# Obama was lying when he said he opposed gay marriage... anyone surprised? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 10, 2015, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306 "2015-02-10T17:31:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/21 "2015-02-10T20:51:43Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > The Religious Right was never going to vote for Obama anyway. > > So, just who ARE these “low information” (i.e. STUPID) voters Obama had to fool? > > Specify, please. Middle-of-the-road Christian white undecideds in swing states, like usual. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/22 "2015-02-10T20:54:44Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I’m not saying it wasn’t a shrewd political decision. I’m saying it was a disappointing moral one. As someone who was actually affected by it, I say “meh”. He did what he had to do to get elected. That didn’t include actually lying down with dogs…it just included scratching them behind the ears with one hand and hefting a rock behind his back with the other. ETA: Although there WERE moments in his 2008 campaign that had me tearing out my hair…the South Carolina event with Donnie McClurkin, the ex-gay gospel singer, for example. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/23 "2015-02-10T20:59:30Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > Middle-of-the-road Christian white undecideds in swing states, like usual. That’s nonsense, and you know it as well as Elvis. Elvis just desn’t want to go where his rhetoric is clearly leading him. Hint: who was it that defeated Prop 8 in California, even as Obama won the state by a landslide? (I’ll laugh in your proverbial faces if you try to pretend it was the Mormons!) ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/24 "2015-02-10T21:06:51Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Hint: who was it that defeated Prop 8 in California Passed, not defeated. Prop 8 was the proposal to ban same-sex marriage, not a proposal to legalize it. That had already been done by the CA Supreme Court earlier in the year. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/25 "2015-02-10T21:15:35Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > That’s nonsense, and you know it as well as Elvis. > > Elvis just desn’t want to go where his rhetoric is clearly leading him. > > Hint: who was it that defeated Prop 8 in California, even as Obama won the state by a landslide? (I’ll laugh in your proverbial faces if you try to pretend it was the Mormons!) Can you tell us who it was? I’m not sure why you’re bringing Prop 8 into this given that: 1. I said “Middle-of-the-road Christian white undecideds in swing states” and California is not a swing state. 2. Prop 8 passed. 3. Prop 8 was defeated by the courts. So, what can you tell Elvis and I what the dickens you’re trying to show with that? Or are you just going for the “throw random shit at a wall and maybe something will stick” approach? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/26 "2015-02-10T21:15:38Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > He chose, on his own, to say that he opposed gay marriage as a matter of Christian principle. On what grounds would a person oppose gay marriage outside of Christian principle? If he’s asked about gay marriage, he basically has to oppose it. Not opposing it is endorsing it, he can’t publicly endorse it without invoking fears that he’s going to make it an issue in his administration. He makes it an issue for his admin and people are going to think that the Dem legislators will go along with him, so it hurts other Democrats. So, at the time in question, he had to oppose it. When asked why, he needs to give some kind of reason, and Christian Principle is the only reason that isn’t insultingly idiotic. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/27 "2015-02-10T21:29:36Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > Or are you just going for the “throw random shit at a wall and maybe something will stick” approach? He’s trying to get one of us Lefties to blurt out “IT WAS THE BLACKS!” I’m sure he has a glib response to that at the ready. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/28 "2015-02-10T21:30:30Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > I said on these very boards, many years ago, that Obama was a cowardly liar who supported gay marriage but found it expedient to pretend otherwise. > > I don’t pretend to have been uniquely brilliant or prophetic. I daresay MOST people believed Obama was lying baout his position on gay marriage. The only disagreement was whether people should be angry about it. Generally speaking, social conservatives were angry and social liberals were nonchalant. > > And that’s understandable. MANY politicans on all sides find it prudent to clam up or mislead voters about where they stand. > > What makes Obama’s deceit a little more reprehensobel, in my opinion, is that he invoked God while lying. During the 2000 campaign, when he was being interviewed by Rick Warren, Obama declared “I believe that marriage is the union between a man and a woman. Now, for me as a Christian…it is also a sacred union. God’s in the mix.” > > That, in my opinion, makes Obama’s lie more repulsive than normal political dishonesty. NOBODY forced Obama to invoke Christian principles while opposing gay marriage. He chose, on his own, to say that he opposed gay marriage as a matter of Christian principle. > > That’s more than standard operational BS. That is a lie that borders on blasphemous. This might up the chances of the ‘secret atheist’. 