# Oil Doesn't Come From Dinos, It Comes From Fungus **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [November 7, 2008, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613 "2008-11-07T09:33:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/1 "2008-11-07T09:33:22Z")
[Fungus make oil.](http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20081104/sc_livescience/oilcreationtheorychallengedbyfuelmakingfungus) > [@](#): > > A newfound fungus living in rainforest trees makes biofuel more efficiently than any other known method, researchers say. > In fact, it’s so good at turning plant matter into fuel that researchers say their discovery calls into question the whole theory of how crude oil was made by nature in the first place. > [@](#): > > “This is the only organism that has ever been shown to produce such an important combination of fuel substances,” said researcher Gary Strobel from Montana State University. “The fungus can even make these diesel compounds from cellulose, which would make it a better source of biofuel than anything we use at the moment.” > The scientists are now working to develop its fuel producing potential, according to a paper published in the November issue of the journal Microbiology. Brings a whole new meaning to the phrase “magic mushrooms.” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![KGS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/90ced4/32.png) [@KGS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KGS)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/2 "2008-11-07T15:42:24Z")
Next time I go to Jiffy Lube, I’ll be sure to ask for a Fungus Change. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/3 "2008-11-07T15:46:09Z")
So there’s a great big humungous fungus among-us? 🙂 I hope this works out–it could change the whole EROEI of cellulosic fuel production in the mid-latitudes. Unless the fungus _only_ grows in the tropical rainforest, in which case the Brazilians will still beat the pants off everyone for bio-based fuel. ---
**Author:** ![Flander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8c91f0/32.png) [@Flander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flander)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/4 "2008-11-07T16:12:58Z")
Wow. That’s very interesting. Could certainly solve a few problems. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/5 "2008-11-07T16:13:14Z")
I thought that they tell us that oil came from plant matter, not dinosaurs. It probably comes from both plants and fungus. ---
**Author:** ![Nanoda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce73a5/32.png) [@Nanoda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanoda)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/6 "2008-11-07T16:43:28Z")
That’d be awesome; bug wash in the front, a few shovelfuls of manure in the back, make sure to park in a warm damp place… I see some problems in winter up here though. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/7 "2008-11-07T16:46:27Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > So there’s a great big humungous fungus among-us? 🙂 > > I hope this works out–it could change the whole EROEI of cellulosic fuel production in the mid-latitudes. Unless the fungus _only_ grows in the tropical rainforest, in which case the Brazilians will still beat the pants off everyone for bio-based fuel. The patagonia is not precisely tropical and is not in Brazil… ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/8 "2008-11-07T16:47:00Z")
> [@KGS](#): > > Next time I go to Jiffy Lube, I’ll be sure to ask for a Fungus Change. 🆒 Fill 'er up with chanterels. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/9 "2008-11-07T17:19:52Z")
> [@Frodo](#): > > The patagonia is not precisely tropical and is not in Brazil… Knew I should have read the article. That’s even better news. ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/10 "2008-11-07T17:20:03Z")
Better tell all those fungus haters in the pit about this. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/11 "2008-11-07T17:40:56Z")
> [@Wile\_E](#): > > Better tell all those fungus haters in the pit about this. I think they’d be more than happy to sacrifice all of their mushrooms to solve the energy crisis. ---
**Author:** ![Euthanasiast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Euthanasiast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euthanasiast)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/12 "2008-11-07T23:48:14Z")
I doubt you could manufacture enough of it to meet the current demand in this country, let alone the world. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2008, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/13 "2008-11-07T23:52:05Z")
Dunno - it sounds pretty promising - particularly as it doesn’t have to compete with food production. ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2008, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/14 "2008-11-08T00:30:19Z")
