# Obama vs. Fox **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 20, 2009, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497 "2009-10-20T16:57:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![The\_Understander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3da27b/32.png) [@The\_Understander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Understander)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/241 "2009-10-22T14:38:51Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > Gee, and here I thought Obama et al (a.k.a. The White House) had a different job description… > Let us all know how that works out for them, ehe? I’m sure it will be a smashing success…probably take down Fox and all the other right wing news outlets, talk radio and possibly the entire Republican party too boot! > > (Have fun storming the castle boys…) > > (Think they have a chance?) > > (It would take a miracle…) > > -XT Well. It DID work. Just ask Count Rugen. ---
**Author:** ![Ca3799](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ca3799](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ca3799)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/242 "2009-10-22T15:09:30Z")
I don’t think Obama or administration officials should appear on Fox. I used to listen to the nutty old ‘Art Bell Show’. He would say “Call this number if you have had sex with aliens”, and “Call this number if you are the devil,” and “Call this number if you are a time traveler.” He also interviewed a lot af people with really strange ideas. Occasionally he would have ‘normal’ people on, too, like some kind of scientist or an astronomer (didn’t the Bad Astronomer appear on his show?). Having ‘real’ scientists appear on the show gave the show a level of respectability it did not deserve. Having Obama or any administration official on Fox would five Fox a legitimacy it doesn’t deserve. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/243 "2009-10-22T15:20:12Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > Wow! NPR sided with Fox? I’m stunned, but that sure does give credence to those suggesting it’s a bad idea to confront Fox News if a liberal organization like NPR says so. > > Did the NPR story get the opinions of Mara Liaisson or Juan Williams for that piece? You know the two NPR commentators who are also Fox commentators? > > I think this is very like the Swiftboat business, and I stopped supporting NPR when they described John Kerry’s war record as “controversial.” > > If it’s not apparent, my first paragraph above is sarcasm. NPR can go stuff it - their opinion on this matter is as a grunt from a pig, in my opinion. What else would you expect them to say? I never said NPR was liberal. You made that up. My point is that they tend to be objective. And if you ever listen to the Political Junkie, their host knows his shit. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/244 "2009-10-22T15:48:54Z")
He’s wrong in this case. There will be no political price for Obama. ---
**Author:** ![Eutychus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Eutychus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eutychus)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/245 "2009-10-22T15:55:42Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I think it’s about calling a spade a spade. I knew this thread would turn racist. ---
**Author:** ![Translucent\_Daydream](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/translucent_daydream/32/16170_2.png) [@Translucent\_Daydream](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Translucent_Daydream)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/246 "2009-10-22T15:56:04Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > Wow! NPR sided with Fox? I’m stunned, but that sure does give credence to those suggesting it’s a bad idea to confront Fox News if a liberal organization like NPR says so. > > Did the NPR story get the opinions of Mara Liaisson or Juan Williams for that piece? You know the two NPR commentators who are also Fox commentators? > > I think this is very like the Swiftboat business, and I stopped supporting NPR when they described John Kerry’s war record as “controversial.” > > If it’s not apparent, my first paragraph above is sarcasm. NPR can go stuff it - their opinion on this matter is as a grunt from a pig, in my opinion. What else would you expect them to say? NPR liberal? Really? They are just about the most politically unmotivated I can listen to anymore. YMMV ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/247 "2009-10-22T16:00:18Z")
> [@Eutychus](#): > > I knew this thread would turn racist. I almost sharted! Excellent. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/248 "2009-10-22T16:07:40Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Sometimes it seems as if you are posting in the wrong thread, because you like to attack points no one in _this_ thread have made. > I am curious, though-do you rehearse these speeches out loud, and if so, what voice do you use for the "E_V_I_L L_I_B_R_U_L? If memory serves, some poster (\*damn \*him or her to Hell!) responded with amusement the first time \*\*Shodan \*\* pulled the “X is not X” shtick. And now, like any flopsweatting hack comedian with no new material, he pratfalls back on the old crowd-pleaser. Trust me, we’ll be seeing it again and again. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/249 "2009-10-22T18:07:07Z")
BTW, the debate here is not Obama vs Fox, so much as whether it’s smart for the Obama administration to go after Fox. One can argue that they shouldn’t do so, but that doesn’t mean one is “siding” with Fox. After having thought this over, I think it will do more to hurt Obama and his cause that it will help him. And we’ll see if he agrees with me-- as I said already, I expect we will not hear much of this anti-Fox rhetoric in the future. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/250 "2009-10-22T18:14:22Z")
Guess again. He repeated it today: [Obama: Fox News “basically operating as talk radio”](http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/64271-obama-suggests-fox-news-is-talk-radio) He’s right, and it will do absolutely nothing to hurt him, because no one with any sense disagrees. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/251 "2009-10-22T18:19:55Z")
Give it more time. This is just him saying he’s OK with what those guys said, and that he “isn’t losing any sleep” over it. What we won’t see, IMO, is his senior staffers going after Fox as they did earlier in the week. I don’t expect him to repudiate what they said, just to not trot it out again. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/252 "2009-10-22T18:20:40Z")
