# Obama's college transcripts **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 21, 2012, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492 "2012-04-21T12:20:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/81 "2012-04-23T15:58:53Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > How about some dates? When the issue arose. When the short-form was released. When the long form was released? The Obama campaign put the birth certificate online on June 12, 2008 in response to some low-key rumors. Some of those were about his citizenship, but others were about his name and the identity of his father. [The issue then exploded as people picked apart the details and insisted there were various problems with the birth certificate like PDF issues, anachronisms, and missing information.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barack_Obama_citizenship_conspiracy_theories) The long form was released in April 2011. ---
**Author:** ![yanceylebeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yanceylebeef/32/12290_2.png) [@yanceylebeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yanceylebeef)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/82 "2012-04-23T16:02:05Z")
Is there a rhetorical term for this “I’m just asking questions” form of muckraking? I am heartened that the OP is so concerned. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/83 "2012-04-23T16:02:39Z")
The smoking gun will be Obama’s “B-” in U.S. History, which may not prove that he \*hates \*America, but definitely shows that he doesn’t love it with the slow, grinding dry-hump of someone like a Mitt Romney. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/84 "2012-04-23T16:07:31Z")
> [@yanceylebeef](#): > > Is there a rhetorical term for this “I’m just asking questions” form of muckraking? It’s sometimes called JAQing or JAQing off. That’s not intended as a comment on whether or not the OP is doing it. Muckraking is giving it too much credit. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Hakuna\_Matata](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@Hakuna\_Matata](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hakuna_Matata)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/85 "2012-04-23T16:17:00Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > Belkieve it or not…my curiousity about his college record has little to do with where he was born. It wouldn’t prove it anyway. > > You folks in the middle need to be wary of how both sides try to deflect certain things and make it about what it isn’t. Okay so why then? What do you hope to prove to yourself if he releases his school records? I can’t see what anyone hopes to gain unless it is for political purposes. I am a very good Architect (damn good if I say so myself!) but I had a few unimpressive grades in my history. I was in my early 20’s and you know things happen to young men in college and sometimes we aren’t the most attentive to the bigger picture. But does that prove anything about me now? If you were hiring me to design your house, are you going to ask to see my grades? Or look at the body of work I have done for the last 30 years? Perhaps you should afford President Obama the same respect. Even the fact that this young inexperienced man (your paraphased words) was able to obtain the office of the President is pretty impressive wouldn’t you say? If he did that by pulling the wool over the eyes of half the population–well WOW, that is damn impressive! That is the type of clever we need running the country. 😉 But seriously, what do you hope to gain from seeing that he got a B- in Greek Literature? If not for political gain what is the reason? Trust me I rarely believe anything the right OR the left tries to feed me. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/86 "2012-04-23T16:28:12Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > I think that’s a complete cop-out answer. Pretend someone just asked you where Tom Petty was born. The answer is right there in Wikipedia, but I suppose it could be wrong. It’s wikipedia after all, and Tom Petty might have been lying about his birthplace for the last 60 years anyway. So would you say, “I don’t think we can ever be 100% sure.”? Or would you say, “Gainesville.”? > > Now pretend Obama is Tom Petty and give a straight answer. Sorry to hijack, but it’s so strange that you used this example because I was just watching a comedian I like (Pete Holmes) do a bit about how we all have easy access to information via Google, and the example he used was asking someone where Tom Petty was born (the gist being that before Google, if we didn’t know something, like where Tom Petty was born, we just didn’t know and that was ok.) ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/87 "2012-04-23T16:50:18Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Then perhaps you could be more explicit about what this is “about”. What exactly do you hope to learn from his college transcripts? If I don’t list a bunch of hypotheticals would that be copping out? I don’t think it would prove anything to anyone. I will cop to the mistake of using the term “transcripts” when I had additional college records (that may or may not even exist) in mind as well. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/88 "2012-04-23T16:56:08Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > Sorry to hijack, but it’s so strange that you used this example because I was just watching a comedian I like (Pete Holmes) do a bit about how we all have easy access to information via Google, and the example he used was asking someone where Tom Petty was born (the gist being that before Google, if we didn’t know something, like where Tom Petty was born, we just didn’t know and that was ok.) I should have credited Pete Holmes, because I 100% ripped that from him. I saw that bit on Conan and was laughing my ass off. ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/89 "2012-04-23T16:56:52Z")