I think I can confidently predict that the fuel crisis will not be solved by a miracle fungus. It seems like every few years there’s some amazing discovery in the rain forest along these lines, and then we never hear about it again. A while back it was some “gasoline tree” which supposedly produced a secretion that could power an engine without any refinement-- can’t remember where I read about that one. If one were of a suspicious mind, one might begin to suspect that the oil companies are swooping in and buying everything up, and torching the rain forests to hide the evidence. Alternately, one might hypothesize that there aren’t any naturally occurring miracle oil plants in the first place, since the rain forests aren’t generally known for exploding when set on fire. I’d think that a fungus that secretes diesel or ethanol in any appreciable quantities would create a notably volatile environment after awhile, and sooner or later some anthropologist would think to investigate the native stories of “Smelly-land-that-goes-FOOM.” ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2008, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/15 "2008-11-08T00:44:02Z")
Neat. I hope the research continues to go favorably. We’re already using fungus and microbes quite successfully for [bioremediation](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bioremediation) in cases of oil spills and other contaminants. Mushroom love! ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2008, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/16 "2008-11-08T00:55:48Z")
> [@Euthanasiast](#): > > I doubt you could manufacture enough of it to meet the current demand in this country, let alone the world. Neither will increased drilling the US, but that doesn’t stop people from jumping on _that_ particular bandwagon. Unlike increased drilling, however, this, combined with other technologies offers us a _diversity_ of energy sources, which is important if we’re going keep prices low. > [@Terrifel](#): > > I think I can confidently predict that the fuel crisis will not be solved by a miracle fungus. Agreed, but it will certainly help towrads tht goal. > [@](#): > > It seems like every few years there’s some amazing discovery in the rain forest along these lines, and then we never hear about it again. A while back it was some “gasoline tree” which supposedly produced a secretion that could power an engine without any refinement-- can’t remember where I read about that one. [Close, but not quite right.](http://www.nsf.gov/news/news_summ.jsp?cntn_id=111392) > [@](#): > > Researchers have made a breakthrough in the development of “green gasoline,” a liquid identical to standard gasoline yet created from sustainable biomass sources like switchgrass and poplar trees. > > Reporting in the cover article of the April 7, 2008 issue of Chemistry & Sustainability, Energy & Materials (ChemSusChem), chemical engineer and National Science Foundation (NSF) CAREER awardee George Huber of the University of Massachusetts-Amherst (UMass) and his graduate students Torren Carlson and Tushar Vispute announced the first direct conversion of plant cellulose into gasoline components. > > In the same issue, James Dumesic and colleagues from the University of Wisconsin-Madison announce an integrated process for creating chemical components of jet fuel using a green gasoline approach. While Dumesic’s group had previously demonstrated the production of jet-fuel components using separate steps, their current work shows that the steps can be integrated and run sequentially, without complex separation and purification processes between reactors. Note that the article is dated April of **this** year, and that it estimates that it will be at least 5 - 10 years before it will see large scale production (probably longer with energy prices dropping). > [@](#): > > If one were of a suspicious mind, one might begin to suspect that the oil companies are swooping in and buying everything up, and torching the rain forests to hide the evidence. Unlikely in either of these cases as they were made by **government** run organizations, so much of the information **must** be made public and **cannot** be kept secret. If Big Oil _were_ to attempt to keep a lock on it, they would not be able to do so for very long. > [@](#): > > Alternately, one might hypothesize that there aren’t any naturally occurring miracle oil plants in the first place, since the rain forests aren’t generally known for exploding when set on fire. I’d think that a fungus that secretes diesel or ethanol in any appreciable quantities would create a notably volatile environment after awhile, and sooner or later some anthropologist would think to investigate the native stories of “Smelly-land-that-goes-FOOM.” Didja notice that its a rather **rare** fungus? In a gawdforsaken part of the world? New species of animal and plant life are _constantly_ being discovered, even in places like the US and England. Additionally, it presently produces these compounds in very small amounts. So you wouldn’t necessarily have it churning out an oil slick in a day. Of course, all the plants we use for food crops didn’t produce fruit/vegetables in the same shape they do today, when they were first discovered. Selective breeding (and genetic engineering in recent years) have caused them to take the form we use. [NSF story about the fungus.](http://www.nsf.gov/news/news_summ.jsp?cntn_id=112581&org=ENG&from=home) Apparently, the strain discovered makes _rocket_ fuel! 