# Oddball baseball rules **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 11, 2010, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907 "2010-08-11T03:13:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![President\_Johnny\_Gentle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5f9b8f/32.png) [@President\_Johnny\_Gentle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/President_Johnny_Gentle)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/21 "2010-08-11T05:23:41Z")
> [@Superhal](#): > > > [@President\_Johnny\_Gentle](#): > > > > I think the key here is the term “official at-bat”, which I believe can be used interchangeably with “plate appearance” for the purpose of this claim. > > > > Batter comes to the plate with a runner on and two outs. Batter takes two pitches for strikes. Runner is picked off with an 0-2 count against the batter to end the inning. > > > > The batter comes up in the next inning in the same plate appearance, but with a 0-0 count, so can take two more called strikes. > > If this was true, the batter could take 5 called strikes. No, since the batter still strikes out on the third strike, even if they safely make it to first. ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/22 "2010-08-11T05:29:00Z")
1. A strikeout doesn’t always end in an out. On a passed ball/wild pitch, a swinging batter must be thrown out. You can strike out everybody yet allow an infinite number of runs. 2. Pitchers can walk and get outs by picking off runners. Home runs can be discounted if the batter doesn’t touch all bases. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/23 "2010-08-11T05:34:41Z")
> [@mattomic](#): > > 1. A batter, in the same official at-bat, can take 4 called strikes and not strike out I’m not absolutely sure what the rule is on this. Suppose the batter has two strikes, and a runner is caught stealing to make the third out of the inning. Does that same batter lead off the next inning with a 0-0 count? If that’s correct, then two more strikes makes four in that at-bat, without striking out. ETA: Beaten to the punch, I see. ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/24 "2010-08-11T09:14:53Z")
Alternate answer for #9: Before the Wildcard, only the division winners could go to the playoffs. If the top two teams in 1 division were tied at the end of the season, they had a playoff game or series to determine which one would go to the playoffs (which is why some players in the 80’s played 165 games or so.) Therefore, you can have the best record in the regular season (although tied with another team in the division), lose the tiebreaker games, and not go to the playoffs. ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/25 "2010-08-11T09:24:26Z")
#5: You can play for two different teams on the same day: [Joel Youngblood](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joel_Youngblood) On August 4, 1982, Youngblood became the only player in history to get hits for two different teams in two different cities on the same day. After Youngblood had driven in two runs with a single in the third inning for the Mets in an afternoon game at Wrigley Field against the Chicago Cubs,[2] he was replaced in center field by Mookie Wilson, and traded to the Montreal Expos for a player to be named later (On August 16, the Expos sent Tom Gorman to the Mets to complete the deal). Youngblood rushed to Philadelphia in order to be with his new team, and hit a seventh inning single.[3] Interestingly, the two pitchers he hit safely against, Ferguson Jenkins of the Cubs and Steve Carlton of the Philadelphia Phillies, are both in the Baseball Hall of Fame. So, there’s several ways to answer this: A. The pitcher beats the team he is then traded to. B. In the rain delay scenario as above, he could pitch against himself in the same game. Interestingly, he could beat and lose to himself. C. In the 6th inning, the trade is approved and he switches to the other dugout. Heh I think I figured out the secret for these questions: try to find stuff that happened ~1984. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![jonesj2205](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecc23a/32.png) [@jonesj2205](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jonesj2205)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/26 "2010-08-11T11:57:04Z")
> [@Superhal](#): > > Alternate answer for #9: > > Therefore, you can have the best record in the regular season (although tied with another team in the division), lose the tiebreaker games, and not go to the playoffs. The tiebreaker game is considered part of the regular season so you would no longer have the best record in the regular season. ---
**Author:** ![Quercus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ab992/32.png) [@Quercus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/27 "2010-08-11T12:39:57Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Yes, again; Smith enters in the top of the 9th, two out, men on base, tie game. A man is picked off before Smith throws a pitch, ending the top of the ninth, and Smith’s team wins it in the bottom of the ninth. Smith wins despite never throwing a pitch. Doesn’t have to be the 9th inning; as long as the pitcher’s team goes ahead in the bottom of the inning and keeps the lead for the rest of the game. Unlike most of the other ‘facts’, this has actually happened many times in MLB. [Cite](http://www.kake.com/sports/headlines/50231177.html) ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/28 "2010-08-11T13:04:54Z")
The only way I can think of for #9 to work is if the exhibition season is counted. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/29 "2010-08-11T14:49:20Z")
