# Obvious things about a creative work you realize after the millionth time (OPEN SPOILERS POSSIBLE) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 24, 2009, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117 "2009-07-24T13:20:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 72
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1421 "2013-07-03T20:10:28Z")
Paul Simon’s Love Me Like a Rock was playing on the store’s system. She loves me! She loves me! She gets down on her knees and hugs me! I suddenly realize exactly which body part is being hugged! Like a rock indeed, Mr. Simon. ---
**Author:** ![Saltire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saltire/32/553_2.png) [@Saltire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saltire)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1422 "2013-07-03T21:36:27Z")
He’s singing about his mother, Annie. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2013, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1423 "2013-07-03T22:18:25Z")
> [@Saltire](#): > > He’s singing about his mother, Annie. This. She’s down on her knees because he “was a little boy”. ---
**Author:** ![BunnyTVS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BunnyTVS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BunnyTVS)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1424 "2013-07-04T00:07:59Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > This. She’s down on her knees because he “was a little boy”. Size isn’t important. Allegedly ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1425 "2013-07-04T01:52:51Z")
> [@digs](#): > > Lest anyone doubt the need for a mod to use the smackie-smiley on himself, the rest of us just rolled our eyes at Jack Kirby’s way-too-obvious moniker for his escape artist hero… [back in the early 70s.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mister_Miracle) It’s even worse when you consider the distinctly unsubtle names he gave some of the villains of the piece: O’Deadly Darkseid, Granny Goodness, Gilotina, Lashina, Mokkari, Stompa and Virman Vundabar. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1426 "2013-07-04T02:24:05Z")
> [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > It’s even worse when you consider the distinctly unsubtle names he gave some of the villains of the piece: O’Deadly Darkseid, Granny Goodness, Gilotina, Lashina, Mokkari, Stompa and Virman Vundabar. That’s one nice thing about having gotten into comics in the late 1980s: the writers had (mostly) gotten past the stupid, obvious names by that time. But speaking of Granny Goodness … there was a scene in an issue of one of the late '80s-early-'90s Justice League titles (when the Justice League was going through its “comic relief” phase), where the intergalactic salesman/huckster, “Manga Khan” met Granny for the first time, and was attempting to sell her some product. Keep in mind that Granny Goodness was an immense, ugly, bad-tempered old lady. Manga Khan started his sales pitch by laying on the flattery with a shovel. “Why, Granny Goodness! I have heard tales of your beauty, but I never imagined that …” At which point Granny cut him off with, “CAN THE EYEWASH, MISTER!” I was about 22 or 23 when I read that scene. The _only_ other time I’d heard the word “eyewash” was in a few episodes of the 1970s kid’s TV show, “H. R. Puffenstuf”, way back when I was a little kid. The big villain in that show had this big eyeball thing that he’d use to spy on the heroes, and periodically his lackeys would come in to clean it, using “eyewash” to get the job done. So that Justice League comic suddenly explained to me the subtle joke from a 2-decade-old kid’s TV show. “Eyewash” = “insincere flattery”. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1427 "2013-07-04T02:31:43Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > I was about 22 or 23 when I read that scene. The _only_ other time I’d heard the word “eyewash” was in a few episodes of the 1970s kid’s TV show, “H. R. Puffenstuf”, way back when I was a little kid. The big villain in that show had this big eyeball thing that he’d use to spy on the heroes, and periodically his lackeys would come in to clean it, using “eyewash” to get the job done. _Lidsville_, actually. It was Hoodoo the magician who had the giant eyeball. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1428 "2013-07-04T02:41:58Z")
