# Obama Too Elite Claims Wife of Sir Evelyn de Rothschild **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 17, 2008, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982 "2008-09-17T14:38:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/41 "2008-09-17T17:34:34Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > Morals? You don’t want him using his competence for evil, do you? 😛 Better than using incompetence for good. Given the choice between evil and capable and good and ineffectual… well, I’m not quite sure what I’d choose. But I do know this: competence should be the basic prerequisite for any leadership position. If they don’t have that, then its doesn’t matter how moral, or honest, or smart they are. They’re just an empty suit. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/42 "2008-09-17T17:35:45Z")
“He never drank a Duff in his life!” ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/43 "2008-09-17T17:37:40Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Nobody knows who she is, and she’s British. In fact she was born in New Jersey, and her first husband was the last president of the New York City Council. She’s as American as apple pie and baseball. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/44 "2008-09-17T17:42:35Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > In fact she was born in New Jersey, and her first husband was the last president of the New York City Council. She’s as American as apple pie and baseball. Her current husband is a knight of the realm, and they live [here](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ascott_House). And baseball is also British. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/45 "2008-09-17T17:46:27Z")
Is it because he isn’t black enough? Is that the problem? Should he talk using only Ebonics? If I were him, I would be so frustrated with this particular criticism. ETA: I mean the elitist criticism, not the black enough criticism. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/46 "2008-09-17T17:48:47Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Perceptions about dependability are more important to most American voters than perceptions about competence. Yep. Consider how many people get thoroughly up in arms when they find out their congressman hasn’t been to a lot of votes, but never bother to find out what sort of job their congressman was actually doing… ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/47 "2008-09-17T17:52:07Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Her current husband is a knight of the realm, and they live [here](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ascott_House). And baseball is also British. 😉 Are you suggesting that the mother of Sir Winston Churchill wasn’t an American? Being married to a British knight doesn’t cancel your American citizenship. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/48 "2008-09-17T18:01:31Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > Are you suggesting that the mother of Sir Winston Churchill wasn’t an American? Being married to a British knight doesn’t cancel your American citizenship. Suggesting it seriously? No. Agreeing with **Really Not All That Bright** ’s comment that Lynn Forester De Rothschild is superrich and practically British, so nobody’s going to care? Yes. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/49 "2008-09-17T18:06:04Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Suggesting it seriously? No. Agreeing with **Really Not All That Bright** ’s comment that Lynn Forester De Rothschild is superrich and practically British, so nobody’s going to care? Yes. So the only real problem is that she’s elite – and so elite that she’s at a level where citizenship doesn’t matter much any more. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/50 "2008-09-17T18:13:42Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > So the only real problem is that she’s elite – and so elite that she’s at a level where citizenship doesn’t matter much any more. “Real problem?” The basic irony pointed out in this thread is that, as a Rothschild (even if only by marriage), she is actually far more elite than Obama is. It makes her claim that she “feel[s] like he is an elitist” just plain silly. That’s why I agreed her endorsement is not going to sway anybody, despite the story running on CNN’s ticker that she is a “prominent Clinton backer.” ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/51 "2008-09-17T18:14:58Z")
> [@Shayna](#): > > Well tell that to your leaders who keep using the term as an epithet to rile the riff raff into hating him for it. > > Not to mention the fact that the reaction here isn’t to the fact that he was called elite, but because of the hilarious hypocrisy of _who_ was calling him that. This is the epitome of the pot calling the kettle black. Racist! :D:D:D Next you’re going to be talking about putting lipstick on the kettle. Someone had to say it. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/52 "2008-09-17T18:17:20Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > Not getting why this is funny. The author makes a point about perceptions, which is either correct or it is not. > > The fact that she would be perceived as “elite” herself doesn’t detract from it, does it? Presumably, she knows “elite” when she sees it. 😉 There is no one the true elite hate more than the riffraff who come from nowhere and make it to the top of places like Harvard Law. Getting into the club on intelligence and talent is very threatening. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/53 "2008-09-17T18:19:58Z")
