# Obama's Western Wall prayer published by Israeli newspaper. Invasion of privacy? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 26, 2008, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821 "2008-07-26T03:44:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Scuba\_Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Scuba\_Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scuba_Ben)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2008, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/41 "2008-07-26T21:23:47Z")
[QUOTE=5-4-Fighting] For Obama’s prayer. Thirty pieces of silver sounds about right. [/QUOTE] Silver closed yesterday at $17.32 per troy ounce. What’s the conversion factor between the troy ounce and the Sanctuary shequel? ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2008, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/42 "2008-07-26T21:46:54Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] It’s a very common practice for non-Jews to leave prayers in the Wall. I would guess that the _majority_ of Christians who visit the wall leave prayers there. The Wall is not closed to anyone and the practice of leaving prayers is not restricted. There’s also noth sacriligious about it from a Christian (or even Muslim) standpoint. It’s the same God, after all. [/QUOTE] Ah. I was unsure how far the earlier Catholic analogy could be safely extended. For example, I wouldn’t have expected a practitioner of Judaism to go to confession just because they happen to be visiting a Catholic church. I also wasn’t aware that the Wailing Wall had any special religious significance to Christians or Muslims (although an internet search appears to indicate that Muslims consider it sacred because Mohammed tied his magic ass to it at one point-- I therefore presume that any Muslim messages are addressed to Mohammed’s ass). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2008, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/43 "2008-07-26T22:05:01Z")
[QUOTE=Terrifel] Ah. I was unsure how far the earlier Catholic analogy could be safely extended. For example, I wouldn’t have expected a practitioner of Judaism to go to confession just because they happen to be visiting a Catholic church. [/QUOTE] Not comparable. Christians trace their roots to Judaism, so honoring the old Temple isn’t inconsistent with their own religion. Partaking in a Christian sacrament would be tantamount to rejecting Judaism. A better analogy would be for an Israeli politician to have an audience with the Pope while visiting Rome. But there really aren’t any good analogies because of the fact that Judaism preceded Christianity and Christianity derives from Judaism. ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2008, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/44 "2008-07-26T22:50:03Z")
[QUOTE=clairobscur] And yes, it’s definitely an invasion of privacy. And I not only fault the student. The paper shouldn’t have printed it, either. Actually, I would blame much more the paper than a random kid for this stunt. [/QUOTE] This is exactly what I came on here to say. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2008, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/45 "2008-07-26T23:01:37Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] That’s probably why it didn’t end with, “Let me kick McCain’s ass in November.” [/QUOTE] Or, “Please give Sean Hannity eyeball herpes.” ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2008, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/46 "2008-07-27T01:09:05Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] Or, “Please give Sean Hannity eyeball herpes.” [/QUOTE] Speaking as one whose eye hosts a sizable colony of _h. simplex_, I wouldn’t wish it on anyone, even Sean Hannity. Well, maybe him. Just a _little_. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2008, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/47 "2008-07-27T02:57:43Z")
Patriot and frustrated editor that I am, I wish Obama had included a prayer for his country. But that’s just me. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2008, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/48 "2008-07-27T03:08:33Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] Obama is a savvy enough politician to know that whatever he wrote might be found and published, in this day and age [/QUOTE] True. The guy is nothing if not circumspect. There’s going to be zero political fallout from this, I think. It would have hurt him if he’d prayed to win the election, but he had the sense not to write that, so this will probably be over after the comedy shows make some jokes about it Monday. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2008, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/49 "2008-07-28T18:38:30Z")
I’m uncomfortable with the thought of **anyone** publicly placing a prayer in the Wall. As though they were doing it so that they could be seen doing it. ETA: My notion of an appropriate praying spot is in a closet. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/50 "2008-07-29T01:06:49Z")
[QUOTE=kaylasdad99] ETA: My notion of an appropriate praying spot is in a closet. [/QUOTE] Yes, but then we’d get the headline: Obama prays, then comes out of closet. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/51 "2008-07-29T06:38:33Z")
It looks like [Obama leaked the prayer to reporters beforehand.](http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/07/28/is-anything-sacred.aspx) At least, that’s what the paper in the center of all this is claiming. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/52 "2008-07-29T06:50:40Z")
The Obama campaign is denying it. I find the claim rather dubious. Why would the paper wait all this time to say that, and why would they need the prayer to be given to them by a scavenger? This sounds like bullshit to me. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/53 "2008-07-29T06:56:54Z")
