# Obvious things about a creative work you realize after the millionth time (OPEN SPOILERS POSSIBLE) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 24, 2009, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117 "2009-07-24T13:20:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/141 "2009-07-31T14:31:25Z")
> [@Cliffy](#): > > I think you’re demanding rather more precise measurements from the screenwriters than are reasonable. But anyway, they had cabs in 1947. Not measurements – plot logic. In any case the argument that Kris is Santa is simple: the theme of the movie is clearly and simply that we must believe in things even when there’s no evidence to back them up. Consider: > [@](#): > > ## Fred Gailey: Look Doris, someday you’re going to find that your way of facing this realistic world just doesn’t work. And when you do, don’t overlook those lovely intangibles. You’ll discover those are the only things that are worthwhile. > > ## Doris: Faith is believing when common sense tells you not to. Don’t you see? It’s not just Kris that’s on trial, it’s everything he stands for. It’s kindness and joy and love and all the other intangibles. > > Doris: Would you please tell her that you’re not really Santa Claus, that actually is no such person? > Kris Kringle: Well, I hate to disagree with you, but not only IS there such a person, but here I am to prove it. > > * * * > > ## Susan: I believe… I believe… It’s silly, but I believe. > > Doris Walker: I was wrong when I told you that, Susie. You must believe in Mr. Kringle and keep right on doing it. You must have faith in him. If, as you assert, Kris isn’t Santa, then the movie is denying its own message. Even more telling is this line: > [@](#): > > Susan Walker (referring to the house): If you’re really Santa Claus, you can get it for me. And if you can’t, you’re only a nice man with a white beard like mother says. Since Kris does get it for her – or, at least, leads them to the house and has visited it, in the terms of the movie, he’s really Santa Claus. Insisting that he’s not Santa is like being Doris in the beginning of the film. Or worse, it’s being Sawyer (the one person who never accepts Kris is Santa). If you want to be Sawyer, that’s your decision, but since he’s shown to be a neurotic, vindictive, and small-minded little man – and pretty much the only villain of the movie – that’s clearly not what the movie is intending. If you were right, then Sawyer would be the hero. He’s not, and thus you’re wrong. ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/142 "2009-07-31T14:41:59Z")
And to add one more thing to **RealityChuck** ’s excellent summary, I’ll just say that it’s perfectly possible to be an atheist, rationalist, and skeptic who doesn’t take anything on faith, and yet believe that the 1947 _Miracle on 34th Street_ is a charming and delightful minor classic of cinema. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/143 "2009-07-31T14:48:58Z")
> [@PastAllReason](#): > > Well, geez, I never got “nocturnally” before now. Thanks! Adding one more about Harry Potter, I DID get that the mirror Erised was Desire written backwards, or more exactly, I guess, how it would appear written in a mirror. Yep-I got Knockturn Alley (which makes the Diagon all the more inexplicable–I kept thinking [when I thought of it at all] as some play on dragon or diamond). Knockturn is also a double pun–doesn’t it also mean something to do with seances or carnival “fun” houses? The THOUGHT of Hagrid being anywhere close to anything to do with alchemy makes me shudder. Why give him the name of Rubeus? Slytherin is a play on slithering snakes. No clue where she got Hufflepuff, though. It sounds more like that thing Ginny buys at her brother’s shop and names Arnold, rather than a distinguished house of the premier wizarding school… ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/144 "2009-07-31T14:56:12Z")
> [@The New and Improved Superman](#): > > Preposterous! They can’t be the same people. Anybody with eyes can see that the Scarecrow, Tin Man & Cowardly Lion are in full technicolor, while the mere farmhands are in black & white! > > 😃 > Anyway, one little detail that I’d never noticed before about ‘Oz’ (until about the umpteen-millionth time I saw it) was the scene in which Dorothy & crew are entering the black woods on their way to kill the Wicked Witch. The Scarecrow is carrying a large mallet, and the Tin Man has a revolver(!) b ut missing his axe. Both weapons mysteriously vanish before the flying monkeys attack. (I couldn’t find an appropriate clip on youtube - but if you have the DVD, you can check it out for yourself.) > > Also, there is the legendary (and false) UL about [the munchkin who hanged himself](http://snopes.com/movies/films/ozsuicide.asp). (Long story short: It was actually a large bird.) I had seen the ‘incriminating’ shadow before, and knew the story. But it wasn’t until I read Snopes’ article debunking the myth that I ever noticed the birds wandering around in the background. And they’re all over that set! You don’t have to go to strangers to get the straight dope: [Can a Munchkin be seen committing suicide in The Wizard of Oz?](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1063/can-a-munchkin-be-seen-committing-suicide-in-em-the-wizard-of-oz-em) 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/145 "2009-07-31T15:00:04Z")