> [@SmartAleq](#): > > Don’t forget he’s also the grandson of an admiral–and of course every dumb punk kid who graduated fourth from the bottom of his class gets to fly fighter jets! No way that was influenced by family–coulda been anybody, really. Part of being truly elite is getting your idiot children jobs where they screw things up. Though McCain losing a plane is a lot better than the other example I’m thinking of, where the idiot son of the former CEO trashed an entire country. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/54 "2008-09-17T18:38:11Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > There is no one the true elite hate more than the riffraff who come from nowhere and make it to the top of places like Harvard Law. Getting into the club on intelligence and talent is very threatening. This makes Obama nouveau elite, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/55 "2008-09-17T19:04:57Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > There is no one the true elite hate more than the riffraff who come from nowhere and make it to the top of places like Harvard Law. Getting into the club on intelligence and talent is very threatening. That may well be true, and indeed may be the author’s motivation for disliking Obama - I note the snarky tone of the piece. But the issue is whether her _analysis_ is correct - is the way Obama is perceived by voters an issue, or not? So far I’ve seen posters analysing why the perceptions of “Joe Average” are swayed by jealousy (which implies that the authour is _correct_) or that the authour is so elite herself that no-one will care about her opinion (which may also be _true_, but so what? If her opinion is _correct_, he’s in election trouble anyway, whether or not anyone listens to her!). The only person tackling the article head-on is **Marley23** , who said in an aside that the perception is “played out” and replaced in concern with the economy. That may be true as well, but the article is claiming a systemic problem with Democrats as a party over a long span of time: that they tend to talk down to the population as a whole, which then often rewards them by failing to elect their candidates. Being told that the majority of John or Jane Q. Public is simply jealous of Obama’s successes, or is too dumb to appreciate his superior qualities, simply re-enforces the point - to the extent of course that what people post here on this Internet site actually mirror the “message” that John/Jane Q. Public is getting from the Democratic Party [One may naturally reply that evidence supports this view as substantially true, but so what? The Democrats need it to be _not_ true in order to win - or they must somehow change their message]. The comparison with Adlai Stevenson is somewhat apt: during one of Stevenson’s presidential campaigns, allegedly, a supporter told him that he was sure to “get the vote of every thinking man” in the U.S., to which Stevenson is said to have replied, “Thank you, but I need a majority to win.” 😃 I do not know if the quip is an accurate quote, but it does appear to have contemporary relevance. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/56 "2008-09-17T19:19:00Z")
“He hasn’t given me a reason to trust him.” Because (half) black men are dangerous until proven otherwise, right? Mrs de Rothschild is an ignorant, dishonest piece of garbage. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/57 "2008-09-17T19:26:51Z")
Well, as long as we’re floating impossible-to-prove, half-baked, straight-out-of-our-asses accusations about the _real_ reason she is defecting to the McCain/Palin camp, I’ll offer my own … and bear in mind, I truly believe this no matter how stinky it is once it’s extracted from my alimentary canal: It’s the Palin, stupid. This woman backed Hilary. Now she is backing Palin … because of the love taco factor, as it were. I think she’s just voting the feminist angle, no matter how anti-feminist the feminine in question is. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/58 "2008-09-17T19:31:18Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > The only person tackling the article head-on is **Marley23** , who said in an aside that the perception is “played out” and replaced in concern with the economy. That may be true as well, but the article is claiming a systemic problem with Democrats as a party over a long span of time: that they tend to talk down to the population as a whole, which then often rewards them by failing to elect their candidates. They do have a tendency to do that, but the Palin-style “I’m just like you, gosh darn it” is also talking down to people, and it’s at least equally phony. Since the author is endorsing McCain, I can’t help but think her advice is more of a backhanded way of publishing one more version of the GOP take on Obama, and not actual advice. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/59 "2008-09-17T19:35:40Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Yeah, I don’t get that. What could be more important tha(n) competance? There is a long tradition of suspicion of “the elites” in American politics as well as scientific and intellectual endeavors (and I strongly suspect this occurs to some degree around the world). The classic rejoinder of the Dumbass Salt-Of-The-Earth to an intelligent, fact-based statement is “If you’re so smart, why ain’t you rich? HAR HAR HAR!!!” (Of course this doesn’t work so well with Obama, since while he is not fabulously rich he’s pretty well off). Let’s face it, there’s always a substantial number of people who resent and envy those with more smarts and drive than they have. They see nothing idiotic in the legendary remark by Sen. Roman Hruska of Nebraska, who in response to complaints that G. Harrold Carswell (a Nixon Supreme Court appointee) was mediocre, remarked that there was nothing wrong with mediocrity, that mediocre people needed representation too. :smack: We also have people who are conspiracy-minded, and/or hone in obsessively on instances where learned opinion has been off base, and conclude that all expert knowledge is to be distrusted or placed on an equivalent level with homespun “wisdom”. This is how Celebrity Mommies like Jenny McCarthy get their inane views on vaccination promoted to the exclusion of evidence-based medicine. But I don’t believe Ms. de Rothschild seriously thinks that the problem with Obama is that he’s too “elitist”. In her eyes his main deficiency is that he’s not Hillary Clinton, and so she’s whacking him with the “elitist” label because she thinks that’s an effective weapon against him. No doubt Hillary is just _devastated_ by this turn of events. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2008, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982/60 "2008-09-17T20:14:40Z")
Sir Evelyn de Rothschild is a mere knight. Parvenu. We could pit his wife against Lady Haden-Guest in a knock down, drag out, Jello wrestling death match, but as HER husband is a Baron it would be unseemly for her to be pulling the panties off someone beneath her. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-too-elite-claims-wife-of-sir-evelyn-de-rothschild/463982.md?page=4)