# Official SDMB WTC Rumor Killer Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 19, 2001, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583 "2001-09-19T14:37:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Vinnie\_Virginslayer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/53a042/32.png) [@Vinnie\_Virginslayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vinnie_Virginslayer)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2001, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/1 "2001-09-19T14:37:46Z")
I have never in my life remember hearing so many false stories in one week’s time. > **[Did Nostradamus Predict 9/11 and the End of the World?](https://www.liveabout.com/nostradamuss-prophesies-end-of-the-world-4072734)** > > Some believe the French prophet Nostradamus predicted in horrific detail the end of the world and World War III, while skeptics say it's all bunk. Here’s what I would like to do here: either post a rumor that you know to be untrue, or of you hear a story that seems suspicious, post it and maybe using our vast resources we can either confirm or deny the story. Here’s some stories being passed around that are 100% UNTRUE: \*\*MAN TRAVELS DOWN 86 STORIES WHEN WTC COLLAPSES, MIRACULOUSLY SURVIVES WITH BROKEN LEG FIREMEN RESCUED IN SUV UNDERNEATH WTC RUBBLE FIVE FIREFIGHTERS FOUND IN AIR POCKET UNDERNEATH WTC RUBBLE VIDEO OF PALESTINIANS CELEBRATING IN STREETS ACTUALLY FOOTAGE FROM 1991 ARAB-AMERICANS DANCING IN AMERICAN STREETS ARAB-AMERICAN GAS STATION OWNER REFUSING SERVICE TO MOTORIST WITH AMERICAN FLAG VARIOUS QUATRAINS SUPPOSEDLY WRITTEN BY NOSTRADAMUS CANDLELIGHT VIGIL TO BE PHOTOGRAPHED VIA SATELLITE MORE THEN 4 PLANES WERE HIJACKED CELEBRATING ARAB-AMERICAN DOCTORS ESCORTED TO IMMIGRATION OFFICIALS BY FBI ARAB-AMERICAN HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS CHEER ATTACKS \*\* ---
**Author:** ![bourbonstew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3e96dc/32.png) [@bourbonstew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bourbonstew)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2001, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/2 "2001-09-19T15:08:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Vinnie Virginslayer \* > \*\*Here’s some stories being passed around that are 100% UNTRUE: > > FIREMEN RESCUED IN SUV UNDERNEATH WTC RUBBLE > > FIVE FIREFIGHTERS FOUND IN AIR POCKET UNDERNEATH WTC RUBBLE > \*\* These two were from the same story and I believe was reported on CNN and elsewhere. Thursday or Friday they rescued 5 firefighters who were fine from an SUV in the rubble. Where do you see that this was untrue ? > [@](#): > > \*\* > ARAB-AMERICANS DANCING IN AMERICAN STREETS > > ARAB-AMERICAN HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS CHEER ATTACKS > \*\* Some students, whether college or HS I don’t know, were reported by again the national news agencies as celebrating the attacks in NJ. I never heard a retraction to this and was pretty well glued to the tube and 'net Tuesday and Wednesday. I checked the link and there was no mention of these ‘rumors’. Were these red herrings you put in ? ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2001, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/3 "2001-09-19T15:15:25Z")
the recent gift of $43 million to the Taliban rulers of Afghanistan. Currently being debunked in another thread here: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=88156](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=88156) ---
**Author:** ![Noon\_at\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ba8739/32.png) [@Noon\_at\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noon_at_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2001, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/4 "2001-09-19T15:21:28Z")
> [@](#): > > These two were from the same story and I believe was reported on CNN and elsewhere. Thursday or Friday they rescued 5 firefighters who were fine from an SUV in the rubble. Where do you see that this was untrue ? The story was misleading in the way it was reported. Some survivors of the WTC bombing and the buldings’ collapse were rescued within 24 hours of the disaster, but none since then. The five firefighters that were recovered later were working the disaster and were temporarily trapped due to shifting debris. Rumors, semi-truths, and bad reported are common with major disasters. Nam ---
**Author:** ![pezpunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@pezpunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pezpunk)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2001, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/5 "2001-09-19T15:35:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Vinnie Virginslayer \* > \*\*I have never in my life remember hearing so many false stories in one week’s time. > > Here’s some stories being passed around that are 100% UNTRUE: > > \*\*MAN TRAVELS DOWN 86 STORIES WHEN WTC COLLAPSES, MIRACULOUSLY SURVIVES WITH BROKEN LEG > > * * * Not true? I thought I saw a Dr. on the news saying that he had spoken with the firefighter who traveled the 86 floors? ---
**Author:** ![Noon\_at\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ba8739/32.png) [@Noon\_at\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noon_at_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2001, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/6 "2001-09-19T21:12:30Z")
Each of the towers had a gross weight of approximately 200,000 _tons_. Half of that weight is the superstructure – steel that tends to only twist and bend. The other half is concrete, glass, etc. At floor 86 he would have had _only_ 50 tons of debris overhead with half of that being the non-steel material that forms the deadly missles. Late last week I watched an interview with a welder that had shown up to help with the rescue. Despite only 2 welders actively cutting steel and another half dozen acetylene torches lying about unused, he was told that he wouldn’t be allowed to help because FEMA was no longer running the recovery and he wasn’t in the right union. That’s even more disturbing than the rumors. Nam ---