> [@gigi](#): > > 😛 > Will you be telling us what Bill Murray whispered to Scarlett Johannson? He was whispering the same thing I sometimes whisper in my girlfriend’s ear: > [@](#): > > Everybody who can see me thinks I’m whispering something naughty in your ear right now. Makes her giggle in the most deliciously naughty way. ---
**Author:** ![Crawlspace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Crawlspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crawlspace)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/146 "2009-07-31T15:11:22Z")
Two from _Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory_: - The ride on the Hsaw Aknow (Wonka Wash) occurs right before they go into the TV room. The TV room is a clean room. The ride is used to ensure that whomever goes into the room is clean. - Almost everything in Wonka’s office is split in half lengthwise. When he gets angry at Grandpa Joe, he starts reading him the contract, “The undersigned waives all rights and privileges here in contained et cetera et cetra.” Looking closely, the contract is split in half length wise. The et cetera’s are just place holders for the missing half. ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/147 "2009-07-31T15:19:08Z")
> [@corkboard](#): > > So is the “Rose” supposed to equate somehow to “anti”, or something, or is it meaningless? In the Catholic faith, Mary, Mother of God, is often referred to as the Lady of the Rose, or Lady of the Roses. (Those early years of parochial school finally pay off. Many years later.) ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/148 "2009-07-31T15:33:21Z")
😕 I think you’re thinking of St. Therese of Lisieux. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/149 "2009-07-31T15:50:25Z")
How heavily _Star Wars_ was cribbed from _The Wizard of Oz_. Eventually, I noticed that the “knock over the guards, take their uniforms, and march into the prison” gag was played almost identically… and then all of the other parallels became obvious. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/150 "2009-07-31T15:59:02Z")
Not something I realized but something I was told - in Young Frankenstein the reason a horse neighs everytime Frau Blucah’s name is said is because Blucah means “glue” in German. ---
**Author:** ![palindromemordnilap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/db5fbb/32.png) [@palindromemordnilap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/palindromemordnilap)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/151 "2009-07-31T16:18:44Z")
1. As a kid I had a joke book with this riddle: How do you get down from an elephant? You don’t, you get down from a duck. For decades I thought it was very dry humor along the lines of “Don’t do something difficult, do something easy” – and they used a duck because it’s a funny word. 1. For 10 years I worked at a building where one of the other cars had the vanity plate XANITAX, and I always wondered if it referred to a tax accountant, or pharmaceutical sales, or what? When I finally got it, I felt particularly stupid because My sister’s name is Anita. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/152 "2009-07-31T16:23:03Z")
For the longest time, I could not understand the lyrics to _Givin’ the Dog a Bone_, by AC/DC. Sounded mostly like a bunch of screaming and grunting. It wasn’t until one day when I read the lyrics that I saw it was about getting a blowjob from a girl. ---
**Author:** ![BiblioCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed8c4c/32.png) [@BiblioCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BiblioCat)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/153 "2009-07-31T16:28:30Z")
> [@palindromemordnilap](#): > > 1. As a kid I had a joke book with this riddle: > > How do you get down from an elephant? > You don’t, you get down from a duck. > > For decades I thought it was very dry humor along the lines of “Don’t do something difficult, do something easy” – and they used a duck because it’s a funny word. I didn’t get that joke for an embarassingly long time. I just never made the connection as a kid. Fast-forward to high school - a group of us were goofing around, telling stupid jokes. Someone told that one, I looked down at my down vest, and it suddenly hit me. Ooooooooh, I get it! :smack: ---
