# Obama's Oath/ So help me God **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 21, 2009, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261 "2009-01-21T03:55:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/41 "2009-01-21T22:37:50Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > It’s more like someone saying, “Obama did not say the words in the correct order, and left out one word, therefore, he’s not really President and doesn’t have the authority to issue an Executive Order that outlaws the import of non-US manufactured ammunition\*, so I don’t have to comply.” > > \*Or whatever condition you wish to protest/avoid/violate. My point was that I am convinced (and I believe most of us are) that Obama gave the oath sincerely, even if the wording did not match the text in the Constitution _exactly_. Purpose of oath is fulfilled, as far as I am concerned. Should he have been denyed Secret Service protection for the time period when he realises he needs to ask for a do-over, and the actual do-over? The oath was given (and administered) in good faith. Isn’t intent important here? ---
**Author:** ![Rolken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df788c/32.png) [@Rolken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rolken)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/42 "2009-01-21T22:49:50Z")
Guys, guys, the precise wording of the oath is irrelevant. Look at the 20th amendment: > [@](#): > > The terms of the President and Vice President shall end at noon on the 20th day of January, and the terms of Senators and Representatives at noon on the 3d day of January, of the years in which such terms would have ended if this article had not been ratified; and the terms of their successors shall then begin. A careful perusal will clearly reveal that _nowhere does it specify EST_! His oath was inoperative regardless of the wording because in the vast majority of the US it was not yet noon! :eek: ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/43 "2009-01-21T23:05:21Z")
> [@flex727](#): > > You are correct. What I don’t understand is why Obama felt that the oath had to be stated to him correctly before he could say it correctly. If he was so concerned about saying it wrong, he should have just said it right and ignored Roberts’ version. If he had taken a minute or two to think about it, maybe he would have come to the same conclusion. But it was real-time, and you may have noticed that there were quite a few people watching. BTW - how many people were watching it live? Hundreds of millions I’d think. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/44 "2009-01-21T23:26:49Z")
> [@Keeve](#): > > I know that he put the word “faithfully” in the wrong place, but which word got omitted? I read today that Roberts left out the word “execute” in his second attempt - which might be why Obama went with Robert’s first try despite the mistaken word order. But I thought Obama said all the words. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/45 "2009-01-21T23:35:16Z")
Except “fnord”. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/46 "2009-01-21T23:35:35Z")
roberts reminded me of the vicar in 4 weddings and a funeral. i did laugh a bit. perhaps it would have been better to let pres. obama just do it on his own. are you ready to say the oath? yes. please proceed. recites oath. congratulations! all better, everyone happy. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/47 "2009-01-22T01:06:11Z")
FYI, BBC World News America reported that the chief justice visited the White House today and administered the oath again. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/48 "2009-01-22T01:47:54Z")
> [@](#): > > “We believe that the oath of office was administered effectively and that the president was sworn in appropriately yesterday,” White House counsel Greg Craig said in a written statement. > > “But the oath appears in the Constitution itself. And out of an abundance of caution, because there was one word out of sequence, Chief Justice Roberts administered the oath a second time.” Source: [Obama retakes oath of office after Roberts' mistake - CNN.com](http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/01/21/obama.oath/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/49 "2009-01-22T02:09:19Z")
I would prefer it if the President-elect would simply recite the 35 words without any prompting at all. A president too stupid to memorize that length of language, given two and a half months prep time, is far too stupid to be sworn in at all. This suggestion would certainly have spared us Bush entirely. That dumb fuck would still be reciting it in his mirror every night: “Ah, George Dubya Bush, do solemnly swear that Ah will faithlessly–uh, damn. I almost dud it right agin, Laura!” ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/50 "2009-01-22T03:53:09Z")
> [@CNN](#): > > The second oath – also administered by Roberts – took place at **7:35 p.m. Wednesday** in the White House’s Map Room. :eek: But what about the “executive” orders signed before then? And all the people “confirmed” by the “Senate”? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/51 "2009-01-22T04:01:06Z")
He became President at noon Eastern yesterday. It doesn’t matter when he took the oath. ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/52 "2009-01-22T04:08:34Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > He became President at noon Eastern yesterday. It doesn’t matter when he took the oath. Perhaps he’s President, but not empowered to “execute the office” (whatever that precisely means): > [@Article. II. Section 1.](#): > > **Before he enter on the Execution of his Office** , he shall take the following Oath or Affirmation: > > “I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.” Also, [from here](http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/01/20/MNAF15E20I.DTL): > [@](#): > > A do-over “would take him 30 seconds, he can do it in private, it’s not a big deal, and he ought to do it just to be safe,” said Boston University constitutional scholar and Supreme Court watcher Jack Beermann. **“It’s an open question whether he’s president until he takes the proper oath.”** ETA: I was mostly joking in my first post, but if they’re redoing the oath, he ought to re-sign any orders as well. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/53 "2009-01-22T04:39:38Z")
