# Of what antiquity are those collective nouns for animals? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 19, 2000, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410 "2000-12-19T20:39:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![scratch1300](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@scratch1300](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scratch1300)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2000, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410/1 "2000-12-19T20:39:42Z")
I’m not talking about ancient and well-known designations such as a _pride_ of lions or a _school_ of fish. But those twerpy collectives (mostly ornithological) like an _exaltation_ of larks or a _murder_ of crows or an _ostentation_ of peacocks, when did they arise? [sub][sup][Here](http://www.stalking.co.uk/group.html) is one link to a list of collective animal names for those who are interested.[/sub][/sup] ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2000, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410/2 "2000-12-19T20:43:13Z")
I don’t have a source, but I’m pretty sure I read that Parliament created them _ex nihilo_ in the late 1600s. Thus, a group of (wise, old) owls is called. . .a “parliament.” Of course. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2000, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410/3 "2000-12-19T21:10:29Z")
According to the book, _An Exaltation of Larks_, many of them originated in the Middle Ages as hunting terms (terms of venery). There are many of these, such as _skulk of foxes_ and _sloth of bears_. _Pride of lions_ is from the same time period; it just happens to be one of the few that have survived. I believe they were recognized as fanciful at the time. Of course, many others have been fabricated since, and _An Exaltation of Larks_ has a whole section of new coinages, such as a _commiseration of undertakers_. I believe that _exaltation of larks_ is of approximately the same vintage as _pride of lions_. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2000, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410/4 "2000-12-19T21:40:41Z")
Unfortunately, I do _not_ have a cite for this, I believe I may have read it in an Asimov’s something or other when I was younger, but I believe the terms belonged more to the distaff side. I am given to understand that it was a popular lady’s game at the time mentioned, the late middle ages (I believe), to think up such terms. A murder of crows, a flock of seagulls, a covey of rabbits, a pride of peacocks. (Off the top of my head, possibly inaccurate, and one’s just a bad joke) I belive this is known as “making your own fun.” My parents tell me they used to perform this feat without any technical assistance. All hail the sweet goddess of the NES. E-Sabbath ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2000, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410/5 "2000-12-19T22:31:56Z")
Per the OED: [ul][li]exaltation of larks (larkes) – 1430[/li][li]pride of lions (loinys) - 1486[/li][li]skulk of foxes (foxys) - 1450 (though skulk can be used for more than just foxes)[/li][li]sloth of bears (beerys, bayris, beres) - 1452[/li][li]covey of partridges (pertychys) - 1440[/li][li]flock of seagulls (seagylls) - 1982[/li][/ul] Found no listing for these in either OED or Webster’s Unabridge: [ul][li]murder of crows[/li][li]ostentation of peacocks[/li][/ul] I have never even heard the peacock one. ---
**Author:** ![Danielinthewolvesden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ce7236/32.png) [@Danielinthewolvesden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Danielinthewolvesden)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2000, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410/6 "2000-12-19T23:57:52Z")
Many of those 'collective nouns", such as a “crash” of rhinos, that that silly book “An exaltation of larks” list- were made up for a Victorian parlor game, and never actually used, or even intended to be used. Personally, unless the original meaning of “exaltation” meant group of larks- and we then applied the word to the common usages- I have my doubts. As a rule of thumb (not always true) if that “collective noun” is a word that normally has no group meaning, and it sounds “cute”, such as 'crach of rhinos"- then it is likely bogus. ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2000, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410/7 "2000-12-20T13:56:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Danielinthewolvesden \* > \*\*Many of those 'collective nouns", such as a “crash” of rhinos, that that silly book “An exaltation of larks” list- were made up for a Victorian parlor game, and never actually used, or even intended to be used. Personally, unless the original meaning of “exaltation” meant group of larks- and we then applied the word to the common usages- I have my doubts. > > As a rule of thumb (not always true) if that “collective noun” is a word that normally has no group meaning, and it sounds “cute”, such as 'crach of rhinos"- then it is likely bogus. \*\* I somewhat agree with you, but not entirely. By your reasoning, a “pride of lions” is a bogus usage. Some terms are _contrived_, but that does not make them _bogus_. Others are closer to being bogus. For example, I don’t know the origin of “murder of crows”, but the only time I hear it used is when someone asks “What is a group of crows called?” (or when some movie executive is trying to be clever). It’s possible some of these terms are only used by zoologists, in which case it’s jargon, or only by people trying to show how clever they are, in which case it’s bogus. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2000, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410/8 "2000-12-24T22:23:16Z")
Thanks to **JeffB’s** cites from the OED, we see that _exaltation of larks_ predates _pride of lions_. Both terms are of similar antiquity and from the same tradition, that of venery (hunting). These do, in many cases, represent fanciful coinages, in part due to the need of the aristocracy to validate their superiority by deveoloping technical terms for every aspect of aristoratic pursuits such as hunting. But the only real difference between them is that pride of lions has survived in general use, and exaltation of larks has not. Actually, the coiners of the terms were probably far more familiar with the hunting of larks (which were used as food during that era in England) than they were in hunting lions. And “exaltation” is an entirely appropriate term to use for larks, which fly high in the air in their courtship display. While I’m not sure of its antiquity, “murder of crows” may very well refer to their liking for carrion and thus battlefields and other scenes of slaughter. My guess is that very few of these collective terms predate the 1400s (these being herd, flock, pack; though according to the OED “flock of seagulls” is a relativly recent usage. And I wonder how far back “school of fish” goes - akthough I believe it’s probably derived from “shoal.”) There are rather few collective terms that are used by naturalists. Herd serves for most grazing animals (except sheep, for which flock is mysteriously used), pack for social carnivores (except lions), flock for birds, swarm for insects, and school for fish. There are a few idiosyncratic usages, such as “pod of whales” and “mob of kangaroos,” the latter obviously of fairly recent vintage. One interesting anomaly is that there is no general term for individuals of domestic cattle. “Cattle” is collective and plural; bull applies to the male, cow to the female, and calf to the young. But there is no term for an individual animal irrespective of gender or age (unlike, say, “horses, a horse, stallion, mare, colt,” “sheep, a sheep, ram, ewe, lamb.”) One farmer I knew used to get around this by calling them “cattle-beasts.” ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2000, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/of-what-antiquity-are-those-collective-nouns-for-animals/46410/9 "2000-12-25T01:31:01Z")
JeffB: > [@](#): > > flock of seagulls (seagylls) - **1982** Oh behave!