# Of course a nine-year-old girl can handle a Uzi, right? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 27, 2014, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631 "2014-08-27T14:12:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/121 "2014-08-28T15:39:46Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > **Bullitt** , the incompetence began and ended when he put an Uzi in the hands of a 9 year old girl. There is no “right” way to go about it, period. You are so wrong and it happens many (hundreds?) of times each day, safely. The incompetence was Charles Vacca’s, sad to say because he paid for it with his life. The real tragedy is the girl will have to live with Vacca’s mistake which directly led to his death at her trigger finger. ---
**Author:** ![DiggitCamara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df788c/32.png) [@DiggitCamara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiggitCamara)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/122 "2014-08-28T15:48:12Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > Man, that kid’s life is ruined. How do you get over having shot and killed a guy at 9? ☹ [Simple: you go on and run for (mexican) presidency](http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/mexico/family/brothers.html): > [@About a former mexican president](#): > > Raul, who as firstborn was honored with carrying his father’s first name, was only one year and seven months older than Carlos. As children, they shared the same room, went to the same elementary and high schools, took piano lessons together, and even shared the burden of a childhood tragedy: When Raul had just turned five and Carlos was three years old, they had together with an eight-year-old friend killed the family maid with a .22-caliber rifle. > > According to December 18, 1951, Mexico City newspapers, the children had "executed’ the twelve-year-old maid, named Manuela, with the rifle, which their father had left loaded in a closet. The published reports, which had mysteriously disappeared from Mexican libraries by the time Salinas had become a public figure, said that it was not entirely clear which of the youngsters had pulled the trigger. The children had been playing war games, and Manuela was condemned to death. They had asked her to get down on her knees, and one of them had shot her. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/123 "2014-08-28T15:48:30Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > You are so wrong and it happens many (hundreds?) of times each day, safely. Where? ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/124 "2014-08-28T15:51:16Z")
Hypothetically: If it was a 9 yo boy, wouldn’t this still be a stupid needless tragedy? If it was an Ingram M10 and not a weapon used to symbolize an uninvolved nation’s strength, pride, and right to exist, would there be as many vocal objections to labeling this needless death as an act of stupidity? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/125 "2014-08-28T15:57:57Z")
> [@Count\_Blucher](#): > > Hypothetically: > > If it was a 9 yo boy, wouldn’t this still be a stupid needless tragedy? > > If it was an Ingram M10 and not a weapon used to symbolize an uninvolved nation’s strength, pride, and right to exist, would there be as many vocal objections to labeling this needless death as an act of stupidity? If it were a boy of equal size and weight given a gun with equal light weight and nasty kick then, fuck yeah. I don’t think this “weapon used to symbolize an uninvolved nation’s strength, pride, and right to exist” stuff factors into this situation at all. ---
**Author:** ![lost4life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@lost4life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lost4life)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/126 "2014-08-28T16:01:57Z")
> [@Count\_Blucher](#): > > Hypothetically: > > If it was a 9 yo boy, wouldn’t this still be a stupid needless tragedy? > > If it was an Ingram M10 and not a weapon used to symbolize an uninvolved nation’s strength, pride, and right to exist, would there be as many vocal objections to labeling this needless death as an act of stupidity? Yes. > [@Bullitt](#): > > You are so wrong and it happens many (hundreds?) of times each day, safely… I did not know that hundreds of kids fired fully automatic Uzis every day. Consider me educated. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/127 "2014-08-28T16:02:04Z")
> [@Count\_Blucher](#): > > Hypothetically: > > If it was a 9 yo boy, wouldn’t this still be a stupid needless tragedy? > > If it was an Ingram M10 and not a weapon used to symbolize an uninvolved nation’s strength, pride, and right to exist, would there be as many vocal objections to labeling this needless death as an act of stupidity? I have pretty good anti-Israel radar, and I’ve sensed absolutely none of that here - especially seeing as 99 out of 100 Israelis would call the “shooting instructor” in question an utter git. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/128 "2014-08-28T16:16:18Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Where? Well a quick search found this result: [http://faq.frontsight.com/child-safety-faq.asp](http://faq.frontsight.com/child-safety-faq.asp) They’re not a small operation, and they put hundreds of shooters of all ages through their ranges each day. They might have other locations besides the one that, apparently, is about an hour’s drive from where this tragedy took place. That’s only one result. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/129 "2014-08-28T16:30:48Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > Well a quick search found this result: [http://faq.frontsight.com/child-safety-faq.asp](http://faq.frontsight.com/child-safety-faq.asp) > > They’re not a small operation, and they put hundreds of shooters of all ages through their ranges each day. They might have other locations besides the one that, apparently, is about an hour’s drive from where this tragedy took place. > > That’s only one result. Your one result doesn’t tell me what the age limit is for their Uzi training course. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/130 "2014-08-28T16:36:21Z")
Okay and your point is…? If you want to know that, ask them. It looked like they have child shooters as young as five, ISTR. ---
