# Obsessive Sci-Fi/Fantasy Fans **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 19, 2007, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443 "2007-07-19T20:55:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/1 "2007-07-19T20:55:24Z")
Hello, my name is Marc, and I’m a recovering Trekkie. I know that there are obsessive fans of other things, including sports, Barbie, mystery novels, and the Dresden Dolls, but there’s something about science fiction and fantasy that seems to draw the really die hard fans. The prototypcial example of this kind of fandom might be Star Trek or perhaps Lord of the Rings if we take into account the “Frodo Lives” campaign during the 60s and 70s. (I don’t know which fandom came first.) What is it about science fiction and fantasy attracts so much attention among fans? When I was heavily into Star Trek I had technical manuals, novels, board games, role playing games, and I attended conventions from time to time. Other than attending conventions, I was pretty much the same way about Star Wars. Many of my friends fell so much in love with Firefly that they dubbed themselves Browncoats, attend multiple Firefly watching parties, and one even got a Firefly tattoo. I don’t look down on anyone who is part of a fan group. I used to be one of them. I’m just wondering what it is about science fiction and fantasy that draws the die hard fans. Any ideas? Marc ---
**Author:** ![Autumn\_Almanac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d26b3c/32.png) [@Autumn\_Almanac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autumn_Almanac)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/2 "2007-07-19T21:02:59Z")
I don’t think sports fandom is much different really. Think about all the people who wear sports jerseys frequently, decorate their homes with posters and memorabilia, read sports magazines, talk about sports every day at work, etc. It’s just so common that it doesn’t _seem_ excessive, compared to the same degree of sci-fi fandom. ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/3 "2007-07-19T21:24:50Z")
For me, trips to conventions were about spending time in crowds where I’d be able to talk about things that interested me, instead of having to listen to everyone babbling about Friends, or Seinfeld, or Survivor, or Big Brother. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/4 "2007-07-19T21:47:03Z")
It’s an escape from reality, into a world in which the only limitation is the writer’s imaginations; even basic physics, physiology, et cetera gets tossed out the window at the convenience of the plot. Plus, Sci-Fi/Fantasy has more redheads per capita than a Viking hamlet, which is always a draw for geeks. All that being said, I don’t know you can really identify Trekkies or whatever the equivilent _Star Wars_, _Firefly_, Tolkein, et cetera fans are called. There are plenty of people involved in Civil War re-enactment (which is peculiar to me, not very far from Germans hypothetically dramatizing the _Kristallnacht_, but whatever), romance novel junkies, wine zealots, people who watch professional golf live, et cetera. Sci-Fi/Fanty fans are just more…oddly dressed than most. Obligatory _Galaxy Quest_ quote: Gwen DeMarco: (rising up to help injured cute alien) “Hi!.. Hi there little guy…” Crewman #6/Guy: (pulling her back behind rock) “Jesus, didn’t ANY of you watch the show!?” Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/5 "2007-07-19T21:56:36Z")
I don’t see any sci-fi/fantasy fans rioting and flipping over police cars if one of their movies wins an academy award, but I find myself hoping the Montreal Canadiens won’t win another Stanley Cup anytime soon. Or failing that, the Montreal cops show some backbone and start shooting to kill. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/6 "2007-07-19T22:00:19Z")
Before science fiction really emerged as a genre, you had the same kind of fan following for the Sherlock Holmes stories. Heck, you still have that kind of fan following for them; they’re just outnumbered by the science fiction fans now. But there’s not much difference between the folks who conclude that Watson’s middle name must be “Hamish” and argue about who’s the fourth-smartest man in London, and those who calculate the effective speeds of various warp factors and debate the relative power levels of the Wormhole Prophets and the Organians. ---
**Author:** ![TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/51bf81/32.png) [@TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/7 "2007-07-19T22:11:12Z")
Assuming that most things not centered in our reality are a form of escapism (pretty much an inarguable point that I, as a huge SF/F fan, embrace), dealing with entire worlds, realities, and other cosmologies presents a truly endless vault of material for fans to think about, talk about about with each other, debate, read about, and even write about on their own (via fanfiction dealing with unexplored segments of whatever reality or “world” they’re dealing with). I believe that this is the reason that they get so crazily “into” whatever SF/F thing that they’re interested in - because it truly allows them a quasi-endless reality to “escape into.” I mean, for something like Star Wars or Star Trek alone, there are a million things to think about and talk about - the entire structure of the different forms of galactic government, different types and models of spaceships and the way that they work and operate within the phsyics of the “world” being dealt with, the force, a multitude of alien races and all of their cultures, customs, physiology, etc. etc. And that’s barely scratching the surface. On the other hand, a sports fan’s (for example) fandom pretty much begins and ends with the surface level, because that thing already exists within our real world. They’ll discuss how Bret Favre plays and analyze his signature moves, but they won’t discuss the way that physics is involved with the spin of the ball that he catches or the history and customs of the city in which he plays, because those things are taken as _givens_ - they already exist in our reality and are common knowledge or just implicit. On the other hand, something like Quidditch or Blitzball (to use a fictitious sport example) **also** begs those questions, because it’s operating in a fantasy reality where such things and physics and history aren’t implicit or assumed - “how does the snitch fly? What’s it made of? Does it direct itself or does someone else control it? What’s the history of the sport? How do those Blitzball players breathe underwater? How is the big ball of water held suspended for them to play in?” etc. etc. etc. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/8 "2007-07-19T22:38:11Z")
