# Obama's Libyan Adventure-Will It End Badly? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 22, 2011, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628 "2011-03-22T17:40:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2011, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/341 "2011-06-18T02:39:32Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > He has to fight members of his own party on this. That’s true, but I’m not talking about good faith disagreements over policy. What I’m talking about is not wanting to hand yet one more political football to a party who has decided it is in their best interest to make sure the federal government accomplishes nothing, and who has no qualms about holding important priorities hostage to petty agendas. If the modern GOP will play chicken with the debt limit to ensure tax cuts for millionaires and kill Medicare as we know it, you can be sure as the Pope is white that they’d turn Libya into an opportunity to cut food stamps, or some such nonsense. However, as I said in my post, them’s the breaks. Preserving Congressional oversight requires that you sometimes let self-interested assholes do the oversight. I think that might be a direct quote from Federalist 51, in fact.. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2011, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/342 "2011-06-18T02:54:20Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > What’s the difference in their goals? Have we destroyed their infrastructure, killed tens of thousands of innocent people, occupied the country, sent in Christian missionaries, or tried to erase their culture so we could reshape them into a Free Market Libertopia? Have we started with the torture yet? Has Obama used Libya as an excuse to funnel billions of dollars into the pockets of his cronies? Have we systematically killed boys using the excuse that boy = terrorist, the way we did in Fallujah? Have we been shooting people for stepping out of their houses? I don’t see much similarity at all. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/343 "2011-08-21T23:12:42Z")
So the skeptics of the action, will they now retract? It is proof it is better to take this method than the madness the Americans have done in Iraq and Afghanistan. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/344 "2011-08-21T23:14:44Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > So the skeptics of the action, will they now retract? It is proof it is better to take this method than the madness the Americans have done in Iraq and Afghanistan. You’re assuming those are the only two choices. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/345 "2011-08-21T23:26:51Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > So the skeptics of the action, will they now retract? It is proof it is better to take this method than the madness the Americans have done in Iraq and Afghanistan. You are assuming the skeptics are not simply trying to spin anything and everything as “OMG it is Obama’s fault!” As was said earlier in this thread, it is apparent that this is Libya’s revolution, led by Libyans, and they will rejoice in their victory. They will also likely acknowledge that the NATO air cover was a primary reason why they were able to be successful. There was no occupying foreign force, so there will hopefully be a peaceful transition. But I’m sure some way can be found to spin things against Obama. I await with bated breath. ---
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/346 "2011-08-21T23:30:49Z")
Depose one tyrant and stick another on the proverbial throne. I guess we’ve not learned anything from the past fifty or so years. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/347 "2011-08-21T23:34:41Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > But I’m sure some way can be found to spin things against Obama. I await with bated breath. > [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > Depose one tyrant and stick another on the proverbial throne. Looks like **Euphonious Polemic** is in no danger of suffocation. ---
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/348 "2011-08-21T23:38:12Z")
My post has little to do with Obama. Tell me, just how well has this type of situation worked out for the U.S. in recent memory? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/349 "2011-08-21T23:40:55Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > Depose one tyrant and stick another on the proverbial throne. I guess we’ve not learned anything from the past fifty or so years. Wow, you’re really up on the news. When has this happened? Do we know the tyrant’s name yet? What will the scores be in next weekends baseball games? ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/350 "2011-08-21T23:42:14Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > You’re assuming those are the only two choices. To say that A is better than B is not a statement that there is no such thing as C. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/351 "2011-08-21T23:43:17Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > My post has little to do with Obama. Tell me, just how well has this type of situation worked out for the U.S. in recent memory? When was the last time we did anything like this? NATO supporting a popular uprising isn’t the same as America invading a country, devastating it, slaughtering tens of thousands while making self righteous speeches about how we are doing it for their own good, then installing a puppet government and exploiting it. _Amazingly enough_, that tends to make people angry at America and not regard the imposed government as legitimate. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2011, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/352 "2011-08-21T23:44:53Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > Depose one tyrant and stick another on the proverbial throne. I guess we’ve not learned anything from the past fifty or so years. Republicans are proof of that. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/353 "2011-08-22T00:57:58Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > We can’t say the W word… > > I wish our spineless Congress would blast him for this. “Win”? Sure we can. This is a glorious day for democracy. How can it be more important to anyone to criticize Obama for something than to celebrate this? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/354 "2011-08-22T01:02:51Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > “Win”? Sure we can. > > This is a glorious day for democracy. How can it be more important to anyone to criticize Obama for something than to celebrate this? That post was written back in June, not on “this glorious day”. “W” was probably “war”. There was discussion about the War Powers Act, and Obama’s action wrt said act. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/355 "2011-08-22T01:15:55Z")
Whoosh. ---
**Author:** ![Ca3799](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ca3799](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ca3799)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/356 "2011-08-22T02:22:51Z")
Looks lime Quadaffi has split to Algeria while the ‘rebels’ have taken over Tripoli. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/357 "2011-08-22T02:37:33Z")
> [@Ca3799](#): > > Looks lime Quadaffi has split to Algeria while the ‘rebels’ have taken over Tripoli. Where are you seeing coverage of Qadaffi leaving Libya? I’m not seeing anything (yet, anyway). ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/358 "2011-08-22T02:58:39Z")
How indispensable was NATO air strikes for the anti-Gadaffhi forces? ---
**Author:** ![waterj2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/858c86/32.png) [@waterj2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/waterj2)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/359 "2011-08-22T03:11:45Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > How indispensable was NATO air strikes for the anti-Gadaffhi forces? Well, [this NY Times article](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/22/world/africa/22nato.html?_r=1) seems to mostly boil down to NATO officials saying they did a great job, so a grain of salt is warranted, but still: > [@](#): > > Through Saturday, NATO and its allies had flown 7,459 strike missions, or sorties, attacking thousands of targets, from individual rocket launchers to major military headquarters. The cumulative effect not only destroyed Libya’s military infrastructure but also greatly diminished the ability of Colonel Qaddafi’s commanders to control forces, leaving even committed fighting units unable to move, resupply or coordinate operations. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628/360 "2011-08-22T03:12:22Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > How indispensable was NATO air strikes for the anti-Gadaffhi forces? According to Foreign Office Minister Alistair Burt, [RAF fighters operating with Nato had played a “significant” role in the last 24 hours, attacking key regime communications targets.](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8713946/Libya-conflict-RAF-jets-attack-Gaddafi-strongholds.html) This would be in addition to the role they’ve played for the last few months of course. My opinion is that it would be pretty hard for the anti-Gadaffhi forces to have done much if Gadaffhi had control of the skys, so I think the NATO strikes had an important role to play. Air strikes alone though? Gadaffhi would still be there. Of course, you’re likely to hear other opinions as well. My advice is to critically examine each opinion for any signs of exaggeration or bias. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-libyan-adventure-will-it-end-badly/575628.md?page=19)