# Official 2011 NFL Football Thread - Preseason Edition **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [July 21, 2011, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920 "2011-07-21T23:58:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 28
**Author:** ![zoog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7ea924/32.png) [@zoog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoog)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/542 "2011-08-22T20:12:42Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I don’t think that’s true. [The odds of scoring from your own 15 are not significantly worse than the odds of scoring from your own 20](http://www.nflstatsblog.com/2011/08/fun-fact-chances-of-scoring-based-on.html). In either case, chances are you’ll be punting. > > However, the odds of scoring from your own 40 _are_ significantly higher. > > Most NFL coaches have limited imagination. Smart coaches like Bill Belichick will let their returners start running back kickoffs that go into the end zone; “common sense” head coaches will not. Guess which strategy will work better? What I meant by high risk is the risk of injury. I saw some numbers that I can’t find now that indicated that there were more major injuries per play on returns than on plays from scrimmage. ---
**Author:** ![zoog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7ea924/32.png) [@zoog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoog)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/543 "2011-08-22T20:17:39Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > I really don’t see all the fuss about the kickoff rule. It’s basically restoring kickoffs to something like they were throughout the 80s and early 90s. > > The last time it was changed was back in 1994, and that was to move it back from the 35 to the 30. The NCAA naturally followed suit a few years later. > > Kickers might be a little better now than 17 years ago, but they can’t be that much better. It opened up the game a bit, but it’s not like football was a dreary, unexciting affair before '94. There were still plenty of great kickoff returns before that. > > And that’s not to mention that it was moved back to the 35 from the 40 back in '74. The game actually is significantly different now than in the 70s, but it’s not like the rule is set in stone or that having such forward kickoff spots dooms the return game. I think that kickers are stronger. Like every other athlete in every other sport, they are getting bigger and stronger than they used to be. That’s why they kept moving the kickoffs back before. I’ll be shocked if the percentage of kickoff touchbacks is less than 75% this season. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/544 "2011-08-22T20:35:56Z")
> [@zoog](#): > > I think that kickers are stronger. Like every other athlete in every other sport, they are getting bigger and stronger than they used to be. That’s why they kept moving the kickoffs back before. I’ll be shocked if the percentage of kickoff touchbacks is less than 75% this season. I’ll take the under on that. Care to make a friendly wager? I’ll even give you a few points. My estimate is less than 50% of kickoffs will result in a touchback. Actually my own estimate is less than 35% (less than half of your estimate) and even that feels like an overestimate, but I’ll give myself some leeway. FYI, in 1993, the last year we kicked off from the 35, around 27% were touchbacks. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/545 "2011-08-22T22:05:18Z")
Packers lost Frank Zombo for what might be the entire season. > **[Frank Zombo out with broken scapula](https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/frank-zombo-out-with-broken-scupula)** > > After leading the competition for outside linebacker early in training camp, Frank Zombo played with the second team for much of last week in Green Bay. This is a similar injury to what cost Rashard Mendenhall his rookie year and while they have only said “extended period” thus far it’s very possible this could be a season ender. Good news for the Bears. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/546 "2011-08-22T23:02:50Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Packers lost Frank Zombo for what might be the entire season. > > [Frank Zombo out with broken scapula - NBC Sports](http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/22/frank-zombo-out-with-broken-scupula/) > > This is a similar injury to what cost Rashard Mendenhall his rookie year and while they have only said “extended period” thus far it’s very possible this could be a season ender. > > Good news for the Bears. I like Zombo. He’s a good story, he moved from DE to OLB, and he’s a solid player. But his pass rush needs work and he’s not an eye popper in coverage. It’s certainly a loss, but Walden and maybe Jones will pick up the slack. Should be an interesting Bears game tonight. I’m guessing we see Cutler for two series only. ---
**Author:** ![sitchensis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sitchensis/32/4892_2.png) [@sitchensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sitchensis)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/547 "2011-08-22T23:32:12Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > I’ll take the under on that. > > Care to make a friendly wager? > > I’ll even give you a few points. My estimate is less than 50% of kickoffs will result in a touchback. > > Actually my own estimate is less than 35% (less than half of your estimate) and even that feels like an overestimate, but I’ll give myself some leeway. > > FYI, in 1993, the last year we kicked off from the 35, around 27% were touchbacks. In my opinion the rule change amounts to a lot more than just 5 yards. You reach a tipping point with kickoffs where a kicker doesn’t have to try and aim or put any air under the ball anymore. It used to cost them a few yards to angle their kicks but it was worth it because a slight miss-hit going down the middle was way worse. It used to cost them a few yards to get a little better hang time on kicks for the same reason. When aiming and hang time means nothing, they can just rear back and kick for distance. I have seen a lot more kickers aiming for the center of the uprights rather than and little to one side or the other. I feel that the true “realized” change in yardage to be more like 9 or 10 yards, and that is way too much to give kicker. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2011, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/548 "2011-08-22T23:45:03Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > And Terrelle Pryor, an athlete with an amazing 40 time (for a QB) goes to … > > That’s right. The Raiders. They used a third rounder on him. It’s going to be the real-life incarnation of Featherstone from _Necessary Roughness_: DON’T THROW IT TO STONE HANDS! Or, even better, he’ll be the second coming of Kordell Stewart, a guy who can do anything but insists that he’s an NFL quarterback. If he sticks to that he’ll be gone before his rookie contract is up. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/549 "2011-08-23T01:05:39Z")
The Browns signed Joe Thomas to a 7 year, 84m extension with $44m guaranteed. I’m generally not a fan of giving one player such a big chunk of your salary cap but Joe Thomas is pretty awesome so I’m happy he’ll spend his career as a Brown. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/550 "2011-08-23T02:12:02Z")
