# Obama's got 9 days to show some guts and save the republic **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [February 23, 2020, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393 "2020-02-23T15:09:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2020, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/201 "2020-02-27T18:28:03Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > I’m in a Pennsylvania union, and have been a little shocked at the people I eventually find listening to Rush or otherwise living in a pro-Trump world. I think there’s a big gap between union activists and many union members. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2020, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/202 "2020-02-27T18:33:23Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > I’m in a Pennsylvania union, and have been a little shocked at the people I eventually find listening to Rush or otherwise living in a pro-Trump world. I think there’s a big gap between union activists and many union members. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2020, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/203 "2020-02-27T19:00:26Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > I think that you think little of Black and Hispanic voters if you think their turnout is dependent on having someone of their identity as running mate. You don’t think there are Black and Hispanic low-engagement, low-information voters who need a reason to care? > [@](#): > > It wouldn’t hurt but top of importance list? No. Abrams might be good but not just because of “woman” and “Black”. [QUOTE] Oh, I agree with that. I think she’s one of the party’s rising stars, and I’d bet on her ability to motivate voters over, say, Cory Booker’s. But yeah, ‘woman’ and ‘black’ matter. If they matter 2-3 points of turnout in November, that’s big. > [@](#): > > A good VP running mate can complement (not “balance”) the campaign style of the top of the ticket, can bring two or three points to their home state (which might be significant), and can signal importance of issues (here identity can be part of doing that, but _record_ and _accomplishments_ more so). Most voters don’t know jack shit about record and accomplishments. (ETA: And I’m definitely including whites here.) And the 2-3 points to one’s home state - definitely true back in the day when all candidates were white men. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2020, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/204 "2020-02-27T23:45:08Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > … [Joe Hill? JOE HILL!!???](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-JW4DKxwQM) … I am severely disappointed that nobody quoted this link. A beautiful song about a great American hero, sung by Joan Baez, one of the greatest American vocalists and an authentic heroine. And the performance is live! At the 1969 Woodstock Concert. Imagine the enormous fidelity of this woman’s voice to produce this rendition LIVE. (BTW, the David she refers to at the beginning of the clip is her husband David Harris.) Giants walked the Earth, as recently as 1969. We’ve hardly seen their like since. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/205 "2020-02-28T01:39:32Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Is Joe Hill really still alive? Well, there [is a guy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Hill_%28writer%29) who writes fictiony stuff under that name. It is actually his first and half of his middle name. He is the son of a guy some of us may have heard of. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/206 "2020-02-28T05:49:12Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Look, there’s no evidence that they won by winning over disaffected Trump voters. How do you explain the fact that the Our Revolution and Justice Dems candidates failed to flip a single seat in the House, despite Bernie raising lots of online money for them and campaigning in their targeted districts? You lot never learn anything from dramatic and overwhelming failure. Same thing over in the UK with Labour and Jeremy Corbyn. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/207 "2020-02-28T07:24:57Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > How do you explain the fact that the Our Revolution and Justice Dems candidates failed to flip a single seat in the House, despite Bernie raising lots of online money for them and campaigning in their targeted districts? I’m not sure your point is completely fair. The U.S. is so polarized and the House so thoroughly gerrymandered that few Districts are even competitive to D vs R; those that are, require a moderate touch. For comparison: The right-wing Tea Party has been grotesquely successful. But how many Teabagging Representatives defeated a Democrat incumbent? (I don’t know, and may quickly be proved wrong.) ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/208 "2020-02-28T07:28:51Z")
ICYMI, Obama [did take some action](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2020/02/26/south-carolina-obama-demands-misleading-ad-biden-stop-airing/4886968002/) – to demand that SC broadcasters cease and desist running an ad that misquotes him as accusing Biden of being a racist. An ad being run by Republicans, who still view Joe Biden as the guy they will be facing in November. Master strategists, that lot. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 8:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/209 "2020-02-28T08:39:18Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > I’m not sure your point is completely fair. The U.S. is so polarized and the House so thoroughly gerrymandered that few Districts are even competitive to D vs R; those that are, require a moderate touch. > > For comparison: The right-wing Tea Party has been grotesquely successful. But how many Teabagging Representatives defeated a Democrat incumbent? (I don’t know, and may quickly be proved wrong.) But moderate Dems flipped 41 seats, a rather large number in historical terms. How is this more marginal than the presidential election coming down to a few thousand votes in a few Rust Belt states? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/210 "2020-02-28T13:16:19Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > How do you explain the fact that the Our Revolution and Justice Dems candidates failed to flip a single seat in the House, despite Bernie raising lots of online money for them and campaigning in their targeted districts? You lot never learn anything from dramatic and overwhelming failure. I haven’t seen enough facts to learn anything. Which districts are we talking about, and what are their Cook PVIs? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/211 "2020-02-28T13:25:12Z")