**Author:** ![palindromemordnilap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/db5fbb/32.png) [@palindromemordnilap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/palindromemordnilap)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/154 "2009-07-31T16:33:20Z")
On the Rush song “Spirit of Radio,” there is a couplet at the end, set apart from the rest of the song. I always knew these two lines were a take-off of “The Sound of Silence”\* lines: And the words of the prophet were written on the subway walls, and tenant halls/ whispered in the sound of silence" (a previous line had used the word “echoed”) So I get partial credit for making that conenction. But the first 1,000 times or so I heard the Rush song I heard the lyrics as: “For the words of the profits were written on the stadium wall, and concert hall/ And echoes with the sound of salesmen.” It wasn’t until I heard a Rush tribute band sing the song live that I discovered the word was “studio”, not “stadium”. Which in the context of the song makes more sense. And yes, I got that Rush changed “prophets” to “profits”. \*Also known as “Sounds of Silence” but I prefer the singular version and apparently either is correct. ---
**Author:** ![palindromemordnilap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/db5fbb/32.png) [@palindromemordnilap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/palindromemordnilap)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/155 "2009-07-31T16:34:25Z")
> [@BiblioCat](#): > > I didn’t get that joke for an embarassingly long time. I just never made the connection as a kid. Fast-forward to high school - a group of us were goofing around, telling stupid jokes. Someone told that one, I looked down at my down vest, and it suddenly hit me. Ooooooooh, I get it! :smack: High school? You beat me by about 15 years. ---
**Author:** ![Nom\_de\_Plume](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/85f322/32.png) [@Nom\_de\_Plume](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nom_de_Plume)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/156 "2009-07-31T16:46:21Z")
I guess I was pretty young when Cheap Trick first came out with Surrender. I remember hearing the line “Just the other day I heard of a Soldier’s falling off…” and wondering what the Soldier fell off of. Then recently I heard the song on Jack FM and “Of course, THAT’S what fell off!” :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/157 "2009-07-31T17:08:42Z")
Quoth **rowrrbazzle** : > [@](#): > > Sometime in the past year I realized something about “West Side Story”. The notes for the word “Maria” in the song of that name, C-F#-G, are the same notes as on the phrase “Who knows?” in “Something’s Coming” with the last two notes in a lower octave. In addition, the opening 3 notes of the musical, G-C-F#, are the same, just starting on the G instead of the C. Along a similar vein, in _Man of La Mancha_, Aldonza’s song (I was born in a ditch to a mother who left me there…) is basically the same tune as Don Quixote’s song (I am I, Don Quixote, the Lord of La Mancha…), but much more musically ornate. It’s a sort of musical commentary on the fact that Aldonza is living in the real world, with all of its detail, while Don Quixote is living in an overly-simplistic fantasy world. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/158 "2009-07-31T17:21:50Z")
> [@palindromemordnilap](#): > > 1. As a kid I had a joke book with this riddle: > > How do you get down from an elephant? > You don’t, you get down from a duck. The riddle that haunted, yes, _haunted_ me for years was: “If April showers bring May flowers, what do May flowers bring?” Answer? Pilgrims! I think I figured this one out about 10 years after I heard it. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Histrion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/76d3ee/32.png) [@Histrion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Histrion)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/159 "2009-07-31T17:24:37Z")
I was in college - I don’t remember what year, or what class I was sitting in, or what - when suddenly I looked up and said, possibly aloud: "Oh my God. ‘Fargo North, Decoder!’ " ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117/160 "2009-07-31T17:27:45Z")
> [@jackdavinci](#): > > Not something I realized but something I was told - in Young Frankenstein the reason a horse neighs everytime Frau Blucah’s name is said is because Blucah means “glue” in German. [Don’t believe everything you hear](http://german.about.com/library/blgermyth02.htm) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obvious-things-about-a-creative-work-you-realize-after-the-millionth-time-open-spoilers-possible/504117.md?page=9)