# Obvious things about a creative work you realize after the millionth time (OPEN SPOILERS POSSIBLE) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 24, 2009, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117 "2009-07-24T13:20:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 142
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2821 "2017-11-18T12:37:33Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > No other reasonable way to interpret [this scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gy97RcGoFes). Margaret got into everyone’s business and was quirky as hell. Simply wanting to check out the Hot Girl is as much about her quirkiness as anything. IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2822 "2017-11-18T14:27:04Z")
To Kill a Mockingbird is one of my favorite books and one of my favorite movies. It took the made-up trivia thread to realize that attorney Atticus Finch is a bird who gets mocked for defending Tom Robinson. FINCH being his last name is obviously not a coincidence, but it never occurred to me. I do like to think that Dennis Finch of Just Shoot Me is his grandson. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2823 "2017-11-18T16:21:47Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > Margaret got into everyone’s business and was quirky as hell. Simply wanting to check out the Hot Girl is as much about her quirkiness as anything. IMHO. That’s not the way jokes work. If Margaret was just being quirky then there was no need to have the men show up before her. The scene only works if you see the men’s appearances as the set-up and Margaret’s appearance as the punchline. ---
**Author:** ![Eclipse\_Chaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@Eclipse\_Chaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eclipse_Chaser)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2824 "2017-11-18T18:17:22Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > No other reasonable way to interpret [this scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gy97RcGoFes). She’s just being curious. She saw all the guys falling over themselves to get in there and went to see what all the fuss was about. Any woman would do the same. ---
**Author:** ![furryman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/furryman/32/99_2.png) [@furryman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furryman)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2017, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2825 "2017-11-18T19:46:26Z")
> [@Isamu](#): > > That zoom-in shot of the boy who gets left Home Alone in the eponymous movie is (probably) supposed to be a parody of Munch’s The Scream. I think it was from a post here that I realised that the mask in the movie Scream is supposed to be a 3D rendering of the face in the painting. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2826 "2017-11-19T18:39:57Z")
> [@furryman](#): > > I think it was from a post here that I realised that the mask in the movie Scream is supposed to be a 3D rendering of the face in the painting. Whoa! Thanks. Just realized that now myself. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2827 "2017-11-19T19:23:51Z")
I’d like to see a reliable cite for that. They aren’t really all that similar. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2017, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2828 "2017-11-19T23:02:16Z")
For years, I thought the line in Boney M’s “Rasputin” was “and his eyes were flaming coals.” Watching them on YouTube the other day, I could tell from the way their mouths moved that it’s “in his eyes a flaming glow.” :smack: ---
**Author:** ![furryman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/furryman/32/99_2.png) [@furryman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furryman)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2017, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2829 "2017-11-20T20:47:33Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > I’d like to see a reliable cite for that. They aren’t really all that similar. [Shrugs] The movie is named Scream. Imagine someone wearing that mask holding there hands up to their face, like in the painting. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2017, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2830 "2017-11-21T00:01:13Z")
Shrug right back at you. Have you taken a good look at them both? [The Scream](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9d/The_Scream_by_Edvard_Munch%2C_1893_-_Nasjonalgalleriet.png) [Ghostface](https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/villains/images/6/60/Creamer.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20151224171143) 1. The Scream has a human face, with skin. Ghostface is a skull. 2. The Scream has round eyes, Ghostface has eyes shaped like a , 3. The Scream has eyelids and irises. Ghostface has empty black holes. 4. The Scream has two nostrils. Ghostface has a slit shaped like **^** 5. The Scream has a short chin. Ghostface has a chin at least twice as long. All I can say is, if the mask was deliberately based on the painting, they did a really lousy job of it. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2017, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2831 "2017-11-21T00:54:43Z")
This is convinced the mask is at least partly based on the painting: > **[Ghostface (identity)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghostface_(Scream))** > > Ghostface (alternatively stylized as Ghost Face or GhostFace) is a fictional identity that is adopted by the primary antagonists of the Scream franchise. The figure was originally created by Kevin Williamson, and is primarily mute in person but voiced over the phone by Roger L. Jackson, regardless of who is behind the mask (as all killers use a voice changer utilizing that exact voice, starting in person with Scream 2). The disguise has been adopted by various characters in the movies and in th... ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2017, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2832 "2017-11-21T01:30:14Z")
I saw that. Uncited claim. I think I’ll add a citation needed tag to it. ---