In my understanding, Justice Democrats deliberately targeted long-shot seats that weren’t getting much attention from other Democratic organizations. Sure, they could stick to easy wins – but that would be easy, and wouldn’t actually accomplish anything aside from getting to say they backed winners. It’s good to go after long-shot seats. Most of the time they’ll lose, but with time, those seats and districts may change, and the work they put in will be quite useful to the party. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/212 "2020-02-28T14:02:31Z")
Your understanding sounds like flushing money down the toilet. Where did you hear that? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/213 "2020-02-28T14:03:43Z")
Anyway, four days to go. _Help me, Obama, you’re my only hope!_ 😃 ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/214 "2020-02-28T14:18:20Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Your understanding sounds like flushing money down the toilet. Where did you hear that? I didn’t “hear” it – I looked at the list of seats and candidates they supported, and a very significant portion appeared like long shots to me. I don’t see it as a waste – some of those districts are changing and will continue to change. Investing now can have dividends in the future (and sometimes there are surprises). It doesn’t mean that we should only target long shot seats – it just means that, IMO, we shouldn’t ignore them. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2020, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/215 "2020-02-28T23:22:44Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > In my understanding, Justice Democrats deliberately targeted long-shot seats that weren’t getting much attention from other Democratic organizations. Sure, they could stick to easy wins – but that would be easy, and wouldn’t actually accomplish anything aside from getting to say they backed winners. > > It’s good to go after long-shot seats. Most of the time they’ll lose, but with time, those seats and districts may change, and the work they put in will be quite useful to the party. This sounds like a highly dubious rationalization/retcon. You’re telling me that they _could_ have had dozens more seats added to their caucus, and been able to point to their having been the force that gave Pelosi the gavel…but they chose to just let the moderates have those seats instead?!? That’s preposterous, and might actually be a worse commentary on their efficacy as a political force if it were true! ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/216 "2020-02-29T00:38:18Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > This sounds like a highly dubious rationalization/retcon. You’re telling me that they _could_ have had dozens more seats added to their caucus, and been able to point to their having been the force that gave Pelosi the gavel…but they chose to just let the moderates have those seats instead?!? That’s preposterous, and might actually be a worse commentary on their efficacy as a political force if it were true! I can’t make enough sense of this criticism to rebut it. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/217 "2020-02-29T03:54:34Z")
That’s on you then. What I wrote should be perfectly clear to anyone who is following along. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/218 "2020-02-29T05:16:43Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Anyway, four days to go. _Help me, Obama, you’re my only hope!_ 😃 _There it is, Rufus: South Carolina. You’ll never see a more wretched hi—_ ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/219 "2020-02-29T05:30:58Z")
There’s really only one thing I can add to this discussion (FWIW). I was SO angry with the Democrats in 2008. I thought: “Oh great! You guys are considering nominating a black man. Yeah, the USA will elect a black president… in about 50 years! IDIOTS! What were you smoking?” OK, who else you got? A woman? Named Clinton? What the hell is this suicide-fest, geez!? Yup. Sure enough, the morons nominated the wet-behind-the-big-ears black dude. Now, the guy seemed pretty damn smart and impressive to me but I wasn’t the sort of voter they had to reach. The nomination was just so tragically stoopid! Turns out the black dude named Hussein won. Blew my mind. I’ve tended to keep a bit quieter about supposed “long-shot candidates” since then. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2020, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393/220 "2020-02-29T06:11:17Z")
Political scientists have provided evidence (convincing to me) that a generic Democratic white dude would have won an absolute blowout in that cycle, instead of the merely comfortable win he had. Obama is my favorite president, so I’m obviously glad it worked out; but it was definitely a risk. Mark Shields and David Brooks on PBS Newshour tonight are singing my tune: > [@](#): > > DAVID BROOKS: I would make a call to Bill Clinton and Barack Obama. I think Bernie Sanders represents a challenge to their style of Democratic Party. And the only two people who can create unity in an anti-Sanders wing are Barack Obama and Bill Clinton. > And if they came in said, we’re going to organize, so we don’t divide the vote five or six ways, then they could be the only ones to do that. They’re probably not going to do it. They’re going to sit on the sidelines. But I do think, if they want to defend the Democratic Party as they understand it, this is the week. > This is the moment when they say, it’s going to be Biden, and we’re all going to work together, or it’s going to be X, and we’re all going to work together. I do think there has to be some leadership. Otherwise, it looks extremely likely to me that Bernie Sanders just walks away with it. > [@](#): > > MARK SHIELDS: I mean, I will wait for that duo to emerge arm in arm and say, we’re here selflessly to save the Democratic Party. > I mean, it would be welcome, but don’t sit up waiting for it. > > DAVID BROOKS: No, I understand that. And just FWIW, because there seems to be some confusion based on some of the responses here: I was never \*predicting \*this would happen. I was \*hoping \*it would happen, just like they are–but also just like them, not exactly holding my breath. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-got-9-days-to-show-some-guts-and-save-the-republic/848393.md?page=12)