**Author:** ![Dag\_Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@Dag\_Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dag_Otto)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/131 "2014-08-28T16:40:40Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Your one result doesn’t tell me what the age limit is for their Uzi training course. Since that range is located in Nevada, it is under the Nevada law discussed previously. So the instructor can’t hand the Uzi directly to the child. Instead he hands it to the parent, who then hands it to the child. That intermediate step somehow makes the entire process completely safe. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/132 "2014-08-28T16:44:40Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > Okay and your point is…? > > If you want to know that, ask them. It looked like they have child shooters as young as five, ISTR. WTF? You gave that cite as a response to your claim that hundreds of 9 year old girls safely fire off Uzis. They do have 2 and 4 day Uzi courses, but they do not indicate what the age limits are for that particular course. Since you made the claim, and you provided this cite, why don’t _you_ do a little digging to see if your own cite is valid? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/133 "2014-08-28T16:47:02Z")
> [@Dag\_Otto](#): > > Since that range is located in Nevada, it is under the Nevada law discussed previously. So the instructor can’t hand the Uzi directly to the child. Instead he hands it to the parent, who then hands it to the child. That intermediate step somehow makes the entire process completely safe. Nevada law and school regulation might not match up completely. The person who runs that particular operation might run a tighter ship than that. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/134 "2014-08-28T16:52:45Z")
Nevermind-the link _does_ tell me what I need to know: > [@](#): > > What courses do you have for Children and Youth? > We have the following course available for your children to attend while your training at Front Sight: 1-Day Children’s Safety , 1-Day Youth Safety , 2-Day Children’s Safety , 2-Day Youth Safety , 4-Day Children’s Achievement Camp , 4-Day Youth Achievement Camp as well programs within the 6-Day Family Safe Forever Vacation. Please see the Course Descriptions for details. > > How does Front Sight differentiate between a “Child” and a “Youth?” > The Children’s Program is designed for ages 5-10 while the Youth Program is designed for ages 11-15. Anyone 16 and above automatically qualifies for adult courses Neither 9 year old boys nor nine year old girls get to train with Uzis. **Bullitt’s** first link-_fail_. ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/135 "2014-08-28T17:17:43Z")
Perhaps if one is not strong enough to control the recoil on their own that person should not be firing the weapon in the first place? Is any 9 year old girl capable of handling the recoil from anything other than a .22 rifle? ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/136 "2014-08-28T17:29:11Z")
Depends on the girl and the gun. I taught my stepson to shoot a .410 single shot when he was about 7 years old, and he was not a particularly strong child. My daughter has been shooting a crossbow since she was about 11 or 12 (the same one Daryl used in the first few seasons of The Walking Dead). A major factor in controlling the gun is being able to handle the weight of the gun itself. The crossbow is heavy for its size, but she is able to hold it up easily and cock it herself. She can control it. A weapon that the shooter is struggling just to aim is not under control. ---
**Author:** ![buddy431](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@buddy431](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddy431)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/137 "2014-08-28T17:42:16Z")
I don’t get the hate for the parents here. They were participating in an event that is legal and advertised as safe even for young children. We don’t know they’re background, but being from New Jersey, I wouldn’t be surprised if none of them are very experienced with firearms, and thought that being at a range in a controlled environment would be a good time to be exposed. I agree with them too: learning to shoot at a range with an instructor is probably the best place to learn to shoot. The fault here is mostly with the range, who encourage this sort of thing to happen, and partly with the instructor, for not preventing the child from using this type of gun. ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/138 "2014-08-28T18:00:03Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Depends on the girl and the gun. I taught my stepson to shoot a .410 single shot when he was about 7 years old, and he was not a particularly strong child. My daughter has been shooting a crossbow since she was about 11 or 12 (the same one Daryl used in the first few seasons of The Walking Dead). A major factor in controlling the gun is being able to handle the weight of the gun itself. The crossbow is heavy for its size, but she is able to hold it up easily and cock it herself. She can control it. A weapon that the shooter is struggling just to aim is not under control. Yeah. What’s an uzi weigh? Maybe 8 pounds loaded? This girl looked to be your average nine your old. And does it make sense to say that an Uzi is a top-heavy weapon which makes handling recoil even more difficult? ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/139 "2014-08-28T18:01:23Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > IIRC, no **new** fully automatic weapons can be manufactured or imported for civilian use, but those that were already in civilian hands before a certain date were grandfathered in… “Read my lips, no new machine guns.” ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2014, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631/140 "2014-08-28T18:06:27Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > Yeah. What’s an uzi weigh? Maybe 8 pounds loaded? This girl looked to be your average nine your old. And does it make sense to say that an Uzi is a top-heavy weapon which makes handling recoil even more difficult? Would another SMG have been easier to handle for her? Maybe a P90? MP5? PPSh-41? Thompson? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-a-nine-year-old-girl-can-handle-a-uzi-right/696631.md?page=8)