BBC mentioned that Obama is actually the third US president to have had to retake the oath of office but did not say who the other two were. Anyone know? BBC also pointed out that Roberts apparently took pride at never referring to his notes when he was a lawyer in court, and so he must have wanted to show he could administer the oath from memory. D’oh! He just discovered why all the previous chief justices read the oath. He’s still considered the president from 12 noon Tuesday, so I’m sure anything he signed still stands, but they did this just to be on the safe side, to guard against nuts like those that claim income tax is illegal because of Ohio not being a state when it was ratified or some such nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/54 "2009-01-22T05:19:16Z")
Various sites have made various claims and it’s too late now for me to track down the veracity of each. Those I’ve seen are Rutherford Hayes and Woodrow Wilson doing private ceremonies on a Sunday before the full blown inaugural on Monday, and Chester Arthur and Calvin Coolidge doing quick informal swearings-in with those officials on hand after the unexpected news of the president dying and then redoing the oath in more august settings in Washington. So Obama would be at least the fifth. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/55 "2009-01-22T05:24:02Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Various sites have made various claims and it’s too late now for me to track down the veracity of each. > > Those I’ve seen are Rutherford Hayes and Woodrow Wilson doing private ceremonies on a Sunday before the full blown inaugural on Monday, and Chester Arthur and Calvin Coolidge doing quick informal swearings-in with those officials on hand after the unexpected news of the president dying and then redoing the oath in more august settings in Washington. > > So Obama would be at least the fifth. I just thought of LBJ. Didn’t some lady judge swear him in aboard a plane en route back to Washington? Did he have to retake it? ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/56 "2009-01-22T06:27:47Z")
I’m wondering now if BBC meant the third president to have to take it again because it was flubbed the first time, not because it had to be done in a rush informmally. Anyone know of two other flubbed ones? ---
**Author:** ![iftheresaway](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ecae2f/32.png) [@iftheresaway](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iftheresaway)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/57 "2009-01-22T07:21:16Z")
> [@Colophon](#): > > These “recite after me” rituals are fraught with potential for screw-ups. At my wedding last year I left a gap of about six years (or so it seemed to me) before I said “I do”, because the registrar had one of those annoying tones where it sounds like she’s going to carry on talking but actually - > > … > Oh right - my turn to speak is it? :rolleyes: I did the same thing, because the priest (father?) who married me had a really hilarious voice, somewhat similar to the priest (preacher? pastor? minister?) in Princess Bride, and I was sort of daydreaming and smothering my laughter & it took me a minute to come back to earth. Back on topic, I’m glad to see that it wasn’t just/primarily Obama’s fault that the recitation was bungled; I watched the inauguration with two conservative friends who were being very gracious about their CRUSHING DEFEAT :p, and I was kind of inwardly cringing - my perfect moment was slightly less perfect! ---
**Author:** ![Keeve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f07891/32.png) [@Keeve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keeve)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/58 "2009-01-22T12:08:40Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > I just thought of LBJ. Didn’t some lady judge swear him in aboard a plane en route back to Washington? Did he have to retake it? She was a Federal judge. No problems. No do-over. ---
**Author:** ![Keeve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f07891/32.png) [@Keeve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keeve)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/59 "2009-01-22T12:41:22Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > I’m wondering now if BBC meant the third president to have to take it again because it was flubbed the first time, not because it had to be done in a rush informmally. Anyone know of two other flubbed ones? According to various articles in Wikipedia: **Rutherford Hayes** - Because March 4, 1877 was a Sunday, Hayes took the oath of office in the Red Room of the White House on March 3. This ceremony was held in secret, because the previous year’s election had been so bitterly divisive that outgoing President Grant feared an insurrection by Tilden’s supporters and wanted to ensure that any Democratic attempt to hijack the public inauguration ceremony would fail, Hayes having been sworn in already in private. Hayes took the oath again publicly on March 5 on the East Portico of the United States Capitol. **Woodrow Wilson** - _(Is this correct? March 4, 1913 was a Tuesday. The Wikipedia article on Wilson does not say anything odd about his inauguration.)_ **Chester Arthur** - Became President at the deat of President Garfield on Sept 19 1881. First oath was just past midnight on Sept 20 in New York City, with New York Supreme Court justice John R. Brady; the second time was upon his return to Washington two days later. _(I don’t know what the problem was which required to do-over. If being outside of DC was the problem, then LBJ should also have done so.)_ **Calvin Coolidge** - When President Harding died, Vice-President Coolidge was visiting his family home in Vermont. His father, a notary public, administered the oath of office. Coolidge returned to Washington the next day, and was re-sworn by Justice A. A. Hoehling of the Supreme Court of the District of Columbia, as there was some confusion over whether a state notary public had the authority to administer the presidential oath. _(I’m pretty sure that yesterday I read about a VP who was in Cuba when the president died, and so he took the oath in Cuba, and then again on US soil. Maybe I’m misremembering the story about Coolidge.)_ ---
**Author:** ![Keeve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f07891/32.png) [@Keeve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keeve)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261/60 "2009-01-22T12:59:46Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > I would prefer it if the President-elect would simply recite the 35 words without any prompting at all. A president too stupid to memorize that length of language, given two and a half months prep time, is far too stupid to be sworn in at all. According to [this YouTube audio-only clip](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHoSUBzO0f0), that’s almost what FDR did for his first term in 1933: First, Chief Justice Charles E. Hughes recited the whole thing, and then FDR said the whole thing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-oath-so-help-me-god/482261.md?page=4)