# Obvious things about a creative work you realize after the millionth time (OPEN SPOILERS POSSIBLE) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 24, 2009, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117 "2009-07-24T13:20:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 158
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2018, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3142 "2018-10-21T22:29:25Z")
> [@commasense](#): > > I saw _2001: A Space Odyssey_ again in (digital) IMAX a few weeks ago (I’ve probably seen it in a theater at least a dozen times, and most of those were in 70mm), and was wondering, as I have before, about the soccer-ball-like markings on the side of the [Discovery’s EVA pods](https://goo.gl/images/Wy4ezS). All of a sudden, I realized that the circular openings are maneuvering thruster nozzles and the black wedges next to them are some kind of protective material to prevent damage to the exterior surface of the pod. The design seems very elegant: up, down, fore, aft, and out on each side (left and right) allows maneuvering in any direction with the right combination of thrusters. > > One reason I may never have figured it out before is that we never see any exhaust from the thrusters: the pods just mysteriously move around. I assume the film’s science advisers said that the exhaust would be invisible, although ISTM that we have seen visible exhaust from some thrusters of actual spacecraft. Much would depend on the lighting and the nature of the thruster, I suppose. I siuspect the real reason they didn’t show any exhaust is that, no matter how well you do it, it looks hokey (at least in the pre-CGI era), so they simply left it out. And the result looks very sophisticated and adult. Kubrick reportedly was also considering the use of atomic explosions as space propulsion, a la _project Orion_, but was dissuaded from doing so, probably for the same reasons – it’d be hard to show convincingly (not to mention that it would require a ton of not-very-useful exposition). So he simply showed us that row of hexagonal thrusters at the end of the _Discovery_ and let the audience draw its own conclusions. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2018, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3143 "2018-10-21T23:25:56Z")
I noticed something odd about the “this is my rifle; there are many like it but this one is mine” [scene](https://youtu.be/nkGIxGdZoYY) from _Full Metal Jacket_. Watch it, tell me if you have the same question I do.Are Pvt. Joker and Pvt. Cowboy planning to sleep with their glasses on? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2018, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3144 "2018-10-21T23:54:35Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I noticed something odd about the “this is my rifle; there are many like it but this one is mine” [scene](https://youtu.be/nkGIxGdZoYY) from _Full Metal Jacket_. Watch it, tell me if you have the same question I do.Are Pvt. Joker and Pvt. Cowboy planning to sleep with their glasses on? And on top of their covers? No, when the light go out, you take off your glasses and crawl under your covers. However, perhaps they did this as a one nite thing, but in boot, even marines didn’t sleep with the rifles. ---
**Author:** ![Miss\_Mapp](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miss_mapp/32/369_2.png) [@Miss\_Mapp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miss_Mapp)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2018, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3145 "2018-10-22T00:09:39Z")
Not the millionth viewing, maybe the dozenth. I was watching The Wicker Man (the good version with Edward Woodward) a couple of nights ago and took notice of a scene where Sgt. Howie is looking through the island’s registries of deaths. He observes that two of them (Rachel and Benjamin, I think they were) were proper from-the-Bible names, and Ingrid Pitt who keeps the registries responds that they were both old. It only then occurred to me that the first names we hear in the movie are those of younger folk–Rowan, Ash, Myrtle, Holly, and of course Willow–and all of them are botanical names as befitting members of a fertility cult. There’s Miss Rose too, but I think that’s her last name. The older people would have been born and named while the island was still Christian before the first Lord Summerisle changed the islander’s religion. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2018, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3146 "2018-10-22T01:57:28Z")
> [@furryman](#): > > When Captain Marvel ceased being published in the US, British publishers decided to continue the character under the name Marvelman, later changing the name to Miracleman. Honestly the comics were really bad and probably nobody would remember the character at all if Alan Moore hadn’t got hold of him. That said, Moore’s run on Miracleman is one of the reasons superheroes should exist. It’s that good. Also, as an aside, \*The Death of Captain Marvel \*is, essentially, the first real big imprint graphic novel. Without the success of that and _God Loves, Man Kills_ we might not have trade paperbacks today. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blue_blistering_barnacle/32/3386_2.png) [@Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blue_Blistering_Barnacle)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2018, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3147 "2018-10-22T15:23:21Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > That said, Moore’s run on Miracleman is one of the reasons superheroes should exist. It’s that good. > > Also, as an aside, \*The Death of Captain Marvel \*is, essentially, the first real big imprint graphic novel. Without the success of that and _God Loves, Man Kills_ we might not have trade paperbacks today. I’ve never read Miracleman, and I guess you post recommends it. Should I also look for the next two you mention? ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2018, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3148 "2018-10-22T18:29:10Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Sometimes I’m smart enough to spot foreshadowing. Sometimes I’m only smart enough to spot foreshadowing on second read/view. And sometimes I must have read Pratchett’s\* Men At Arms\* a good dozen times before finally twigging that Vimes’ first thought during his visit to the scene of the crime, “[it couldn’t have been a burglary because]you’d have to be a fool to steal from the Assassins” is actually the solution to the mystery. Clever PTerry… Holy crap. Never noticed that before. > [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Did you notice the similar line in _Wyrd Sisters_? > > She caught sight of the mirror over the mantelpiece and looked down at the crown. It was tempting. It was practically begging her to try it for size. Well, and why not? She made sure that the others weren’t around and then, in one movement, whipped off her hat and placed the crown on her head. > It seemed to fit. Granny drew herself up proudly, and waved a hand imperiously in the general direction of the hearth. > ‘Jolly well do this,’ she said. She beckoned arrogantly at the grandfather clock. ‘Chop his head off, what ho,’ she commanded. She smiled grimly. > And froze as she heard the screams, and the thunder of horses, and the deadly whisper of arrows and the damp, solid sound of spears in flesh. Charge after charge echoed across her skull. Sword met shield, or sword, or bone -relentlessly. Years streamed across her mind in the space of a second. There were times when she lay among the dead, or hanging from the branch of a tree; but always there were hands that would pick her up again, and place her on a velvet cushion . . . > Granny very carefully lifted the crown off her head – it was an effort, it didn’t like it much – and laid it on the table. > ‘So that’s being a king for you, is it?’ she said softly. ‘I wonder why they all want the job?’ > ‘Do you take sugar?’ said Magrat, behind her. > ‘You’d have to be a born fool to be a king,’ said Granny. Nor that. ---
**Author:** ![Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/intergalactic_gladiator/32/112_2.png) [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Intergalactic_Gladiator)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2018, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3149 "2018-10-29T17:23:43Z")
I was just watching the video for the Beastie Boys song “Sabotage” and I still think it’s great. It has this tongue-in-cheek vibe to it where it looks like a mid-70s cop show. It has all the clichés: Guys in bad hair and ties running, looking around on rooftops, a perp pulls out a knife and tussles with the hero, cop cars tearing down streets and bouncing over bumps. At one point, the video jumps to a scene of a car exploding with the words “For Screening Purposes Only” supered over the bottom. I probably noticed that back when it came out but had forgotten about it in the time since. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/z5rRZdiu1UE/maxresdefault.jpg "Beastie Boys - Sabotage") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5rRZdiu1UE) ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2018, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3150 "2018-10-29T17:55:50Z")
This is not a recent revelation, but still… I’m 63 years old. My father was a music major in college, and when I was a kid my parents listened mostly to classical music. The only pop music I recall hearing at home was Calypso, which my dad liked. Until the Beatles. I was about seven years old when they hit the scene in the U.S. Dad didn’t care for their early rock ‘n’ roll stuff, but we all enjoyed the movie _A Hard Days Night_ for its Goonish humor (for some reason, a local Baltimore radio station began running the Goon Show in the early 1960s, and we all became fans), and Dad appreciated the Beatles’ more sophisticated compositions, starting with “Revolver” and “Rubber Soul.” But I never heard any other contemporary popular music in the house. I might have known vaguely about the Rolling Stones or the Beach Boys because friends were listening to them, but I didn’t. So I was well into my adulthood when I realized that “Back in the U.S.S.R.” was a parody of Beach Boys songs. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2018, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3151 "2018-10-29T18:30:59Z")
_Cabin Pressure_, the BBC radio comedy, takes place mostly aboard a Lockheed McDonnell 312 jet. You will not be surprised to learn that Lockheed-McDonnell is not a real airplane manufacturer, but is instead a composite of _Lockheed_ Martin and _McDonnell_ Douglas. What took me an inordinate amount of time to appreciate was that the pilots of the plane are named _Martin_ and _Douglas_. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3152 "2018-10-30T00:39:52Z")
