# Oh PLEASE with the fucking T.S.A. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 22, 2008, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671 "2008-09-22T13:56:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![vix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a88e4f/32.png) [@vix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vix)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/61 "2008-09-23T01:30:23Z")
> [@TroubleAgain](#): > > …am I the only one who finds it not to be such a grossly difficult thing to get through security expeditiously?😕 Nope. I’m with you, and I fly more often. While I agree that the TSA regulations (not to mention staff) are not especially helpful and are annoying, they aren’t THAT tough to master. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/62 "2008-09-23T01:44:38Z")
> [@sailor](#): > > I recently saw a funny scene in Frankfurt where a security guard was going through the handbag of a woman and pulled out a cucumber and was holding it in his hand and demanding an explanation. I could not understand what was being said and was trying to not be obvious about my interest but the exchange went on for a while and I finally had to leave the area. I have no idea if she was allowed to keep the cucumber or if it was deemed to be too dangerous. All that tells me is you are still a perv. 😉 > [@](#): > > America has lost billions in foreign tourism due to all this crap and this when the world has experienced a huge tourism boom AND when the dollar was so low it was worth crossing an ocean just to do your grocery shopping. No doubt – cites provided upon request. > [@](#): > > Since all this crap began I have avoided traveling to the US like the plague. When I have no other choice I fly non-American carriers. You and me both. 'cept I have little to choice when traveling out of the Dom Rep. > [@](#): > > If you think you have it bad, you have no idea what us foreigners have to endure. I have never been as mistreated and abused as I have by the American immigration authorities. Amen. Don’t forget we also have to sign a form in which we say we give up all rights s afforded us by out own Governments. :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > Recently a friend traveling on a diplomatic passport was also quite abused. They were telling her they thought it was a counterfeit passport etc. That is what happens when you have $5/hr employees questioning diplomats and CEOs. Bad as I am, I would have loved to see them try that on my brother (whom you met). Right-wing EU diplomat fuck that he is, he gets the red carpet treatment all the time. Fuckerrrrrr… Apparently that he is also a Spaniard is no big deal. > [@](#): > > When I am confronted by an asshole I mostly become passive-aggressive. I am in NO hurry. I would rather go s-l-o-w-l-y and keep my head than lose my temper. Regarding those behind me, I do not care. They are mostly Americans who could change this shit if they wanted. I have no say. If enough Americans complained things would change. You’re right. And so far I’ve kept my head about me – but yeah, I am also pissed off at Americans let it get this way. * * * Good to have you back, brainiac. More than likely we’ll be strolling up Joaquin Costa in December…with you teaching me about…well, everything. But seriously, can we skip Cuatro Caminos’ bodegas this time around? Promise you I won’t invite you to the Bernabeu in return. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/63 "2008-09-23T01:57:42Z")
My worst was when we were flying with our then 2 year old daughter from Boston Logan to France. My wife gets picked out for extra screening at an alarming rate every time we fly. She is half Italian with olive skin, dark hair, petite, and always well-dressed. This translates to terrorist to elementary school drop-outs for some reason. Once again, she got picked out for special screening. Right as she was done, my two year old daughter ran right through the detectors yelling “Mommy, Mommy!” and hugging her. Uh, oh. Time to break out the gloves. They both got pulled into the extra special screening area for that indiscretion. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/64 "2008-09-23T02:08:29Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > No doubt – cites provided upon request. I’d love to see some. I don’t know why some people seem to lose their luggage. I’ve taken over a hundred flights in the last two years and only lost three pieces of luggage (and two were on one trip and that was on a tight layover). ---
**Author:** ![atomicbadgerrace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e7dd6/32.png) [@atomicbadgerrace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/atomicbadgerrace)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/65 "2008-09-23T02:25:25Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > I’d love to see some. > > I don’t know why some people seem to lose their luggage. I’ve taken over a hundred flights in the last two years and only lost three pieces of luggage (and two were on one trip and that was on a tight layover). I agree. [In June 2008, at least, you had about a .515% of your baggage being mishandled](http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/reports/2008/august/200808atcr.pdf) (which could mean anything from a broken handle to a one hour delay to a multi-day delay to outright lost), yet it seems to have happened to just about everyone on the SDMB. Funny, that. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/66 "2008-09-23T02:27:43Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > I’d love to see some. Worldwide tourism and travel have been booming in the last few years but America’s tourist industry has not recovered since 9/11 and that is in spite of the falling value of the dollar. > [@](#): > > [http://www.gamingindustrywire.com/article26834.html](http://www.gamingindustrywire.com/article26834.html) > > New Figures from Dept. of Commerce Show Continued Decline in Overseas Travel to U.S. > > Figures just released from the U.S. Department of Commerce show that far from enjoying a ‘full recovery,’ **America’s travel economy continues to lose millions of overseas visitors, costing America billions in revenue and preventing the U.S. from utilizing its greatest public diplomacy tool. We have lost nearly 60 million international travelers since 9/11 and the problem is only getting worse** ,’ said Geoff Freeman, Executive Director of the Discover America Partnership, a coalition of American business leaders working to strengthen America through the power of travel. 'As \travel around the world skyrockets, the U.S. is mired in a slump\. > . . . > U.S. Department of Commerce figures reveal that overseas travel to the U.S. remains below pre-9/11 levels in six of the top eight overseas markets. Travel to the U.S. in 2006 fell further in five out of the top eight overseas markets. **A 2006 survey of overseas travelers conducted by the Discover America Partnership found negative perceptions of the U.S. entry process to be the greatest deterrent to visiting the country.** > [@](#): > > [http://www.poweroftravel.org/release-11-20-06.aspx](http://www.poweroftravel.org/release-11-20-06.aspx) > > **Study: Perceived Treatment of Foreign Travelers Driving Away Visitors, Damaging America’s Image Abroad** > > -Travelers rate America’s entry process as the “world’s worst” by greater than a 2:1 margin over the next-worst destination area. > > - The U.S. ranks with Africa and the Middle East when it comes to traveler-friendly paperwork and officials. > - 54 percent of international travelers say that immigration officials are rude. > - **Travelers to the U.S. are more afraid of U.S. government officials than the threat of terrorism or crime**. > - Two-thirds of travelers surveyed fear they will be detained at the border because of a simple mistake or misstatement. > [@](#): > > [http://youtube.com/watch?v=gAfHZcuXTxo](http://youtube.com/watch?v=gAfHZcuXTxo) > > - 130 billion dollars lost > - 2 million tourists less per year since 9/11 – (and that’s a low estimate. As you can see from the prior article the figures are much higher ) > - most of those asked blame immigration/security checks/visa hassles ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/67 "2008-09-23T02:27:48Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > I’d love to see some. > > I don’t know why some people seem to lose their luggage. I’ve taken over a hundred flights in the last two years and only lost three pieces of luggage (and two were on one trip and that was on a tight layover). I don’t know what you mean by “lose your luggage” but I think I am on a track for a record. Mine have been lost permanently 7 times in the past 16 years and temporally about 10 times (about 30 if you count all family members and bags involved). The only pattern I can discern is that we often run for flights way faster than the bags can make it. I often book complicated itineraries between multiple airlines as well. Virtually every time we fly time the Virgin Islands, some bags are lost. We have received partial baggage by courier 80 miles away on Christmas day three years in a row. They have also lost all of our Christmas presents coming back home on two separate occasions. I know the claim forms like the back of my hand and how to get actual money back from such a claim. If the airlines ran wet dreams then we would all get hit all the back of the head hard right before the finale. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/68 "2008-09-23T02:37:21Z")
You think having your luggage lost is a big deal? A few years ago my luggage was lost when I arrived in Hong Kong AND the next day all my money, credit cards, everything was stolen AND it was Chinese new year and there was no way to get replacements for about ten days. That was something I hope never happens to me again. My only consolation is that it was Alitalia and I have been continuously watching them on the brink of bankruptcy and now finally it looks like they’re going over the edge. Good riddance to one of the worst airlines I have ever flown. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/69 "2008-09-23T02:56:34Z")
But wait, there’s more: > [@](#): > > [http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/01/AR2008080103030.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/01/AR2008080103030.html) > > Federal agents may take a traveler’s laptop computer or other electronic device to an off-site location for an unspecified period of time without any suspicion of wrongdoing, as part of border search policies the Department of Homeland Security recently disclosed. > … > Civil liberties and business travel groups have pressed the government to disclose its procedures as an increasing number of international travelers have reported that their laptops, cellphones and other digital devices had been taken – for months, in at least one case – and their contents examined. > [@](#): > > [The Seattle Times | Local news, sports, business, politics, entertainment, travel, restaurants and opinion for Seattle and the Pacific Northwest.](http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2008067440_searches23m0.html) > > Diverse groups, including Muslim associations, law firms and corporate and technology organizations, increasingly are concerned about the search and seizure of laptops and other electronic devices at borders, saying such scrutiny raises privacy issues and could compromise lawyer-client privilege and corporate confidentiality. > [@](#): > > [http://chronicle.com/news/article/1826/canadian-student-detained-by-us-border-officials-who-confiscate-his-laptop](http://chronicle.com/news/article/1826/canadian-student-detained-by-us-border-officials-who-confiscate-his-laptop) > > Canadian Student Detained by U.S. Border Officials, Who Confiscate His Laptop > > A Canadian student says he might lose credit for this academic year after American officials confiscated his laptop computer, which contained all his work, when he attempted to enter the United States last week, according to The Chronicle Journal, a newspaper in Thunder Bay, Ontario. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/70 "2008-09-23T04:12:54Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > I’d love to see some. No problem. Note, however, that my offer for a cite wasn’t about lost luggage but rather about the whole tourist business: [**Entry to U.S. scares away tourism, business**](http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/11/29/entry-to-us-scares-away-tourism-business/) Plenty more I can offer if that one isn’t up to your standards. ---