> [@Soylent\_Juicy](#): > > I don’t know if this counts but today I realized that Hula Hoops are so named because they make you do the Hawaiian Hula dance. Can I ask how old you are? Because I figured out that meaning when I was a kid in the 1970s. At that point in time, Hawaii had only been a state for a little over 20 years, so the hula dance, and all things Hawaiian, were still something of a novelty, and were being shown often in pop culture, so the connection was obvious (plus, the Hula Hoop came out in the 1950s, shortly after Hawaii became a state, so it had been around for 20+ years by the time I was a kid). ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1429 "2013-07-04T02:51:25Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > _Lidsville_, actually. It was Hoodoo the magician who had the giant eyeball. Huh. I have absolutely no recollection of watching any show called “Lidsville”. I’ll have to look that up. Was it a big eyeball mounted on a pedestal, and the minions would come in singing, “Eyewash eyewash eyewash…”? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1430 "2013-07-04T03:11:43Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > Huh. I have absolutely no recollection of watching any show called “Lidsville”. I’ll have to look that up. Was it a big eyeball mounted on a pedestal, and the minions would come in singing, “Eyewash eyewash eyewash…”? Forward to 4:40. They’re not singing about eyewash in this one, but they could have in other eps. ETA: Helps if I actually put in the link… [Lidsville](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S66E0K7XQf8) ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1431 "2013-07-04T04:30:16Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Forward to 4:40. They’re not singing about eyewash in this one, but they could have in other eps. > > ETA: Helps if I actually put in the link… [Lidsville](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S66E0K7XQf8) Now that I see that, I recognize it! (remember it would have been nearly 40 years ago that I saw this stuff). As far as the singing, the “Welcome welcome welcome” bit in your link sounds exactly like the “Eyewash eyewash eyewash” bit I remember. I see _Lidsville_ was also a Sid & Marty Croft production, so I guess it’s understandable that I would conflate it with _H. R. Puffenstuf_. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1432 "2013-07-04T05:11:59Z")
I find that any nostalgia I might have for Sid & Marty Croft productions wanes very quickly when I actually watch a clip. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1433 "2013-07-04T05:25:50Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > The other day at work, a coworker said to me, “I’m so tired…”, which prompted me to start singing, to myself, The Beatles’ song, “I’m So Tired”. Your mention of “I’m So Tired” reminded me of the song “I’m Tired” from _Blazing Saddles_, about which I recently had a revelation. Madeline Kahn’s character, Lili von Shtupp, is an obvious parody of Marlene Dietrich and her film roles, and for years I’d taken “[I’m Tired](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uai7M4RpoLU)” as a fairly broad parody of the sort of song that Marlene Dietrich might sing. But when they played a clip from the song during a recent NPR interview with Mel Brooks, it occurred to me that “I’m Tired” is actually a very _specific_ parody of a song called “[The Laziest Gal in Town](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0g-NkaFYpmE)” that Marlene Dietrich performed in the film _Stage Fright_. This understandably isn’t obvious to everyone as the parody is now far more widely known than the thing being parodied, but I first saw _Stage Fright_ 10+ years ago and saw it again a year or two ago and I’m surprised that it didn’t occur to me on either occasion that this song must have been the inspiration for “I’m Tired”. I suppose it threw me off that _Stage Fright_ wasn’t a Western and Dietrich’s character in it was a legitimate stage star. Dietrich had many other film roles – including several Westerns – where she played women with questionable reputations who sang in bars or nightclubs, and Lili von Shtupp is primarily based on these characters. The _look_ of the “I’m Tired” number seems like a cross between the “[Falling in Love Again](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaZDiKRT1is#)” scene in _Blue Angel_ and the “[Boys in the Back Room](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpSZIXuiEls)” scene in _Destry Rides Again_, but the song itself is much closer to “Laziest Gal”. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1434 "2013-07-04T07:37:38Z")
Mister Rik writes: \> Can I ask how old you are? Because I figured out that meaning when I was a \> kid in the 1970s. At that point in time, Hawaii had only been a state for a little \> over 20 years, so the hula dance, and all things Hawaiian, were still something \> of a novelty, and were being shown often in pop culture, so the connection was \> obvious (plus, the Hula Hoop came out in the 1950s, shortly after Hawaii \> became a state, so it had been around for 20+ years by the time I was a kid). Minor nitpick: Hawaii became a state in 1959, so in the 1970’s when you were a kid it had been a state for only somewhat more than 10 years. The modern version of the hula hoop was introduced in 1958, so it had been around for somewhat more than 10 years when you were a kid but less than 20 years. There was an immediate public reaction to the introduction of the hula hoop in 1958, with several songs about it being hits. The idea of twirling hoops around yourself had been known before then in several cultures around the world apparently. The hula became known to outsiders in 1820 or possibly earlier, but doubtlessly it got pushed in a big