> [@KneadToKnow](#): > > _Cabin Pressure_, the BBC radio comedy, takes place mostly aboard a Lockheed McDonnell 312 jet. And you can just barely fit 100 otters into it. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3153 "2018-10-30T04:21:33Z")
I don’t think this was mentioned yet, but about a year or three ago I was watching the video for Billy Joel’s The Longest Time and noticed that it was almost a capella. There’s drums and a bass guitar in the background, but other than that (despite the video), it’s all Billy\*. \*I’ve read some conflicting info about the exact instruments and background singers, but in any case, no guitar and no piano and it’s still a capella style. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3154 "2018-10-30T05:09:07Z")
> [@KneadToKnow](#): > > _Cabin Pressure_, the BBC radio comedy, takes place mostly aboard a Lockheed McDonnell 312 jet. You will not be surprised to learn that Lockheed-McDonnell is not a real airplane manufacturer, but is instead a composite of _Lockheed_ Martin and _McDonnell_ Douglas. > > What took me an inordinate amount of time to appreciate was that the pilots of the plane are named _Martin_ and _Douglas_. Damn, I think John Finnemore is brilliant, and I’ve listened to the entire series four times through (from Abu Dhabi through [Qikiqtarjuaq](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mjan2_3G2w&list=PLDETynkck_TvIJdsDCMtZxGp4cPNttA6f&index=169) to Zurich), and never noticed this. Good catch. ---
**Author:** ![Unintentionally\_Blank](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unintentionally_blank/32/5418_2.png) [@Unintentionally\_Blank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unintentionally_Blank)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3155 "2018-10-30T11:59:34Z")
Toy Story was the first BIG 3d movie…a format that was supplanting old school 2d movie making. In it is a story about a Cowboy, and is fear of being replaced by a Space man, and how they learn to coexist. Kind of a metaphor for 2d-\>3d movie making. ---
**Author:** ![Quercus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ab992/32.png) [@Quercus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3156 "2018-10-30T16:31:55Z")
> [@commasense](#): > > So I was well into my adulthood when I realized that “Back in the U.S.S.R.” was a parody of Beach Boys songs. > > :smack: Um, is today the first time you’re hearing about about Chuck Berry’s “Back in the U.S.A.”? (youtube has plenty of examples) (For the record, I was probably an adult before I heard about it too, well after “Back in the U.S.S.R” was familiar to me) ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3157 "2018-10-30T17:14:21Z")
> [@digs](#): > > Good catch. I believe the word you’re looking for is “Brilliant.” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3158 "2018-10-30T17:15:13Z")
> [@Quercus](#): > > Um, is today the first time you’re hearing about about Chuck Berry’s “Back in the U.S.A.”? (youtube has plenty of examples) :smack::smack::smack: ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2018, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3159 "2018-10-30T19:38:55Z")
> [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > At one point, the video jumps to a scene of a car exploding with the words “For Screening Purposes Only” supered over the bottom. I probably noticed that back when it came out but had forgotten about it in the time since. > > [https://www.youtube.com/watch?time\_continue=151&v=z5rRZdiu1UE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=151&v=z5rRZdiu1UE) I think there are actually two versions of the video, the “For Screening Purposes Only” explosion, very fake dummy falling off the overpass and the guy getting thrown out of the car wasn’t in the version that used to air on MTV all the time. The MTV version also had a black dude kung-fu dude IIRC that’s not in the linked version. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3160 "2018-10-31T02:21:17Z")
> [@KneadToKnow](#): > > I believe the word you’re looking for is “Brilliant.” 😉 Yellow car. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2018, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/3161 "2018-10-31T02:36:57Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Yellow car. Look, I am NOT playing Yellow Car. It’s a silly game that’s just so …yellow car… easy it’s barely a game at all. > [@](#): > > I believe the word you’re looking for is “Brilliant.” In case anyone’s wondering, from the beginning of Cabin Pressure’s fourth episode: ARTHUR: Here you are, skipper… wow, is that the Sahara? DOUGLAS: The vast sandy thing on the ground? That’s the chap, yes. ARTHUR: Wow. It’s brilliant! DOUGLAS: Always at hand with the _mot juste,_ aren’t you, Arthur? Yes, the Sahara Desert is brilliant, just as the Niagara Falls were brilliant, the Northern Lights were brilliant, and that chap from RyanAir burping the theme to the Muppets was really brilliant. ARTHUR: Come on, that was brilliant. Wow, \*camels! \* DOUGLAS: And how would you describe them, in a word? ARTHUR: \*Brilliant! \* DOUGLAS: Thought so. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117.md?page=157) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117.md?page=159)