**Author:** ![SouthernStyle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b3f665/32.png) [@SouthernStyle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SouthernStyle)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/7 "2001-09-20T17:00:11Z")
> [@](#): > > At floor 86 he would have had only 50 tons of debris overhead with half of that being the non-steel material that forms the deadly missles. I assume that you meant 50,000 tons? I cannot imagine an event where someone survives a fall of nearly 1,000 feet by riding a debris wave of 150,000 tons of rubble while simultaneously avoiding a “shower” by another 50,000 tons of debris. (I can’t find a news site that documents any such survivor.) If it’s true that someone was prevented from assisting in the rescue/recovery because of union membership then I truly am depressed. What say you to this union stance, leftists? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/8 "2001-09-20T17:21:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by pezpunk \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Vinnie Virginslayer \* > > \*\*I have never in my life remember hearing so many false stories in one week’s time. > > > > Here’s some stories being passed around that are 100% UNTRUE: > > > > \*\*MAN TRAVELS DOWN 86 STORIES WHEN WTC COLLAPSES, MIRACULOUSLY SURVIVES WITH BROKEN LEG > > > > * * * > > Not true? I thought I saw a Dr. on the news saying that he had spoken with the firefighter who traveled the 86 floors? \*\* From [Snopes](http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/hoaxes/survivor.htm) > [@](#): > > Some news outlets have reported tales from the scene involving interviews with those who’ve rescued victims from the fallen building. One such report came from two members of the Passaic County Sheriff’s Department who pulled a trapped Port Authority police officer from a crater a day after the disaster. “He must have just rode the building as it came down,” one of them said. > > The rescued officer with a broken leg is unnamed. Another who supposedly endured this experience is John McLoughlin, a 21-year veteran of the Port Authority police. He sustained kidney damage and was in critical condition, but his prognosis was good. Confusion over his story has fueled the rumor. According to a New York Times article written the day he was found: > > > [@](#): > > > > No one knows how Sergeant McLoughlin survived Tuesday’s collapse, or even where he was when the buildings fell. His colleagues said he was probably outside the south tower when it came down, but a battalion chief at the rescue said that Sergeant McLoughlin was on the 82nd floor of the building when it came down. > > At this point in time, it’s still not known where McLoughlin was when the building collapsed. Maybe he was pinned on the ground by falling debris. Or maybe he fell along with the building. ---
**Author:** ![Chekmate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/46a35a/32.png) [@Chekmate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chekmate)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/9 "2001-09-20T17:29:37Z")
Just thought I’d add this site: [http://www.snopes2.com/info/rumors.htm](http://www.snopes2.com/info/rumors.htm) It’s updated pretty much everyday, and this page it devoted sole to rumors about the WTC. ---
**Author:** ![Vinnie\_Virginslayer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/53a042/32.png) [@Vinnie\_Virginslayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vinnie_Virginslayer)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/10 "2001-09-20T17:52:14Z")
None of the stories in the OP were posted as “red herrings”. I got debunks off the Net and also off radio shows. The feedback is terrific. Maybe we can classify the fireman falling 86 stories as “unsubstaiated” but it is really, really hard to buy. Here’s another one I want to throw out there: My wife said she was told that a local university took down all the American flags around campus because some international students complained. I don’t want to mention the school; I’d like to smoke out if this story is being told anywhere else in the country, which would then almost certainly make it untrue. Sounds like a variation of the “evil Arab complains about the American flag being displayed” story. While by now I’ve been shown enough sources to show that the gas price gouging story was true, I don’t believe it was widespread as it was made out to be. It sounds like something that took place in a couple places. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had people tell me this story, all in different locations: Small midwest town Local gas station raises prices $5 gallon Mayor is called Mayor sends sherrif, who cites gas station owner for “price gouging”, which I’m not even sure a local official can do! ---
**Author:** ![Vinnie\_Virginslayer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/53a042/32.png) [@Vinnie\_Virginslayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vinnie_Virginslayer)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/11 "2001-09-20T17:56:31Z")
By the way I’m having a bitch of a time downloading that snopes rumor site. Any mirrors I can try? ---
**Author:** ![Skelji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b38774/32.png) [@Skelji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skelji)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/12 "2001-09-20T18:05:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Vinnie Virginslayer \* > **My wife said she was told that a local university took down all the American flags around campus because some international students complained. I don’t want to mention the school; I’d like to smoke out if this story is being told anywhere else in the country, which would then almost certainly make it untrue. Sounds like a variation of the “evil Arab complains about the American flag being displayed” story.** I heard a similar story being relayed as “fact” on one of the news reports. What I heard was that, at some school, a librarian was requesting that no students be allowed to wear “Proud To Be An American” t-shirts because it “offended” foreign students. :rolleyes: I would think that any variation of this sort is untrue. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/13 "2001-09-20T18:24:36Z")
This variation, according to snopes, IS true: [A U.S. company banned its employees from displaying American flags.](http://www.snopes2.com/inboxer/outrage/flagban.htm) But they did change their tune later. The company is listed as National Council of Compensation Insurance. If true, I don’t think I would like to work for them, no matter what my nationality. ---
