# 'Of course you realize, this means war.' (U.S. raids Iran consulate in Iraq) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 11, 2007, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552 "2007-01-11T14:50:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2007, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/61 "2007-01-12T21:25:52Z")
Spot: Is he dead yet? Barney: Don’t think so. Spot: We can’t start eating him until he’s dead? Barney: Pretty sure those are the rules. Spot: Oh. So…is he dead yet? ---
**Author:** ![Hung\_Mung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@Hung\_Mung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hung_Mung)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2007, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/62 "2007-01-12T21:38:08Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Spot: Is he dead yet? Barney: Don’t think so. Spot: We can’t start eating him until he’s dead? Barney: Pretty sure those are the rules. Spot: Oh. So…is he dead yet? [/QUOTE] Heh. I needed that chuckle. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2007, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/63 "2007-01-12T21:53:49Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] Does a "liason office"have the same special rights as an embassy? [/QUOTE] [shrug] Get ready for a wide range of wildly conflicting “expert” opinions on that, and not just on the Dope. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2007, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/64 "2007-01-13T14:30:37Z")
I’m sure if there’s some kind of problem with the law about consulates, Bush will just write a signing statement explaining how he’s a god among men and the laws don’t apply to him. If he feels like explaining himself at all. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2007, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/65 "2007-01-14T16:41:33Z")
[The U.S. military now says](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/14/AR2007011400319.html) the five men detained “are connected to the Iranian Revolutionary Guard’s al-Qods Force, an organization that is active in arming, training, and funding Middle East militant groups, such as Hezbollah in Lebanon.” ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2007, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/66 "2007-01-14T19:32:21Z")
[QUOTE=Evil Captor] I’m sure if there’s some kind of problem with the law about consulates, Bush will just write a signing statement explaining how he’s a god among men and the laws don’t apply to him. If he feels like explaining himself at all. [/QUOTE] _Not_ a consulate. I note that after we discovered it wasn’t an embassy or even a consulate, the outrage has died down. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/67 "2007-01-16T21:49:31Z")
The Kurds, at any rate, are [none too pleased.](http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/01/11/iraq.main/index.html) They demand the immediate release of the detainees (based on diplomatic immunity) and that their regional government be informed in advance of any such future U.S. actions in Iraqi Kurdistan. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2007, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/68 "2007-01-17T05:03:59Z")
[Iran shoots down U.S. spy drone amid growing U.S. military pressure](http://english.people.com.cn/200701/17/eng20070117_341962.html) > [@](#): > > The aircraft was brought down when it was trying to cross the borders “during the last few days,” Seyed Nezam Mola Hoveizeh, a member of the parliament, was quoted by the local Fars News Agency as saying. > > The lawmaker gave no exact date of the shooting-down or any other details about the incident, but he said that “the United States sent such spy drones to the region every now and then.” ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2007, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/69 "2007-01-20T16:29:56Z")
Iran is insisting the five men arrested are diplomats and is [planning to lodge a complaint with the UN Security Council.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/19/AR2007011900351.html) ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2007, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/70 "2007-01-20T18:40:50Z")
Yeah, and the KGB and CIA claimed exactly the same thing when their spies were captured. Despite the clear incompetence of the Bush administration, I tend to believe them just a bit more than the apocalyptic nutjobs in Iran. In fact, I would completely discount Iran’s claim, on the basis that it was completely predictable that they would make it, no matter who those people are. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2007, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/71 "2007-01-20T18:49:21Z")
Might very well be true, **Sam**. There is some question on that. But that question is rather the point, don’t you think? In such a tense situation, doesn’t it behoove the actors to take extraordinary care that their actions are not provocative? Unless, of course, provocation is more or less the point of the excercise… ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Duality](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.duality/32/4098_2.png) [@Mr.Duality](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Duality)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2007, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/72 "2007-01-20T20:09:40Z")