Well, maybe. Obama’s not dumb enough not to know something like this could easily happen, his “prayer” was harmless enough, nothing to provoke scandal, might make sense to get it on the record before somebody distorts it. Now, if it had said “Dear God, please give Robert Novak a brain tumor…” ---
**Author:** ![Shugahhhh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee59a6/32.png) [@Shugahhhh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shugahhhh)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/54 "2008-07-29T07:01:34Z")
[QUOTE=Leaper] It looks like [Obama leaked the prayer to reporters beforehand.](http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/07/28/is-anything-sacred.aspx) At least, that’s what the paper in the center of all this is claiming. [/QUOTE] With subsequent posts on the same TNR page providing evidence that this was not the case, including a statement by the paper in question that the prayer was removed from the wall by a student after the fact. It’s good that you provided a link; I hope other posters read the entire page before assuming it was intentionally handed over by the Obama campaign. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/55 "2008-07-29T07:35:39Z")
If you read the actual statement by the paper, it isn’t even claiming that Obama leaked the note or 'approved" its publication. It only says this: > [@](#): > > In response, a Ma’ariv spokesman said that “Barack Obama’s note was approved for publication in the international media even before he put in the Kotel, a short time after he wrote it at the King David Hotel in Jerusalem. In any case, since Obama is not a Jew, publishing the note does not constitute an infringement on his right to privacy.” It doesn’t say approved _by the Obama campaign_ and it doesn’t say Obama gave them a copy. Reading the actual statement from _Ma’riv_, it looks like they were talking about some kind of religious approval, not approval from Obama, and that TNR basically just extropolated facts thatweren’t in the statement. The whole thing is full of holes anyway. the paper itself says it got the note from the kid who lifted it. Why would they need that if Obama had leaked it to them? Why would Obama leak it and then expect the paper not to say it had been leaked. Why did another paper get a copy of the note (it doesn’t say from Obama) and then decide not to publish it out of “respect for obama’s privacy” if Obama was the one who had given it to them? The TNR insinuations are complete bullshit. Of course, the allegation is all that matters now. The meme that Obama leaked his prayer to the press will now become right wing Gospel. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/56 "2008-07-29T13:58:55Z")
Apparently, the pilfering kid who pried the note out of the Wall has admitted guilt, apologized: [http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/07/yeshiva-student.html](http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/07/yeshiva-student.html) > [@](#): > > “I am asking for Obama’s forgiveness," said Aleph. “If he was offended by it… of course he was, this is not a nice thing to do. It was sort of a prank. I hope he will forgive us, and we hope that he will win the presidency.” Meanwhile, in Israel there are calls to boycott the offending paper until it apologizes as well: [http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1006139.html](http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1006139.html) > [@](#): > > “The boycott will be lifted,” he added, “after the newspaper publishes a notice, both in Hebrew and in English, apologizing for its lack of sensitivity and for its violation of Senator Obama’s privacy and honor.” ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/57 "2008-07-29T14:31:33Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] Reading the actual statement from _Ma’riv_, it looks like they were talking about some kind of religious approval, not approval from Obama, and that TNR basically just extropolated facts thatweren’t in the statement. [/QUOTE] I think I agree. This is vague and potentially deceptive. It’s possible that the Obama campaign would approve publication and then deny it, but it doesn’t make sense with the report that the prayer was plucked from the Wall. If they already had the prayer, they didn’t need to report that part; they could’ve just said they ‘obtained a copy’ and ignored the seediest part of this story. And the privacy comment apparently refers to Israeli law, which they are being accused of violating. Denials of legal responsibility have to be read very closely. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/58 "2008-07-29T18:21:43Z")
Obama would have to be a whole lot crasser/stupider than I think he is to leak a prayer to an Israeli newspaper before slipping it into the Wailing Wall. That would reek. I just don’t see it. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/59 "2008-07-29T18:31:49Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] Obama would have to be a whole lot crasser/stupider than I think he is to leak a prayer to an Israeli newspaper before slipping it into the Wailing Wall. That would reek. I just don’t see it. [/QUOTE] It would also be odd if Ma’ariv was the only outlet they leaked it to. If it was leaked or approved by the campaign for publication in the international media, why Ma’ariv? Why not a non-Israeli paper which wouldn’t be potentially subject to these religious laws? ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2008, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821/60 "2008-07-29T19:23:28Z")
> [@M'ariv](#): > > In response, a Ma’ariv spokesman said that “Barack Obama’s note was approved for publication in the international media even before he put in the Kotel, a short time after he wrote it at the King David Hotel in Jerusalem. In any case, since Obama is not a Jew, publishing the note does not constitute an infringement on his right to privacy.” This reads like an admission that the paper was planning on obtaining the prayer all along. Anybody else see it that way? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obamas-western-wall-prayer-published-by-israeli-newspaper-invasion-of-privacy/457821.md?page=4)