**Author:** ![seawitch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@seawitch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/seawitch)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/14 "2001-09-20T18:37:11Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Vinnie Virginslayer \* > \*\* > CANDLELIGHT VIGIL TO BE PHOTOGRAPHED VIA SATELLITE_\* I can’t tell you how upset one of my friends was when I pointed out that you can’t see a candle from space. Hell, you can’t see one from a block away. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/15 "2001-09-20T18:41:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SouthernStyle \* > If it’s true that someone was prevented from assisting in the rescue/recovery because of union membership then I truly am depressed. > > What say you to this union stance, leftists? You’re assuming a lot here, **SouthernStyle**. If it’s simply a matter of some union being snooty about its prerogatives, then of course it’s wrong. But I’d recommend reading [Cartooniverse’s thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=87248) on his experiences in the aftermath of the WTC collapse, before jumping to conclusions. There are lots of good reasons for making sure people aren’t let in to the site, willy-nilly. Anyone who is affected by this can _say_ whatever they damned well please; we don’t know the truth of it. We’ve got the testimony of one upset individual, and that’s all. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/16 "2001-09-20T18:46:43Z")
Yes, the company with the ban on US Flags was here in this festering cesspool of ridiculous behavior, as is the story, also not a rumor, of the firefighters who would not board a Miami-Dade firetruck with the American Flag on it. They refused to board when a call came in until it was removed. It was removed in order to get them to get to the fire, and handled a few days later from [Miami Herald](http://www.miami.com/herald/special/news/worldtrade/digdocs/062830.htm): > [@](#): > > Miami-Dade firefighters Jim Moore and Terry Williams objected Saturday to climbing aboard a fire truck that sported a large American flag. The two are not Muslims, as had been widely reported. Their objections have more to do with seeing the flag as a symbol of oppression. > `When asked as to why the American flag was taken off the truck, Moore responded by saying that the flag was offensive to him,'' their supervisor, Lt. Michael Simon, wrote in a memo about the incident. `Williams agreed. Moore stated that the flag was a symbol of oppression to the black man.’’ > Williams wrote in a statement that the incident had been blown out of proportion. He wrote that he and Moore removed the flag because it blocked their view and because of their `political view about the country's situation.'' Steinfatt said that's not an uncommon reaction. `Black Americans perceive a lot of areas of discrimination that are not evident to whites,’’ he said. `To some, the flag represents white America, not all of America.'' MANDATORY DISPLAY Nevertheless, in response to the incident, Fire Chief Dave Paulison ordered all county fire engines to carry the American flag as a symbol of unity, national pride and patriotism. The American Civil Liberties Union backs the chief's decision, saying that displaying a flag on a fire truck is not the same as forcing a firefighter to recite the Pledge of Allegiance. `While individuals certainly have a First Amendment right to an opinion, it’s hard to say that the display of the American flag on the truck is attributable to every firefighter on the truck,’’ said Randall Marshall, legal director for the American Civil Liberties Union of Florida. ---
**Author:** ![SouthernStyle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b3f665/32.png) [@SouthernStyle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SouthernStyle)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2001, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/17 "2001-09-20T20:23:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RTFirefly \* > If it’s simply a matter of some union being snooty about its prerogatives, then of course it’s wrong. Agreed. Several people that I know claim to have also seen the interview so I beileve that _something_ transpired. Regardless of the outcome, the man’s motivation, or the union’s alleged involvement, the problem goes right back to the OP – A story is told without adquate followup which, in turn, is fodder for rumor. ---
**Author:** ![capacitor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@capacitor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capacitor)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2001, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/18 "2001-09-21T02:23:51Z")
Vinnie says: Small midwest town Local gas station raises prices $5 gallon Mayor is called Mayor sends sherrif, who cites gas station owner for “price gouging”, which I’m not even sure a local official can do! I say: There is a mayor on record who, in a speech, tells the gas stations not to gouge customers. They should listen to him, for he is Rudolph Guliani. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2001, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/official-sdmb-wtc-rumor-killer-thread/82583/19 "2001-09-22T22:48:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SouthernStyle \* > Regardless of the outcome, the man’s motivation, or the union’s alleged involvement, the problem goes right back to the OP – A story is told without adquate followup which, in turn, is fodder for rumor. I couldn’t agree more, **SouthernStyle**.