**Author:** ![eenerms](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/cdc98d/32.png) [@eenerms](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eenerms)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/71 "2008-09-23T04:22:22Z")
You want to talk about extra screening?? Have Arabic on your passport!:eek: ---
**Author:** ![Ale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Ale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ale)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/72 "2008-09-23T05:03:03Z")
> [@sailor](#): > > You think having your luggage lost is a big deal? A few years ago my luggage was lost when I arrived in Hong Kong AND the next day all my money, credit cards, everything was stolen AND it was Chinese new year and there was no way to get replacements for about ten days. That was something I hope never happens to me again. Misplaced luggage, pfft!.. an airline sent _me_ to the wrong country once. 😉 No, really, they did. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/73 "2008-09-23T05:58:16Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > You and me both. 'cept I have little to choice when traveling out of the Dom Rep. Can’t you connect through Canada, Cuba or Mexico? > [@RedFury](#): > > Don’t forget we also have to sign a form in which we say we give up all rights s afforded us by out own Governments. Say _what_? Are you serious? How could that be even enforceable? I mean, I could see the customs and immigration authorities of one country preventing access by another country’s consular staff, but I don’t think it’s considered binding to give up a right under duress, even if you sign something to that effect. :eek: _sigh_ After all the hassle my friends have had at the border these past few years, I generally do not recommend connecting through the States. Problem is, there aren’t that many ways to go from Canada to Australia without going through Hawaii… unless you want to go the long way through Europe and Asia. ---
**Author:** ![Av8trix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/90db22/32.png) [@Av8trix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Av8trix)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/74 "2008-09-23T06:56:41Z")
Here’s a good shirt for the whole process. [http://t-shirts.cafepress.com/item/kip-hawley-is-an-idiot-ringer-t/78129971](http://t-shirts.cafepress.com/item/kip-hawley-is-an-idiot-ringer-t/78129971) I’m a pilot for an airline, and I’m a bit miffed that TSA employees don’t have to go through screening, while pilots still do. Last month, while passing through security on the way to the airplane I was due to fly, a screener was giving one of my bags extra-close scrutiny. Back and forth through the xray machine it went, her eyes narrowing in concentration. I watched for a moment, then feeling a little snarky, I smiled and said “well, if it helps, I _do_ intend to get done here and go take control of an aircraft” She still pulled my bag out and investigated my mini-stapler, for what it’s worth. heh. It really is security theater. I really don’t think you’re significantly more secure due to TSA’s efforts than we were years ago. Without going into specifics, I can tell you that at least at the very large airport I work from, it would be child’s play for a dishonest employee to bring bad things onto the property and into contact with aircraft. There are just too many weak spots in the system. -A- ---
**Author:** ![Noone\_Special](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/noone_special/32/2863_2.png) [@Noone\_Special](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noone_Special)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/75 "2008-09-23T07:55:57Z")
> [@Kyla](#): > > First of all, I trust the Israeli airport security about a bajillion times more than the TSA. _But_, to imply that they are somehow less invasive (which is how I’m reading this) is completely wrong. The TSA has never questioned me about what languages I speak, my religious observance, or my family history, like the Israeli airport people. They have never accosted my travelling companions, asking them what I am doing in the country. > > I tried to take this stuff in stride because I know why they do it and it’s not personal (except in that I am blond, which apparently makes me extra-suspicious), but it was pretty damned humiliating, far more so than anything the TSA does. > > Of course, Israeli citizens aren’t subject to the third-degree that foreigners are. And I guess I’m lucky because it never took me more than fifteen minutes to get through the little interrogation. One (non-Jewish; ironically, she was planning on converting Orthodox and was one of the most observant people I knew) girl I knew told me that the shortest interview she’d had with the Israeli Inquisition was 45 minutes. > > Americans would freak the fuck out if the TSA started behaving like the airport security at Ben-Gurion. We’d probably be safer, but I can’t see Americans putting up with that for very long. While I’m not belittling what you went through, and yes there are plenty of power-tripping a\*\*holes in Israeli security too, I think you’re seeing \*American \*security the way I am seeing \*Israeli \*-- through the eyes of a Citizen. Read several posts upthread by non-Americans ( **RedFury** ’s posts come to mind, but others’ as well) and you will notice they have the same (valid) complaints against TSA as you (validly) have against Israeli security. I guess xenophobia isn’t limited to any particular nationality… :rolleyes: ☹ What I still **am** saying, however, is that Israeli security, while it may sometimes be invasive towards certain individuals or even certain classes of people (just as the TSA is,) doesn’t engage, in addition, in the empty yet disruptinve theater antics TSA pulls on **everyone** flying within and out of the US. ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/76 "2008-09-23T09:42:24Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Good to have you back, brainiac. Thanks man. It’s good to be back. I thought nobody had noticed me. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 10:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/77 "2008-09-23T10:03:37Z")
> [@Noone\_Special](#): > > I’d just like to point out that the only airport in the Western World (that I am aware of) where you can _still_ tote your brought-from-home liter-and-a-half water bottle from the ticketing agents right through security and on to the plane is Ben Gurion airport… > > Oh, and you can keep your shoes on, too. And your belt, unless you actually **trip** the metal detector with it. > > Make of it what you will… :dubious: Yeah, in Bilbao you can go in with your Cocacola bottle (unopened, as checked by the cop - who is an actual cop and not a rentacop), a homemade sandwhich of buttered baguette and salami wrapped in aluminum foil… guess the Guardia Civil and your own folks don’t know enough about security 😛 On the other hand, don’t try the above in Atocha for long distance trains. You can go on the short-distance trains with anything that doesn’t try to walk away on its own, but don’t try it on the long distance trains. The people manning the security arches in Atocha are not Guardia Civil and do not like aluminum-wrapped sandwiches. ---
**Author:** ![UnwrittenNocturne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/6de8d8/32.png) [@UnwrittenNocturne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UnwrittenNocturne)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/78 "2008-09-23T10:06:47Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Pardon my French, but I’ve had it up to here being “felt-up” by whatever a-hole is in charge. Guess my biggest fuck-up (which McCain, in his clueless way confirmed) is that I am Spanish and so I _have_ to have my testicles felt-up by some huge guy while the "puff machine’ allows some other a-hole to tear brand new Nike sneakers in search for _explosives_. No doubt that I was flying in from Madrid played a part . > > Fuck it. I’ll have my son come to see me instead. After all why should I spend any more money in a country that treats me like shit… I feel your pain. On my arrival in the U.S. I went through this shit. Along with every guy travelling alone on the flight. After all, I’d flown in from that well-known terrorist hotspot – Australia. I won’t fly in the U.S. Period. I take the time to drive instead. I can carry what I want, dress how I please and even take my own water! If the T.S.A. arseholes are allowed to continue much longer you’ll need to fly naked, with no carry-on or checked luggage (which will be priced out of reach anyway). Any body cavities will need to be permanently spread wide open so they can check to see you’re not smuggling water onboard. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 10:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/79 "2008-09-23T10:16:18Z")
[quote=“TroubleAgain, post:57, topic:464671”] [li]Laptop out of case, and in a tub on its own[/li][/QUOTE] I’ve been ordered to put the laptop back in its carrier (which takes about one minute) because “nobody has told you to take it out!” > [@Sunspace](#): > > Say what? Are you serious? How could that be even enforceable? I mean, I could see the customs and immigration authorities of one country preventing access by another country’s consular staff, but I don’t think it’s considered binding to give up a right under duress, even if you sign something to that effect. Under current rules, an US Customs Officer can put a foreigner into a plane back to point of origin without any calls to anybody, no explanation except “you’re not acceptable.” And that famous line of “I won’t commit any crime” in the form you have to fill in has gotten people expelled for things like being in the same car where an US citizen had a beer (the guy expelled was 17yo and didn’t even know it was illegal for the 20yo to have a beer). Power trips in both cases, but hot damn. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Badger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/848f3c/32.png) [@Dead\_Badger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Badger)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2008, 10:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671/80 "2008-09-23T10:59:57Z")
> [@atomicbadgerrace](#): > > I agree. [In June 2008, at least, you had about a .515% of your baggage being mishandled](http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/reports/2008/august/200808atcr.pdf) (which could mean anything from a broken handle to a one hour delay to a multi-day delay to outright lost), yet it seems to have happened to just about everyone on the SDMB. Funny, that. Not really; these threads are a classic self-selecting sample. It’s entirely normal that precisely those people who have lost baggage will be the ones contributing to threads about shitty travel experiences. I’ve never had anything go missing either, but it doesn’t mean those complaining have made it up. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oh-please-with-the-fucking-t-s-a/464671.md?page=5)