# Obama vs. Fox **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 20, 2009, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497 "2009-10-20T16:57:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/1 "2009-10-20T16:57:00Z")
I’m mildly surprised that nobody has made a thread about this yet. The Obama administration has explicitly decided to regard Fox News as “an opponent” and “not a news organization.” Yesterday they went so far as to [tell other news outlets](http://www.abcnews.go.com/ThisWeek/Politics/transcript-axelrod/story?id=8846323) that _they_ should not regard Fox as a news station. This seems to me a very bad idea both, for the nation and for Obama himself (politically speaking). Criticisms of this approach have appeared in NYT and The Nation. But there are some that think it’s a great idea. What say ya’ll? ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/2 "2009-10-20T17:06:42Z")
I don’t see the downside. Truthfully, Obama may not win over anyone with this approach, but considering some of the lies and propaganda spread by Fox already, I hardly think this would somehow intensify their hate of Obama. This is a network that funded and supported a supposed “grassroots” movement calling for revolution AND thinks that the president isn’t born in the country. Having Obama call them out on their BS is just another topic for them to talk about, I don’t think it adds anything to the crap their spewing already. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/3 "2009-10-20T17:10:34Z")
I don’t see an upside to the overtness of it, really and plenty of chances for the administration to just look petty and stupid. I’d rather see them just stop sending people to the Sunday talk shows if they don’t like the Fox punditry. Seems a short-sighted move by Obama & Co and one I’m kind of disappointed in. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/4 "2009-10-20T17:11:25Z")
This isn’t going to turn out well for Obama. Presidents take on the media at their peril. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/5 "2009-10-20T17:15:43Z")
Emanuel went on John King Sunday morning and flatly stated that Fox News is a network with an agenda, not a news organization. Yeah, and? Who’s going to get upset, other than the folks who honestly believe Fox delivers the news, and is not a 24-hour right wing commentary network? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/6 "2009-10-20T17:15:57Z")
> [@furt](#): > > I’m mildly surprised that nobody has made a thread about this yet. The Obama administration has explicitly decided to regard Fox News as “an opponent” and “not a news organization.” Yesterday they went so far as to [tell other news outlets](http://www.abcnews.go.com/ThisWeek/Politics/transcript-axelrod/story?id=8846323) that _they_ should not regard Fox as a news station. > > This seems to me a very bad idea both, for the nation and for Obama himself (politically speaking). Criticisms of this approach have appeared in NYT and The Nation. But there are some that think it’s a great idea. > > What say ya’ll? Even when Mark Halperin told his people to spin their coverage against Bush, the White House didn’t try to create this kind of shit. Looking at it from Obama’s point of view, it makes sense - if he can succeed in classifying Fox News as not a news outlet, then he will have to worry less about extraneous stuff like the First Amendment. Looking at it from my point of view, it means that Obama and Co. are such weaklings that they cannot stand even one media outlet that is critical. Nine months in, and he is starting an enemies list. So much for openness and reaching across the aisle and all that. What a pussy. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/7 "2009-10-20T17:17:55Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Looking at it from Obama’s point of view, it makes sense - if he can succeed in classifying Fox News as not a news outlet, then he will have to worry less about extraneous stuff like the First Amendment. Huh? The First Amendment protects even rabid blog writing mouthbreathers and obviously partisan talk show hosts, not just legitimate news outlets. ---
**Author:** ![Lochdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/edb3f5/32.png) [@Lochdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lochdale)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/8 "2009-10-20T17:23:19Z")
It’s both petty and stupid. Fact is, Fox filled a gaping hole in the new media business. The media was seen, often rightly so, to have a left wing bias. Slight bias in my opinion but the bias was there. This opened the door for Fox (MSNBC is hardly balanced either). For Obama to come out against a news source smacks of arrogance or desperation. Maybe both. Stupid move. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/9 "2009-10-20T17:23:49Z")
Apparently in Shodan’s mind, claiming that Fox is not a news channel is the equivalent of shutting it down. ---