🙂 If blasphemy is as meaningless to Obama as it is to me (and it is utterly without meaning to me), then invoking God and Christianity in a lie is no worse than any other ‘standard’ political lie. Which is how I feel about it – no worse than any standard political lie, and perhaps better, since without such a lie gay rights might have suffered (if a truly anti-gay President had been elected). ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/29 "2015-02-10T21:30:46Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > On what grounds would a person oppose gay marriage outside of Christian principle? The ick factor. For which Christian principle is a convenient cover, although not necessary. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/30 "2015-02-10T21:34:02Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > That’s nonsense, and you know it as well as Elvis. No, I don’t. Where do you get your “information” from? > [@](#): > > Elvis just desn’t want to go where his rhetoric is clearly leading him. Apparently you know where that is better than I do. So where is that? > [@](#): > > Hint: who was it that defeated Prop 8 in California, even as Obama won the state by a landslide? (I’ll laugh in your proverbial faces if you try to pretend it was the Mormons!) They certainly played a role, as did the black churches and you can laugh all you like, but every voter who still had visceral reactions to the concept played a role, as they did everywhere else. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/31 "2015-02-10T21:38:11Z")
I am not surprised in the least that Obama lied about this issue. I presumed he was always for Gay marriage but hid it for political expediency. He finally expressed his real feelings on the subject, yes, conveniently. I look at it as a shrewd move and am not disappointed at all. He probably still gets pissed when he has to put that freaking flag pin on. Count me as another who believes Obama is, if not an atheist, just nominally Christian. It’s all for show. Who cares? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/32 "2015-02-10T21:47:44Z")
> [@Onomatopoeia](#): > > I am not surprised in the least that Obama lied about this issue. I presumed he was always for Gay marriage but hid it for political expediency. Why did you think so? ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/33 "2015-02-10T21:50:46Z")
Do you _really_ think a politician would do that? Just get on TV and lie to everyone?? Next you’ll tell me pigs aren’t great aviators. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/34 "2015-02-10T21:54:33Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > That’s what a leader does \*after \*getting elected. Let’s not try to pretend that Obama has ever been a leader on gay rights. He took his position in favor of SSM after very, very carefully making sure that all the potential landmines had already been cleared by other people. Up until that point, he was as willing to throw the gay rights lobby under the nearest convenient bus, just like every other Democratic presidential hopeful. Needless to say, he was still better than the Republicans, who were generally _driving_ the bus. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/35 "2015-02-10T21:54:39Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Why did you think so? Does this look like a man who was ever against gays? [http://i41.tinypic.com/34rstus.jpg](http://i41.tinypic.com/34rstus.jpg) I’d bet a lot that upper class biracial professionals are even more likely to be pro-gay marriage than Jews. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/36 "2015-02-10T21:54:42Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Why did you think so? To be frank, I am not sure. To me, he always seemed to be overcompensating when speaking on matters impacting religion, such as Gay marriage. I presumed everyone felt the way I did. It seemed so obvious to me. I am more surprised there would be any hullabaloo about this coming out than anything else. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/37 "2015-02-10T22:00:27Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > Does this look like a man who was ever against gays? > [http://i41.tinypic.com/34rstus.jpg](http://i41.tinypic.com/34rstus.jpg) > I’d bet a lot that upper class biracial professionals are even more likely to be pro-gay marriage than Jews. And you would be correct. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/38 "2015-02-10T22:01:38Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Clearly, beheading is the only just punishment. Allah demands it! I hope the Secret Service guys that will be visiting you are of the more friendly variety. ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/39 "2015-02-10T22:05:58Z")
> [@GrandWino](#): > > I hope the Secret Service guys that will be visiting you are of the more friendly variety. You are aware, aren’t you (I hope), that \*\*John \*\*was simply sarcastically reflecting the absurdity of comments in the post prior to his? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306/40 "2015-02-10T22:09:46Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > As someone who was actually affected by it, I say “meh”. He did what he had to do to get elected. That didn’t include actually lying down with dogs…it just included scratching them behind the ears with one hand and hefting a rock behind his back with the other. > > ETA: Although there WERE moments in his 2008 campaign that had me tearing out my hair…the South Carolina event with Donnie McClurkin, the ex-gay gospel singer, for example. Donnie McClurkin is no longer gay. Right. That seems likely. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-was-lying-when-he-said-he-opposed-gay-marriage-anyone-surprised/712306.md?page=3)