[QUOTE=Quiddity Glomfuster] Yes but the PNAC strategy is still (last I checked) sitting there on their website, signed by the cabal, and visible for anyone who wishes to click. Real conspiracies deal in speculation about clandestine events planned in stealth. This is right there in the open. Oh my head hurts trying to conceive of the kind of brain that could look at all this and dismiss it. It’s beyond my comprehension entirely. [/QUOTE] “Sometimes our right hand doesn’t know what our far-right hand is doing.” Ronald Reagan ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2007, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/73 "2007-01-20T20:42:35Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] In such a tense situation, doesn’t it behoove the actors to take extraordinary care that their actions are not provocative? [/QUOTE] No less than it behooves them to be sure they’re making their decisions on the basis of facts, and unbiased assessments of non-cherry-picked intelligence, of course. It wouldn’t do _at all_, for instance, to invade Iran and destroy their government, and only \*then \* start seeing if they had WMD’s. No matter \*what \* smell was in the air. But then that should be obvious. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2007, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/74 "2007-01-21T18:11:12Z")
[QUOTE=jebert] While recognizing the fact that he is no intellectual giant, I can’t believe that even Bush would be stupid enough to attack Iran without substantial provocation on their part and incontrovertible proof that we didn’t pull any shenanigans to make it look like Iran acted first. [/QUOTE] I assume this was tongue in cheek? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2007, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/75 "2007-01-21T18:15:45Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Might very well be true, **Sam**. There is some question on that. But that question is rather the point, don’t you think? In such a tense situation, doesn’t it behoove the actors to take extraordinary care that their actions are not provocative? [/QUOTE] You mean like not shooting down the other guy’s airplanes? Not shipping guns and weapons to the insurgency? Not threatening to wipe other countries off the map? It’s Iran who’s being provocative here. And if in fact those guys are revolutionary guards, that’s yet another provocation. Why go blaming the U.S. again? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2007, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/76 "2007-01-21T19:44:53Z")
[QUOTE=Sam Stone] You mean like not shooting down the other guy’s airplanes?.. [/quote] Cite. Definitely. I pay some attention to the news, but missed the blaring headlines “Iran shoots down American planes!” How many pilots have we lost, **Sam**. Over who’s air space? Really, Iran moved an anti-aircraft battery into Iraq and shot down American planes? Wow! Pretty heavy stuff, there, **Sam**. Soon as you cite, of course. > [@](#): > > …Not shipping guns and weapons to the insurgency?.. “_The_ insurgency”? Hmmmm. I presume you mean the Shia militia, since Iran is most closely associated with Shia. Are you suggesting that America attack anyone who is arming and assisting the Sunni as well? Or is your belligerence focused and exclusive? > [@](#): > > …Not threatening to wipe other countries off the map?.. All efforts unavailing, Israel is not the 51st state of the United States. Other nations are entirely at liberty to hate one anothers guts. What they are not supposed to do is invade under false pretenses of imminent threat. We covered this. > [@](#): > > …Why go blaming the U.S. again? Well, gee, **Sam** , if we weren’t where we shouldn’t be, this might not be happening, don’t you think? Has it not occured to you that our every action in the past several years has been a whopping big Christmas present to the ruling _mullahs_ of Iran? And they didn’t even thank us. They are as ungrateful as the Iraqis! Must be a Muslim thing. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2007, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/77 "2007-01-21T20:45:13Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] I pay some attention to the news, but missed the blaring headlines “Iran shoots down American planes!” [/quote] Well, they maybe \*want \* to. That’s the same thing as \*doing \* it, according to the warhawk arguments \*\*Sam \*\* treated us to so many lives ago, from his safe bunker in the north country. > [@](#): > > “_The_ insurgency”? Hmmmm. I presume you mean the Shia militia Point of order, Mr. Chairman. “Insurgency” generally means Sunni, “militia” means Shiite. One group seems to hate us and want to kill us a little more than the other, not that it matters anymore. ---
**Author:** ![pantom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/34f0e0/32.png) [@pantom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pantom)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/78 "2007-01-22T03:52:53Z")
We did shoot down an Iranian airliner, many years ago. Maybe he means that? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/79 "2007-01-22T04:38:41Z")
[U.S. Spy Plane Shot Down by Iran](http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&code=20070116&articleId=4496). ---
**Author:** ![pantom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/34f0e0/32.png) [@pantom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pantom)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2007, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552/80 "2007-01-22T04:41:16Z")
Weak. Real weak. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-course-you-realize-this-means-war-u-s-raids-iran-consulate-in-iraq/387552.md?page=5)