world. This, while our climate degrades. All the while, the 10% prosper while the 90% grind away. Sound familiar? I’d like to suggest that the 10% come to see that sharing is cheaper than killing and much more adaptive species-wise. Yes, it’s me and I’m in love again. Since we got oil, it’s become clear that a finite planet with lots of people just can’t afford the rich, their wars and our oil dependence. And only the rich are authorized to get themselves off our backs and evolve some public plans to ease our transition into Post-Oil. Successful Capitalism, if it evolves a conscience, can do no more than shepherd humanity humanely into the 22nd century. > [@](#): > > I guess for some folks, not being Bush is good enough. Shit. i’m as bad as Bush and I’d still have waterboarded him and his whole administration to get a little info on how Capital shapes govt policy. ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [April 26, 2010, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/55 "2010-04-26T22:58:55Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > Bingo. … and I’m wondering why I thought he’d be any different. Write it off to every decent human being’s naive hope that Capitalism can somehow evolve a conscience and that something other than greed will one day govern the world. Greed is a genetic human pathology occurring in about 10% of the population. Many well documented studies show that greed correlates well with violence. Without these diseased motherfuckers, we’d still be hunting and gathering. It has served us well over the past 200,000 years since _homo sapiens_ arose with opposed thumbs and, self-conscious of their own mortality, it occurred to the greedy ones that a quick way to improve their lot was to shorten another’s be it flora or fauna. Greed grew Capitalism, I use the words interchangeably. As some diplomatic wag put it, historically, the 90% grow and grind corn for the 10%, for a bit of the corn. Thanks, very much. This insane idea was workable until we “discovered” oil. In the past 140 years Capital has turned an obviously finite resource into a globally indispensable commodity and, everyday, encourages an exponential increase in consumption as our supplies begin to dwindle. It is on this sound model that the global economic “system” is based. Imagine living in a $20/gal world. This, while our climate degrades. All the while, the 10% prosper while the 90% grind away. Sound familiar? I’d like to suggest that the 10% come to see that sharing is cheaper than killing and much more adaptive species-wise. Yes, it’s me and I’m in love again. Since we got oil, it’s become clear that a finite planet with lots of people just can’t afford the rich, their wars and our oil dependence. And only the rich are authorized to get themselves off our backs and evolve some public plans to ease our transition into Post-Oil. Successful Capitalism, if it evolves a conscience, can do no more than shepherd humanity humanely into the 22nd century. It would be enough. > [@](#): > > I guess for some folks, not being Bush is good enough. Shit. I’m as bad as Bush but I’d still have waterboarded him and his whole administration to get a little info on how Capital shapes govt policy. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/56 "2010-04-27T00:22:41Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > Write it off to every decent human being’s naive hope that Capitalism can somehow evolve a conscience and that something other than greed will one day govern the world. > > Greed is a genetic human pathology occurring in about 10% of the population. Many well documented studies show that greed correlates well with violence. Without these diseased motherfuckers, we’d still be hunting and gathering. It has served us well over the past 200,000 years since _homo sapiens_ arose with opposed thumbs and, self-conscious of their own mortality, it occurred to the greedy ones that a quick way to improve their lot was to shorten another’s be it flora or fauna. Greed grew Capitalism, I use the words interchangeably. As some diplomatic wag put it, historically, the 90% grow and grind corn for the 10%, for a bit of the corn. Thanks, very much. > > This insane idea was workable until we “discovered” oil. In the past 140 years Capital has turned an obviously finite resource into a globally indispensable commodity and, everyday, encourages an exponential increase in consumption as our supplies begin to dwindle. It is on this sound model that the global economic “system” is based. Imagine living in a $20/gal world. This, while our climate degrades. > > All the while, the 10% prosper while the 90% grind away. Sound familiar? > > I’d like to suggest that the 10% come to see that sharing is cheaper than killing and much more adaptive species-wise. Yes, it’s me and I’m in love again. > > Since we got oil, it’s become clear that a finite planet with lots of people just can’t afford the rich, their wars and our oil dependence. And only the rich are authorized to get themselves off our backs and evolve some public plans to ease our transition into Post-Oil. Successful Capitalism, if it evolves a conscience, can do no more than shepherd humanity humanely into the 22nd century. It would be enough. Shit. I’m as bad as Bush but I’d still have waterboarded him and his whole administration to get a little info on how Capital shapes govt policy. Sorry but capitalism is designed to have no conscience and be driven by greed. That will never happen.That is why we have to watch over them, very, very closely. ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/57 "2010-04-27T00:36:31Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Sorry but capitalism is designed to have no conscience and be driven by greed. That will never happen.That is why we have to watch over them, very, very closely. Now you got me worried. ---
**Author:** ![straight\_man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/straight_man/32/3027_2.png) [@straight\_man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/straight_man)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/58 "2010-04-27T01:38:07Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > Greed is a genetic human pathology occurring in about 10% of the population. Your command of social psychology is rather appalling. The quoted sentence pretty much eliminates the need to even think about the rest of your statement. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/59 "2010-04-27T03:41:08Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > Without these diseased motherfuckers, we’d still be hunting and gathering. I’m sorry, I don’t like hunting and gathering all that much. (You’re post was sarcasm, right?) ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2010, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299/60 "2010-04-27T03:58:37Z")
Dude, the point is, not voting because you don’t like the system isn’t going to accomplish anything. This is where that moral principle of “What if [del]everybody[/del]a significant number of people did the same thing” factors in. Enough people in your state don’t vote so that the worse candidate wins. You become just as guilty for electing that guy. Look, we don’t vote to pick the perfect person to be president. That will never happen. We vote to make sure that, of the two people running, we make the best possible choice. Refusing to vote doesn’t improve the situation. It may make it worse. You can’t just quit and go home. You are a part of this democracy, and your vote, or lack of vote will have some influence, There is no way to choose not to choose. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-the-weasel/537299.md?page=4)