> [@notfrommensa](#): > > Searched the archives on #1. [Not exactly the same scenario](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1002/seven-batters-step-up-to-the-plate-the-inning-ends-no-runs-score-how) but I think it explains it Nope, because the 7th guy who “stepped to the plate” didn’t actually have a plate appearance, and he would lead off the next inning. > [@42fish](#): > > > [@mattomic](#): > > > > 1. The team that wins the most games in the majors might not make the playoffs > > Happened in 1982. Due to a mid-season strike, the commissioner’s office decided to set up an extra playoff round in which the team in each division with the best pre-strike record would play the team with the best post-strike record\*. The Cincinnati Reds ended up with the best overall record in baseball but were second in their division to different teams pre and post strike, and thus did not make the playoffs. What made this more pernicious (Reds fan back then) was that the Reds were a mere 1/2 game behind the Dodgers when the strike hit, and had a game to make up. Instead of giving them a shot at tying for the 1st-half division crown (right before the 2nd half officially started up) and potentially playing a tiebreaker game with LA, Kuhn and Co. just automatically gave the 1st half title to the Dodgers with absolutely no considerations of fairness. If I was Cincy I would have filed a formal protest or something. > [@RickJay](#): > > Foul ball deep to left, man on third, tie game, bottom of the ninth, caught, the runner tags and scores the winning run. Note that the outfielder in question would be very foolish to do so, unless he had a cannon for an arm and the guy at 3rd was one of the Molina brothers/clones. I’ve seen outfielders shy away from the ball in such situations. > [@RickJay](#): > > Theoretically it could happen in a normal season if you had enough rainouts and there wasn’t time to make it up. Suppose in 1985 there had been a bizarre series of rainstorms in New York, causing the Mets to miss a huge number of games that happen to have been the ones they would have lost, and so the NL East standards ended up like this because there wasn’t time to make up the games: > > New York Mets 99-54 > St. Louis Cardinals 102-60 > > St. Louis has more wins, and the most in the majors (as in fact they did in 1985) but are behind New York. They’re a game and a half behind, and have a lower winning percentage, so they lose and New York goes to the playoffs. (There was no wild card back then.) I’d think that the Commish would try to do anything to let St. Louis tie for the division (playing 2 straight doubleheaders if necessary). He’d probably just let them play a 3 game series (again with a doubleheader) for the sake of fairness. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/30 "2010-08-11T14:57:32Z")
> [@Superhal](#): > > Before the Wildcard, only the division winners could go to the playoffs. If the top two teams in 1 division were tied at the end of the season, they had a playoff game or series to determine which one would go to the playoffs (which is why some players in the 80’s played 165 games or so.) > > Therefore, you can have the best record in the regular season (although tied with another team in the division), lose the tiebreaker games, and not go to the playoffs. Nope - that’s not a playoff game, it’s the 163rd regular season game, and stats accumulated during that game count towards players’ regular season totals. As such, the winner then would have the best regular season record AND go to the playoffs. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/31 "2010-08-11T17:33:23Z")
> [@mattomic](#): > > 1. A pitcher can win a game without throwing a pitch These being riddles and all, I think it’s OK to bend the verbiage to our whim. So I think this is easier than figuring out how to get pickoffs to work: The Pirates pitcher, Joe Smith, comes into the tied game in the 9th inning. Sweat beads down Smith’s nervous neck. Strike one! He gathers himself for the next pitch. Strike two! Smith takes a deep breath with the game on the line. Then a big swing, and _crack_ the ball goes deep. Way back, way back…the fans are on their feet…the fielder jumps at the wall, aaaaaand…IT’S GONE! IT’S GONE! HOME RUN! The team rushes the field in delight and hoists Smith up on their shoulders. Why? 'Cause Pitcher Smith was at bat. The pitcher won the game without throwing a pitch. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/32 "2010-08-11T18:01:08Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > > [@notfrommensa](#): > > > > Searched the archives on #1. [Not exactly the same scenario](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1002/seven-batters-step-up-to-the-plate-the-inning-ends-no-runs-score-how) but I think it explains it > > Nope, because the 7th guy who “stepped to the plate” didn’t actually have a plate appearance, and he would lead off the next inning. Right, and #1 says “come to the plate,” not record a plate appearance. (I’m assuming the OP’s transcription is accurate.) ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/33 "2010-08-11T18:22:09Z")