Man, the Bears look like shit tonight. I’m really starting tobecome concerned about the first team offense. The line wasn’t a serious issue, but the passing game was trash. ---
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/551 "2011-08-23T02:20:54Z")
Wow. I forgot just how boring preseason football is to watch. The commentators sound like they are phoning it in. Doesn’t help that the Bears look like total shit. I went to the Den/Buf game this past weekend with some free tix and it was just as boring in person. I’m going to the Den/Sea game this weekend. Maybe that will be more exciting? ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/552 "2011-08-23T02:55:33Z")
Reports say Taylor Mays to Cincinnati for an unkown draft pick, probably late-rounder. I’d like it to be a fifth, but more likely to be a seventh, sixth at best. He’d make a good deep middle linebacker in a Tampa-2. In any case, I wish him luck. I’ve always had a soft spot for the Bungles, seeings how my Niners crushed them twice in the Super Bowl. Poor guys. ---
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/553 "2011-08-23T03:21:53Z")
Man, we took a major ass beating tonight. Hope things change dramatically when we start playing for real or this could be a short season. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/554 "2011-08-23T03:39:31Z")
The Bears O line only allowed, by my count, one sack tonight. Much better than the 9 from last week, or the 9 from the last time they played the Giants. A positive step. Of course the cost was that they couldn’t put up any points, but hey, only one sack is only one sack. Thank god that game is over so I can stop rooting for the Giants. Leaves a bitter taste in my mouth. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/555 "2011-08-23T03:43:46Z")
> [@Cubsfan](#): > > Man, we took a major ass beating tonight. Hope things change dramatically when we start playing for real or this could be a short season. I’m trying not to overreact. The Bears came out of this healthy. They were without a bunch of key starters on defense to open the game and they pulled Peppers and Urlacher pretty much immediately after the opening series. The offensive line played pretty well against a tough pass rush and the Giants played their starters quite a lot. Barber was good again and Cutler had no turnovers. Still, I never like seeing that type of ass beating and I’m going to have a REALLY short fuse on the whole Mike Martz system this year. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/556 "2011-08-23T05:58:16Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > they pulled Peppers and Urlacher pretty much immediately after the opening series. I thought they both played most of the first half. I’ll have to go back and check; I’m only up to halftime so far. After the wonderful news that Thomas is done for the year I turned it off in disgust. > [@](#): > > Still, I never like seeing that type of ass beating and I’m going to have a REALLY short fuse on the whole Mike Martz system this year. Late in the first half they showed the distribution and it was something like 8 runs and 16 passes. That doesn’t bode well. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 9:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/557 "2011-08-23T09:05:12Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > And a “posting from the AFCN basement” custom title sounds good to me. Do you want to do it for a set period of time like a month or - better yet I think - it sticks with you until your team wins a game. So maybe you’ll win in week 2 and it only lasts a week. Or… maybe the Bengals won’t win until week 10 or 12, in which case you’ll be stuck with it for a long time, but then if that’s the case, you’ll definitely be in the basement and hence justify it. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/558 "2011-08-23T11:49:58Z")
Minor things I noted about the Bears game: Jacobs made Major Wright look like a Pop Warner player with a juke on his 18 yard TD run. Made me smile. Hester as a wide receiver was the same as his career, wildly inconsistent. Made me smile. I sang his praises before, but Da Rel Scott could be a great change of pace back in the NFL. His speed is pretty good. Made me smile. It’s only preseason and the blowout, while nice, means nothing. I want real football. Made me frown. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/559 "2011-08-23T15:11:02Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > I thought they both played most of the first half. I’ll have to go back and check; I’m only up to halftime so far. After the wonderful news that Thomas is done for the year I turned it off in disgust. Most of the starting defense played through the first half. Peppers and Urlacher came out at the start of the 2nd quarter, and due to the big kickoff return that started the second series that really amounted to about 1 and a half series. > [@](#): > > Late in the first half they showed the distribution and it was something like 8 runs and 16 passes. That doesn’t bode well. Eh, it’s preseason. Against the Bills the split was the opposite. Either the Bears had a plan to evaluate the passing game last night or they were reacting to the big lead the Giants built. Either way, I’m not ready to jump off the bridge on this one. I’m far more concerned with the no audibles, throw to a spot, square-peg system that seems to be so feast or famine in practice. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/560 "2011-08-23T17:02:53Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Do you want to do it for a set period of time like a month or - better yet I think - it sticks with you until your team wins a game. So maybe you’ll win in week 2 and it only lasts a week. Or… maybe the Bengals won’t win until week 10 or 12, in which case you’ll be stuck with it for a long time, but then if that’s the case, you’ll definitely be in the basement and hence justify it. I think that we should make it so whichever of our teams has a worse record has to bear the basement title until the situation changes. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2011, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920/561 "2011-08-23T17:19:44Z")
That makes sense I guess but it’s not as fun for me. I’m going to the home opener and it’ll be that much sweeter when we’re in direct competition, and the bet can be done in one incident. There’s also a chance there will be a lot of ties (it’s not at all unlikely two teams in the divison will be 0-1, 1-1, 0-2, 1-2, etc). I’m pretty confident at taking that bet anyway, if that’s how you want to do it, but I didn’t plan to make the punishment last for the entire football season. I’m feeling merciful. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920.md?page=27) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-2011-nfl-football-thread-preseason-edition/589920.md?page=29)