[QUOTE=MGibson] I’m just wondering what it is about science fiction and fantasy that draws the die hard fans. [/QUOTE] One guess is that SF and fantasy, being set as they are in other worlds, appeal most to people who are less than comfortable with this world. Spending time in those other worlds is a way of evading the rules, restrictions, and frustrations of this one. I hope I’m expressing this in as neutral and nonjudgmental a way as I intend. There are lots of things that can be said both for and against such escapism. ---
**Author:** ![sturmhauke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e47c2d/32.png) [@sturmhauke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sturmhauke)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/9 "2007-07-19T23:32:30Z")
The best SF and fantasy can explore the human condition in ways that more reality-based stories can’t. For instance, the vampire Angel from the Buffyverse was cursed by having his soul returned to him after centuries of undeath, so that he would be tormented by the knowledge of his own monstrous acts. Furthermore, the curse would be lifted if he ever experienced true joy, thus returning him to his previous vampiric self. So here you have this vicious supernatural killer, trying to atone for his sins, but also keeping his emotional distance from the world so that he doesn’t revert. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/10 "2007-07-19T23:46:41Z")
[QUOTE=VCO3] How do those Blitzball players breathe underwater? [/QUOTE] They can hold their breath for superhuman periods. As for the OP, I don’t think that scifi/fantasy fans are any more obsessive than other fans; it’s just that people feel freer to make fun of them. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2007, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/11 "2007-07-19T23:54:25Z")
[QUOTE=Der Trihs] They can hold their breath for superhuman periods. As for the OP, I don’t think that scifi/fantasy fans are any more obsessive than other fans; it’s just that people feel freer to make fun of them. [/QUOTE] Yeah, they’re easier to spot (often times). A baseball fan may be just as much, or even more so, a complete nutter about their team than a Trekker may be about Trek, for instance. But all you _see_ is guy wearing a baseball cap, maybe a jersey. With a Trekker, tho, say, at a convention, or at a new movie premeir, you might see them wearing an IDIC pin, or a redshirt jersey, and everybody thinks that weird, even tho the level of fandom is the same. Even the make up stuff goes for both some sports fans and some sci-fi-ers. (BTW, even tho I am an Ultimate Trekker, you’re more likely to see me in an Elway throwback jersey than wearing anything large and trekkish. An IDIC pin is about as far as I go, visually.) ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2007, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/12 "2007-07-20T00:00:17Z")
Science fiction fandoms long predates Star Trek. The first (very small) Worldcon was in New York in 1939, I think. Uncle Hugo helped get it started with his letters columns, and there were active letter writers even before that. I think it was highly intelligent people who were interested in stuff that was considered crazy, like going to the moon banding together. Mystery stories and Holmes were considered respectable, but sf was gosh-wow stuff, read by kids in propeller beanies. SF was the field where fans set up publishing houses to get out books, which had been serialized in Astounding, that the normal presses wouldn’t touch. Star Trek fandom grew out of sf fandom originally, but had a much bigger base. But I’m not a fan, I just read (and collect) the stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2007, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/13 "2007-07-20T15:29:58Z")
[QUOTE=Voyager] . I think it was highly intelligent people who were interested in stuff that was considered crazy, like going to the moon banding together. Mystery stories and Holmes were considered respectable, but sf was gosh-wow stuff, read by kids in propeller beanies. But I’m not a fan, I just read (and collect) the stuff. [/QUOTE] As a kid I had access to an uncles collection of pulp S.F. mags ,Nebula ,A. Sts.,Fantasy and Science Fiction amongst others which I read voraciously. In those days it was very much a minority/cult genre and both fans and writers seemed to all be Futurists as well. The writing though often crude was a lot more imaginative and "out of the box"then todays output and covered sociological.psychological and biological issues as well as the more obvious sciences . Todays efforts seem to be mostly what we used to call "Space Opera " ie. ordinary topics transported to either space or the future . The only exceptions to this rule today that I am aware of personally are the stories by Ian M.Banks who has an incredibly creative imagination but whos plots tand to leave me feeling vaguely depressed at the end ,wondering why the main characters bothered doing anything . To sum up, Harrumph ! you youngsters call that S.F.? why in my day… ---