**Author:** ![Mithras](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f04885/32.png) [@Mithras](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mithras)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2017, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2833 "2017-11-21T11:10:04Z")
> **[MTV’s Terrifying Mistake? Wes Craven Explains Why the Original ‘Scream’ Mask...](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/wes-cravens-last-interview-horror-788393/)** > > Wes Craven tells The Hollywood Reporter why the "Ghostface" mask is so iconic and why he has little to do with MTV's reboot despite EP credit, Bob Weinstein teases MTV's plans for the killer's new look, and the mask's original designer shares what... > [@](#): > > “As an animation junkie,” she continues, explaining her inspiration, “I loved the old Max Fleischer cartoons, and Betty Boop was one of my faves. Those faces were mostly inspired by the ghosts from some of those old 1930s black-and-white cartoons.” > > This flies in the face of the popular assumption that the famed Edvard Munch painting The Scream was the primary inspiration for the mask. “That whole inspired-by-Munch thing is a pat way to write off the design,” Sleiertin-Linden says, “but it’s not where my influence came from.” ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2017, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2834 "2017-11-21T15:12:52Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > **Spice Weasel** , I don’t remember hearing people talk that way in real life, but I don’t know whether that’s because it’s very unusual or because it’s so usual I don’t notice it. _in general_ people use nicknames and shortened names more than full names with friends and family unless they are angry - Steph instead of Stephanie for friendly, and then you add in a middle name or last name when angry - Stephanie Michelle Plum, what do you think you are doing!!! [you know the whole angry mom thing] I variously call mrAru Rob, Andy, McGrew, butthead and fucker [it is a military thing] when not pissed. He knows I am peeved when I just use his surname … ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2017, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2835 "2017-11-26T05:08:57Z")
There’s kind of an odd scene in **Men in Black**. Just after Will Smith decides to join the MiB team, he goes into the vent building and rides the elevator down with Tommy Lee Jones. The elevator stops, the doors open, and they step onto a little platform that overlooks the whole operations floor, and then the platform lowers them down the rest of the way. How does that make any sense architecturally? Why doesn’t the regular elevator just take them the extra twenty feet down to the actual floor? ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2017, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2836 "2017-11-26T05:17:28Z")
I thought of another one. Why doesn’t the Red October submarine (in **The Hunt for Red October** , or course) have rearward-facing sonar? We’re told that you can get behind a submarine and follow it undetected because the screws on the back create too much noise and create a blind spot for the sonar. But when Red October is using its secret, silent drive, they turn off the screws. If it’s so quiet that other subs can’t hear them, they should be able to listen to what’s behind them without having to turn in circles to check. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2017, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2837 "2017-11-26T07:20:31Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > There’s kind of an odd scene in **Men in Black**. Just after Will Smith decides to join the MiB team, he goes into the vent building and rides the elevator down with Tommy Lee Jones. The elevator stops, the doors open, and they step onto a little platform that overlooks the whole operations floor, and then the platform lowers them down the rest of the way. How does that make any sense architecturally? Why doesn’t the regular elevator just take them the extra twenty feet down to the actual floor? The obvious answer is that the first elevator was part of the original vent building architecture/construction, to get down into a big empty space into which all the MiB stuff was installed, at which point the fancy one took over. (Or even more likely, it just looked cool… but it doesn’t strike me as implausible that a structure which had to look one way above ground and one way below ground would have some rough edges at the seams…) ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Knig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@Typo\_Knig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Knig)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2017, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2838 "2017-11-26T16:54:35Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I thought of another one. Why doesn’t the Red October submarine (in **The Hunt for Red October** , or course) have rearward-facing sonar? We’re told that you can get behind a submarine and follow it undetected because the screws on the back create too much noise and create a blind spot for the sonar. But when Red October is using its secret, silent drive, they turn off the screws. If it’s so quiet that other subs can’t hear them, they should be able to listen to what’s behind them without having to turn in circles to check. On a regular sub the noise from the propeller(s) would overwhelm the sonar (or so I assume). For a super-quiet sub like the Red October, your idea is a great one! I suppose the author did not think of it, or focused on standard sub tactics for the book. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2017, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2839 "2017-11-26T17:16:35Z")
> [@Typo\_Knig](#): > > On a regular sub the noise from the propeller(s) would overwhelm the sonar (or so I assume). For a super-quiet sub like the Red October, your idea is a great one! I suppose the author did not think of it, or focused on standard sub tactics for the book. Don’t subs today have towed sonar arrays that trail behind the boat and are omnidirectional? ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2017, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/2840 "2017-11-30T14:18:40Z")
Not very obvious, but my brain connected the two last night: Charles Schulz’s Peanuts had Snoopy reading a series of books by Miss Helen Sweetstory about the six bunny wunnies. The last title in the series as “The Six Bunny Wunnies visit Plains, Georgia”. The place of President Jimmy Carter’s famous [killer rabbit](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Carter_rabbit_incident) incident. God thing he didn’t see six killer bunny wunnies. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117.md?page=141) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117.md?page=143)