The Administration’s attacking Fox News as illegitimate is bound to backfire - not necessarily to a serious degree, but it’s not going to do Obama any good. Such statements actually encourage Obama opponents (who are not all stereotypical Evul Meanie Righties) to look to Fox commentators as opposition leaders, and give Fox status as an embattled defender of free speech (as ludicrous as this seems). Plus, as the NPR program shows, news media representatives have a hair trigger when it comes to perceiving government pressure on journalists, even if many of them don’t like Fox. Freedom of speech concerns take precedence over politics or cultural values. That’s why “respectable” media sources may even defend tabloid rags or pornographers. I can’t think of any instances where a U.S. Administration took on a news organization or reporters in general (remember Spiro Agnew’s “nattering nabobs of negativism”?) and reaped any benefit from it. > [@Diogenes](#): > > …it will do absolutely nothing to hurt (Obama), because no one with any sense disagrees. And as we all know, the triumph of “sense” is inevitable. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/253 "2009-10-22T18:28:56Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Guess again. He repeated it today: > > [Obama: Fox News “basically operating as talk radio”](http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/64271-obama-suggests-fox-news-is-talk-radio) > > He’s right, and it will do absolutely nothing to hurt him, because no one with any sense disagrees. The problem is that there are a lot of people without sense, who do disagree, some of whom actually vote, and some of whom make enough money to have some left over at the end of the month to give to the RNC and their minions. As I said above, it would have been a far better thing to just put them on “ignore.” ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/254 "2009-10-22T18:31:43Z")
Yeah, and besides what anyone says, “talk radio” is very popular. You might was well take on Oprah or reality TV. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/255 "2009-10-22T18:37:17Z")
Looks like the White House is also finally [calling out Cheney](http://www.politico.com/politico44/perm/1009/no_dithering_72c09e61-e372-4ec7-b600-719ace41adbd.html) for the sniping, hypocritical punk that he is. I like this new direction. It’s asinine to assert that the White House should not be allowed to defend itself against political attacks. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/256 "2009-10-22T18:38:36Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Give it more time. This is just him saying he’s OK with what those guys said, and that he “isn’t losing any sleep” over it. What we won’t see, IMO, is his senior staffers going after Fox as they did earlier in the week. I don’t expect him to repudiate what they said, just to not trot it out again. Why not? There isn’t any downside. ---
**Author:** ![intention](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e95f7d/32.png) [@intention](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/intention)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/257 "2009-10-22T18:43:47Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I’d still like to know what horrible thing anyone thinks is going to happen. What is Fox going to do to Obama that it wasn’t already doing? Increase its viewership, convince more people that Obama is making mistakes, draw more independents towards the Republican side, get more people laughing at or outraged about or frightened by Obama, and generally move people away from the Left and towards the Right … only more so. You are right that Fox won’t do anything different … but it will definitely do more of what I see as bad things for the Administration. At present, Obama and the Democrats are trying to get a number of controversial bills through Congress. In that ongoing struggle, having more people shifting to the right is Not a Good Thing™ for the White House. And having the White House give Fox ammunition to push and encourage and increase that shift is A Really Dumb Thing™. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/258 "2009-10-22T18:44:02Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Yeah, and besides what anyone says, “talk radio” is very popular. You might was well take on Oprah or reality TV. The people who listen to talk radio are not reachable for him anyway. What are they going to do, vote Republican? They already do. No one’s going to be offended by any of this except people who already hate him anyway. Do you disagree that Fox has become analogous to conservative talk radio? I don’t see how a President making truthful statements can hurt himself. The truth is a perfect defense. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/259 "2009-10-22T18:44:29Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Looks like the White House is also finally [calling out Cheney](http://www.politico.com/politico44/perm/1009/no_dithering_72c09e61-e372-4ec7-b600-719ace41adbd.html) for the sniping, hypocritical punk that he is. I like this new direction. It’s asinine to assert that the White House should not be allowed to defend itself against political attacks. Going after Dick Cheney and his big mouth is NOT the same as going after a media outlet. Bad analogy. Also, from a purely practical standpoint, compare and contrast the favorability ratings of Cheney and Fox. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2009, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497/260 "2009-10-22T18:46:12Z")
> [@intention](#): > > Increase its viewership, convince more people that Obama is making mistakes, draw more independents towards the Republican side, get more people laughing at or outraged about or frightened by Obama, and generally move people away from the Left and towards the Right … only more so. > > You are right that Fox won’t do anything different … but it will definitely do more of what I see as bad things for the Administration. > > At present, Obama and the Democrats are trying to get a number of controversial bills through Congress. In that ongoing struggle, having more people shifting to the right is Not a Good Thing™ for the White House. > > And having the White House give Fox ammunition to push and encourage and increase that shift is A Really Dumb Thing™. This isn’t going to move a single person. Do you really think that lefties and independents are going to be offended by somebody saying that Fox News is right wing? Give me a break. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-vs-fox/514497.md?page=14)