**Author:** ![hotflungwok](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/edb3f5/32.png) [@hotflungwok](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hotflungwok)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2007, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/14 "2007-07-20T16:27:54Z")
Part of it is the sense of belonging, being part of something. A large section of the group you’re talking about is marginalized in just about all other social aspects, so having something to feel a part of can be important, especially if never have before. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2007, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/15 "2007-07-20T16:31:44Z")
[Obligatory Onion link.](http://www.theonion.com/content/node/38664) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2007, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/16 "2007-07-20T16:54:51Z")
From [_The Encyclopedia of Science Fiction,_](http://www.amazon.com/Encyclopedia-Science-Fiction-John-Clute/dp/0312096186/ref=sr_1_4/102-0323301-0796122?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1184950589&sr=1-4) by John Clute and Peter Nichols: > [@](#): > > From the 1920s to the 1950s, when sf was a minority interest, the number of people in fandom was small, probably no more than 500 at any one time. Since the 1960s, however, the number has steadily increased to more than 10,000 – though this figure, of course, represents no more than a tiny fraction of the wider sf readership. Fandom is, like GENRE SF, primarily a US phenomenon, though other English-speaking countries quickly adopted the concept. Continental Europe, Japan and elsewhere followed much later; but increasing translation of and interest in sf has now spread fandom to some 30 countries, from Mexico to Norway. It is made up of both writers and readers of sf; many authors started as fans and many fans have written sf, so there is no absolute distinction between the two groups. Fans themselves are mainly young and male with higher education and a scientific or technical background, but exceptions are numerous and the stereotype is becoming less pronounced. Many more women entered fandom in the 1970s and 1980s. > > Fandom is not a normal hobbyist group. It has been suggested that, if sf ceased to exist, fandom would continue to function quite happily without it. That is an exaggeration; but it indicates the difference between sf fans and ostensibly similar groups devoted to Westerns, romances, detective fiction, etc. The reason may lie in the fact that sf is a speculative literature and consequently attractive to readers actively interested in new ideas and concepts, in addition to those idly seeking entertainment. Early fans took part in rocketry, radical politics and quasi-utopian experiments; later fans seem to find fanzines, conventions and the interaction of fandom itself a sufficient outlet for their energies and ideas. Though fandom has a tradition and a history, even a FAN LANGUAGE, fans are notably independent; relatively few belong to national organizations such as N3F or the BRITISH SCIENCE FICTION ASSOCIATION, and many publish individual and independent fanzines, a fact that at least one outside sociologist – Fredric Wertham (1895-1981) in The World of Fanzines (1973) – has found remarkable and even “unique.” > > There is a fannish word “fiawol”, an acronym for “fandom is a way of life”: the joke is not altogether untrue. Just as sf is unrestricted in the scope of its interests, so too are fans and fandom. Fandom is thus a collection of people with a common background in sf and a common interest in communication, whether through discussion, chatter, correspondence or fanzine publishing. The result is more a group of friends, or even a subculture, than a simple fan club or literary society. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2007, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/17 "2007-07-20T17:43:35Z")
[QUOTE=Lust4Life] . Todays efforts seem to be mostly what we used to call "Space Opera " ie. ordinary topics transported to either space or the future . The only exceptions to this rule today that I am aware of personally are the stories by Ian M.Banks who has an incredibly creative imagination but whos plots tand to leave me feeling vaguely depressed at the end ,wondering why the main characters bothered doing anything . To sum up, Harrumph ! you youngsters call that S.F.? why in my day… [/QUOTE] Nothing new there. The very first issue of Galaxy, from 1950, had a back cover ad titled “You’ll never see it in Galaxy.” It had two columns, with the left having a stereotyped Western story, and the right having the same story as sci-fi (and I use the term advisedly) with a pistol replaced by a blaster, etc. Or, what James Blish called the “call a rabbit a smerf” story. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2007, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/18 "2007-07-20T17:47:09Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] From [_The Encyclopedia of Science Fiction,_](http://www.amazon.com/Encyclopedia-Science-Fiction-John-Clute/dp/0312096186/ref=sr_1_4/102-0323301-0796122?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1184950589&sr=1-4) by John Clute and Peter Nichols: [/QUOTE] FIAWOL had its opposite FIJAGH (fandom is just a goddam hobby.) Im have to mention Forry Ackerman’s story “A Way of Life,” which is set in a post-nuclear age. Fandom has taken over the world, since fans had all the mimeographs and could set up communication first. People flew on Heinleiners to go to the capital of Russia, Moskowitz. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2007, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/19 "2007-07-20T18:02:42Z")
[QUOTE=Voyager] FIAWOL had its opposite FIJAGH (fandom is just a goddam hobby.) [/QUOTE] Either way – Death Does Not Release You! ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2007, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443/20 "2007-07-20T22:15:59Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Either way – Death Does Not Release You! [/QUOTE] Yeah, but you can GAFIATE (Get Away From it All). [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obsessive-sci-fi-fantasy-fans/412443.md?page=2)