way around the time that Hawaii became a state. > **[Hawaii](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii)** > > Hawaii (/həˈwaɪi/ (listen) hə-WY-ee; Hawaiian: Hawaiʻi, \[həˈvɐjʔi\] or \[həˈwɐjʔi\]) is a state in the Western United States, about 2,000 miles (3,200 km) from the U.S. mainland in the Pacific Ocean. It is the only U.S. state outside North America, the only state that is an archipelago, and the only state in the tropics. > Hawaii consists of 137 volcanic islands that comprise almost the entire Hawaiian archipelago; spanning 1,500 miles (2,400 km), the state is physiographically and ethnologically... > **[Hula hoop](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hula_hoop)** > > A hula hoop is a toy hoop that is twirled around the waist, limbs or neck. It can also be wheeled along the ground like a wheel, with careful execution. They have been used by children and adults since at least 500 BC. The modern hula hoop was inspired by Australian bamboo hoops. Common lore posits the creators of the plastic hoop popularised in the US witnessed Australian children playing with bamboo hoops while driving past in an automobile. The new plastic version was popularized in 1958 by th... > **[Hula](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hula)** > > Hula (/ˈhuːlə/) is a Hawaiian dance form accompanied by chant (oli) or song (mele). It was developed in the Hawaiian Islands by the Native Hawaiians who originally settled there. The hula dramatizes or portrays the words of the oli or mele in a visual dance form. > There are many sub-styles of hula, with the main two categories being Hula ʻAuana and Hula Kahiko. Ancient hula, as performed before Western encounters with Hawaiʻi, is called kahiko. It is accompanied by chant and traditional instru... ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1435 "2013-07-04T08:34:56Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > Minor nitpick: Hawaii became a state in 1959 S’what I get for posting while drinking. My brain (or something resembling my brain) thought Hawaii and Alaska joined the union in 1950. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1436 "2013-07-04T10:38:16Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > This understandably isn’t obvious to everyone as the parody is now far more widely known than the thing being parodied It’s the Lewis Carroll effect. This [website](http://www.durrant.co.uk/alice/) has the original poems Carroll was parodying. All, with the exception of “The Star”, are now obscure and mostly forgotten. ---
**Author:** ![Hermione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/cdc98d/32.png) [@Hermione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hermione)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1437 "2013-07-04T13:17:13Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > It’s the Lewis Carroll effect. This [website](http://www.durrant.co.uk/alice/) has the original poems Carroll was parodying. All, with the exception of “The Star”, are now obscure and mostly forgotten. There’s [another name](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WeirdAlEffect) for this phenomenon. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1438 "2013-07-04T14:56:46Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > At that point in time, Hawaii had only been a state for a little over 20 years, so the hula dance, and all things Hawaiian, were still something of a novelty, and were being shown often in pop culture, so the connection was obvious (plus, the Hula Hoop came out in the 1950s, shortly after Hawaii became a state, so it had been around for 20+ years by the time I was a kid). This is not quite accurate. Hawaii became a state in August 1959, while the [Hula hoop per se came out the year before](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hula_hoop). But there were similar toy hoops before. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1439 "2013-07-04T15:37:26Z")
You know, for _kids_. ---
**Author:** ![Soylent\_Juicy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/82dd89/32.png) [@Soylent\_Juicy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soylent_Juicy)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2013, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/1440 "2013-07-04T16:00:48Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > Can I ask how old you are? Because I figured out that meaning when I was a kid in the 1970s. At that point in time, Hawaii had only been a state for a little over 20 years, so the hula dance, and all things Hawaiian, were still something of a novelty, and were being shown often in pop culture, so the connection was obvious (plus, the Hula Hoop came out in the 1950s, shortly after Hawaii became a state, so it had been around for 20+ years by the time I was a kid). I’m crowding 40. And yes, the connection just landed on me the other day. But according to other posters I’m mistaken about the origin. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117.md?page=71) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117.md?page=73)