> [@Hakuna\_Matata](#): > > Okay so why then? What do you hope to prove to yourself if he releases his school records? > > I can’t see what anyone hopes to gain unless it is for political purposes. I am a very good Architect (damn good if I say so myself!) but I had a few unimpressive grades in my history. I was in my early 20’s and you know things happen to young men in college and sometimes we aren’t the most attentive to the bigger picture. But does that prove anything about me now? If you were hiring me to design your house, are you going to ask to see my grades? Or look at the body of work I have done for the last 30 years? > > Perhaps you should afford President Obama the same respect. Even the fact that this young inexperienced man (your paraphased words) was able to obtain the office of the President is pretty impressive wouldn’t you say? If he did that by pulling the wool over the eyes of half the population–well WOW, that is damn impressive! That is the type of clever we need running the country. 😉 > > But seriously, what do you hope to gain from seeing that he got a B- in Greek Literature? If not for political gain what is the reason? > > Trust me I rarely believe anything the right OR the left tries to feed me. I’m heartened but you did fall for those who made my questions about his birth certificate and not his college records. His accomplishments are very impressive… and I don’t blame him for the tactics that any other politican would use… I’m more disrespectful of those who cover for him and his team. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/90 "2012-04-23T16:57:04Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > If I don’t list a bunch of hypotheticals would that be copping out? I don’t think it would prove anything to anyone. Well, you do know something: he graduated magna cum laude from Harvard Law. That means he was in the top ten percent of his class in terms of grades. What does that tell you? ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/91 "2012-04-23T16:57:44Z")
[Quote=Hakuna Matata] I am fairly sure the middle believes the current president was born in Hawaii. [/Quote] Is it ok to say that I’m not 100% sure Hawaii exists? I don’t know if anyone honestly can be 100% sure. Maybe those islands you fly out to are some entirely different set of islands. ---
**Author:** ![Hakuna\_Matata](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@Hakuna\_Matata](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hakuna_Matata)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/92 "2012-04-23T17:11:57Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > I’m heartened but you did fall for those who made my questions about his birth certificate and not his college records. > > His accomplishments are very impressive… and I don’t blame him for the tactics that any other politican would use… I’m more disrespectful of those who cover for him and his team. I didn’t believe I fell for anything. I am asking ‘you’ only. Do you see me engaging with anyone else in the thread? I only asked about his birth certificate to gauge how receptive you would be to rational discussion. I have not brought it up since then have I? So again my question is what is to be gained by him for releasing this info, and what do you hope to gain? As I mentioned I only see some political game unless you can give me another reason. And ‘because he won’t and I want him to’ isn’t sufficient for a rational discussion. I am willing to discuss this rationally, but you will need to convince me that there is some benefit to your side or to the President. Otherwise we have to assume it is purely for political benefit. So if his role is that of a politician and by your own words his accomplishments are impressive what is to be gained by releasing some data from 20-30 years ago? His recent proof of his ability as a impressive politician should be enough to convince you that he is qualified to be President. So what is gained by release of his college transcripts? BTW-the MSU you went to, is that Missouri State or Michigan State? I ask because my wife is a Mizzuo almuni…or is she? 🙂 She never has released her transcripts to me! ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/93 "2012-04-23T17:41:58Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > For instance, I imagine that yours was a matter of falling straight out head-first onto an extremely hard surface, but I suppose that info wouldn’t be included on the birth certificate. DianaG, let’s dial it back a bit, please. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/94 "2012-04-23T17:44:44Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > If I don’t list a bunch of hypotheticals would that be copping out? Yes. > [@](#): > > I don’t think it would prove anything to anyone. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/95 "2012-04-23T17:47:12Z")
> [@Hakuna\_Matata](#): > > I didn’t believe I fell for anything. I am asking ‘you’ only. Do you see me engaging with anyone else in the thread? I only asked about his birth certificate to gauge how receptive you would be to rational discussion. I have not brought it up since then have I? > > So again my question is what is to be gained by him for releasing this info, and what do you hope to gain? As I mentioned I only see some political game unless you can give me another reason. And ‘because he won’t and I want him to’ isn’t sufficient for a rational discussion. > > I am willing to discuss this rationally, but you will need to convince me that there is some benefit to your side or to the President. Otherwise we have to assume it is purely for political benefit. So if his role is that of a politician and by your own words his accomplishments are impressive what is to be gained by releasing some data from 20-30 years ago? His recent proof of his ability as a impressive politician should be enough to convince you that he is qualified to be President. So what is gained by release of his college transcripts? > > BTW-the MSU you went to, is that Missouri State or Michigan State? I ask because my wife is a Mizzuo almuni…or is she? 🙂 She never has released her transcripts to me! My apologies… I didn’t put all of your posts together. I do believe that others linked birth with college before you had. I’ll grant that it is a political game and he has nothing to gain…as I said before, my gripe is with those who like to play the same political games against my guys and the fair and balanced arbiters who rarely are. Michigan State…Class of Magic Johnson, my favorite black person ever:D !!! ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/96 "2012-04-23T17:53:18Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > I should have credited Pete Holmes, because I 100% ripped that from him. I saw that bit on Conan and was laughing my ass off. Awesome… Though I was kind of hoping that it was a coincidence. For anyone else, here’s [the stand-up bit we’re talking about](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQ4o1N4ksyQ). It’s a good laugh. ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/97 "2012-04-23T17:56:35Z")
Speaking of political games… check this [out](http://www.boston.com/news/politics/articles/2012/04/14/obama_urges_romney_to_release_past_tax_returns/). It’s about tax returns and the game player is Obama himself. I found it searching for something I seem to recall… a story/tape/something that the Boston Globe had for a long time but kept from the public. Couldn’t find it… maybe someone remembers. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/98 "2012-04-23T18:09:18Z")
Pretty much all Presidential candidates release their tax returns. Perhaps you’d care to try again? Some tiny effort to stay on topic, answer questions that you’re asked, and in general stop giving the appearance of… what was the term? JAQing off? ---
**Author:** ![Hakuna\_Matata](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@Hakuna\_Matata](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hakuna_Matata)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/99 "2012-04-23T18:11:19Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > My apologies… I didn’t put all of your posts together. I do believe that others linked birth with college before you had. > > I’ll grant that it is a political game and he has nothing to gain…as I said before, my gripe is with those who like to play the same political games against my guys and the fair and balanced arbiters who rarely are. > > Michigan State…Class of Magic Johnson, my favorite black person ever:D !!! No apology needed, just wanted to be clear that I hadn’t discussed the birth thing after my initial post. But to be fair no one here has asked for Mr. Romney to release his college transcripts have they? He shouldn’t if he is asked. I also saw your post about taxes, frankly my opinion that shouldn’t be released either, but there is lots of precedent for that from past political campaigns. But enough, I have wasted enough time today on this silliness. I should be working on the new deck design or my Mizzuo wife will have my ass in a sling when she gets home. But I am glad to hear you are really only after his transcripts for political gain and that you don’t see anything to be gained by their release. I just wasn’t seeing any reason for it. At least on taxes one could argue (poorly) that it shows him out of touch with the common guy, but when both of them are bringing in 6-7 figure salaries it is more comical than anything else on both sides. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2012, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492/100 "2012-04-23T18:15:39Z")
> [@What\_the](#): > > I will cop to the mistake of using the term “transcripts” when I had additional college records (that may or may not even exist) in mind as well. Why do you think Barack Obama owes you, personally, the release of information to which you are not entitled, and which has not been released about any other president in recent history? > [@What\_the](#): > > His accomplishments are very impressive… and I don’t blame him for the tactics that any other politican would use… I’m more disrespectful of those who cover for him and his team. What “tactics” are you alleging that Obama is engaging in other than not releasing documents that no other president in recent history has released? What are you alleging is being covered up? > [@What\_the](#): > > he has nothing to gain…as I said before, my gripe is with those who like to play the same political games against my guys and the fair and balanced arbiters who rarely are. What game are you alleging is being played by Obama’s failure to release private information that no other president in recent history has released? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-college-transcripts/619492.md?page=6)