> [@mattomic](#): > > 1. The team that wins the most games in the majors might not make the playoffs Already answered, but I’d point out this also happened in the strike-shortened 1994 season, when there were no playoffs. The Montreal Expos and the NY Yankees had the best records in their respective leagues, and of course neither made the playoffs because there weren’t any. Which really sucked for the Expos, considering their fortunes in the following years. ---
**Author:** ![Cliffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/59ef9b/32.png) [@Cliffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cliffy)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/34 "2010-08-11T19:18:05Z")
I agree that #10 only works if you count a game with no bottom of the ninth (or a walkoff-shortened ninth) as something other than a nine-inning game. Therefore, home wins, which are presumably slightly more prevalent than visitor wins, won’t go [exactly] nine innings. Plus extra inning games (they go longer than nine) and rainouts, and there you go. –Cliffy ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2010, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/35 "2010-08-11T22:06:35Z")
> [@Cliffy](#): > > I agree that #10 only works if you count a game with no bottom of the ninth (or a walkoff-shortened ninth) as something other than a nine-inning game. Therefore, home wins, which are presumably slightly more prevalent than visitor wins, won’t go [exactly] nine innings. Plus extra inning games (they go longer than nine) and rainouts, and there you go. It seems pretty clear to me that that’s what they’re going after here. I don’t think it’s particularly weaselly, either. An inning in baseball has two halves. A game with the home team winning may have gone into the ninth inning, but was finished after 8.5 innings. The actual quote from the presenter is “All baseball games are scheduled to go nine innings, so why is it, most games don’t go nine innings?” It’s a bit playing with semantics, but I think it’s fair. **President Johnny Gentle** ’s got it for the four called strikes fact. #1 is a tough one, but I think **CJJ** \* nailed it. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2010, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/36 "2010-08-12T00:15:49Z")
> [@Superhal](#): > > The key here is “Most games.” As everybody knows, the home team has a 25% win advantage over visiting teams in all major professional sports. Apparently everybody does not know this, because it sure as hell is not true in baseball. The home field advantage in major league baseball is something like five percent. Where’d you get 25% from? ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2010, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/37 "2010-08-12T02:18:30Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Where’d you get 25% from? [Seriously? Do you know where you are?](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2712/take-me-out-to-the-ball-game) ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2010, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/38 "2010-08-12T02:29:32Z")
> [@Superhal](#): > > [Seriously? Do you know where you are?](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2712/take-me-out-to-the-ball-game) There is nothing in your link to support your contention, unless you want to point to the final paragraph, where they point out the 2003 Rockies’ home record, but qualify it as “astonishing” (especially in light of every single other piece of data they give that completely refutes your statement). ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2010, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/39 "2010-08-12T02:31:07Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > The actual quote from the presenter is “All baseball games are scheduled to go nine innings, so why is it, most games don’t go nine innings?” It’s a bit playing with semantics, but I think it’s fair. Adding the prefatory statement makes it even less accurate than it was. Baseball games are _not_ scheduled in terms of innings, except in a tiny number of cases in certain minor leagues when a makeup doubleheader is (re)scheduled as two seven-inning games. (Or to be strictly accurate, it is rescheduled as two games in which the Exception clause of Rule 4.10(a) is activated. Such games can still be shorter or longer than regulation. I saw a “scheduled” seven-inning game once that actually went 16.) Otherwise, the schedule says nothing about innings at all. _Games_ are scheduled to be played on given dates, between given teams, at given sites, beginning (but not ending) at given times, and _according to given league rules_. It is those rules which determine how many innings end up being necessary to resolve the game, and _that_ can’t be known until it actually happens. So whether the game goes more or less than or exactly nine, it’s not a matter of the _schedule_. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2010, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907/40 "2010-08-12T02:35:26Z")
> [@Superhal](#): > > > [@RickJay](#): > > > > Where’d you get 25% from? > > [Seriously? Do you know where you are?](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2712/take-me-out-to-the-ball-game) From your link: > [@](#): > > (a) since 1900, notwithstanding some year-to-year swings, MLB home-field winning percentages have been remarkably stable at about .540 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oddball-baseball-rules/549907.md?page=3)