**Author:** ![Anduril](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c0e974/32.png) [@Anduril](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anduril)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/10 "2009-10-20T17:25:07Z")
If Fox is not considered a news organizations, what happens then? I mean, labeling Fox as “an opponent” is supposed to do what? Make people listen less to Fox? Save for those who are certainly not in Obama’s camp, who listens to them, anyway? And now Fox can label itself as a “victim” or a “martyr” to the altar of “balanced reporting” (at least to its viewers). This is a stupid move. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/11 "2009-10-20T17:25:39Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > This isn’t going to turn out well for Obama. Presidents take on the media at their peril. You mean if if he isn’t careful, it may impact the professionalism and objectivity of their coverage? ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/12 "2009-10-20T17:28:00Z")
> [@Lochdale](#): > > It’s both petty and stupid. Fact is, Fox filled a gaping hole in the new media business. **The media was seen, often rightly so, to have a left wing bias.** Slight bias in my opinion but the bias was there. This opened the door for Fox (MSNBC is hardly balanced either). For Obama to come out against a news source smacks of arrogance or desperation. Maybe both. Stupid move. To be honest and fair to the media, reality does has a left wing bias. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/13 "2009-10-20T17:28:33Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Nine months in, and he is starting an enemies list. So much for openness and reaching across the aisle and all that. Hard to understand, considering how splendidly that’s gone so far… ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/14 "2009-10-20T17:30:56Z")
Reach across, reach around. Six of one, half a dozen of the other. ---
**Author:** ![flonks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3ab097/32.png) [@flonks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flonks)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/15 "2009-10-20T17:33:42Z")
> [@furt](#): > > I’m mildly surprised that nobody has made a thread about this yet. The Obama administration has explicitly decided to regard Fox News as “an opponent” and “not a news organization.” I am mildly surprised that 1. something like Fox News exists 2. that it’s legal for Faux News to call itself a news station I mean, in bookstores they have this separation between fiction and non-fiction, why don’t they have this distinction for TV stations? E.g. “news” and “comedy” ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/16 "2009-10-20T17:36:14Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > This isn’t going to turn out well for Obama. Presidents take on the media at their peril. Really, what’s Fox going to do, turn on him? Attack him? Run negative stories about him? Make stuff up? Organize protest rallies? What are they going to do that they’re not already doing? The Obama administration is just being truthful. Fox is a political organization, not a news organization, and both the White House and the legit media should treat it accordingly. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/17 "2009-10-20T17:38:18Z")
Even if hes absolutely right, which he is, there is no way this will turn out well for him. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/18 "2009-10-20T17:39:38Z")
> [@Lochdale](#): > > This opened the door for Fox (MSNBC is hardly balanced either). MSNBC was at least open about making themselves the liberal answer to Fox with Olbermann & Maddow. They pretty much just came out last year and said “This is what we’re going to be now”. They’re not trying to sell themselves as “fair & balanced”. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/19 "2009-10-20T17:40:16Z")
Frankly, it seems a bit petty to me. I seriously doubt that any viewers of FOX Opinion (what the network’s name really should be) will decide to stop watching just because the Kenyan-born Muslim imposgter who is currently claimed to be President (or his aides) say they shouldn’t. The administration, like all administrations, should address non-factual statements by FOX or other news organizations whenever they are worth refuting, and ignore the trival or pure opinion. Annoncing that what is rightly or woringly widely regarded as a legitimate news network is an opponent, rather than a journalistic outlet, inevitably suggests an effort at using the weight of government to suppress free speech, even if the effort stops at jawboning. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2009, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/20 "2009-10-20T17:43:34Z")
> [@flonks](#): > > I am mildly surprised that > > 1. something like Fox News exists > 2. that it’s legal for Faux News to call itself a news station > > I mean, in bookstores they have this separation between fiction and non-fiction, why don’t they have this distinction for TV stations? E.g. “news” and “comedy” I don’t think there are any legal standards for calling yourself a news organization. The White House should at least pull all FNC press passes, though, and shut them out of all press conferences, Presidential addresses, etc. Treat them like the bogus, tabloid frauds that they are. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497.md?page=2)