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2008, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/17 "2008-11-08T01:22:55Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > [Close, but not quite right.](http://www.nsf.gov/news/news_summ.jsp?cntn_id=111392)Note that the article is dated April of **this** year, and that it estimates that it will be at least 5 - 10 years before it will see large scale production (probably longer with energy prices dropping). Nah, this was some years back, and it was definitely a rain forest tree. The article made a big deal about how the plant could be cut open and a decent volume of fuel could be poured out directly. It was extremely goofy and implausible-sounding, and I’m pretty sure I read it in **Discover** or \*\*New Scientist \*\*or one of those nearly-science mags. Or it might have been one of the Rolex Award winners. Which reminds me… **Hey Rolex: Where’s my genetically engineered glow-in-the-dark Christmas tree?** It’s been… what, 15, 20 years?! Bastards… > [@](#): > > Didja notice that its a rather **rare** fungus? In a gawdforsaken part of the world? New species of animal and plant life are _constantly_ being discovered, even in places like the US and England. Additionally, it presently produces these compounds in very small amounts. So you wouldn’t necessarily have it churning out an oil slick in a day. Of course, all the plants we use for food crops didn’t produce fruit/vegetables in the same shape they do today, when they were first discovered. Selective breeding (and genetic engineering in recent years) have caused them to take the form we use. Well yeah, but this is supposed to be diesel fuel. It’s hugely energy-rich. It makes no sense for the fungus to be making it in any appreciable quantities if it’s not necessary for something. And other fungi seem to get along just fine without that mechanism. Ergo, it’s an unexpected molecular product that probably can’t be produced in excess for any significant commercial use. Hell, I produce methane \*all the time. \*And nobody considers me as a potential solution to the global energy crunch. > [@](#): > > [NSF story about the fungus.](http://www.nsf.gov/news/news_summ.jsp?cntn_id=112581&org=ENG&from=home) Apparently, the strain discovered makes _rocket_ fuel! 🆒 > [@](#): > > “Time will tell if this microbe can be developed for useful purposes for mankind,” said Strobel. So… what time is it now? About 8:22 PM? Okay… “No.” In the future, when the world is powered by miracle fungus gas, you have my total permission to remind me about this thread and laugh at me. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2008, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/18 "2008-11-08T01:34:03Z")
> [@Terrifel](#): > > Well yeah, but this is supposed to be diesel fuel. It’s hugely energy-rich. It makes no sense for the fungus to be making it in any appreciable quantities if it’s not necessary for something. And other fungi seem to get along just fine without that mechanism. Ergo, it’s an unexpected molecular product that probably can’t be produced in excess for any significant commercial use. That doesn’t make much sense to me. Other examples of vertebrates get along fine without legs, but mine are not an unexpected product. It’s not impossible to imagine that this fungus makes oily stuff for some purpose beneficial to itself. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2008, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/19 "2008-11-08T01:43:27Z")
> [@Terrifel](#): > > Nah, this was some years back, and it was definitely a rain forest tree. The article made a big deal about how the plant could be cut open and a decent volume of fuel could be poured out directly. It was extremely goofy and implausible-sounding, and I’m pretty sure I read it in **Discover** or \*\*New Scientist \*\*or one of those nearly-science mags. Or it might have been one of the Rolex Award winners. “Pretty sure?” You do know that _Discover_, at least, has the habit of running gag articles in their April issues, don’t you? > [@](#): > > Which reminds me… **Hey Rolex: Where’s my genetically engineered glow-in-the-dark Christmas tree?** It’s been… what, 15, 20 years?! Bastards… I imagine that they’re waiting for the market to consist of more than just you and the guy who invented it. > [@](#): > > Well yeah, but this is supposed to be diesel fuel. It’s hugely energy-rich. It makes no sense for the fungus to be making it in any appreciable quantities if it’s not necessary for something. And other fungi seem to get along just fine without that mechanism. Ergo, it’s an unexpected molecular product that probably can’t be produced in excess for any significant commercial use. One could have the same thing about [this plant](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maize#Origin), some several thousands of years ago. Now, however, it is one of the largest staple crops in the world. Additionally, our ability to sequence DNA and do genetic engineering means that we can take advantage of the genes which are responsible for the production of the hydrocarbons and splice them into different organisms. > [@](#): > > Hell, I produce methane \*all the time. \*And nobody considers me as a potential solution to the global energy crunch. Probably because you’d strenuously object to having a tube shoved up your ass for long periods of time. (Though, I should point out that people are looking at the bacteria in our guts for ways to do commerical production of methane, and many farms are using human and animal waste to generate methane.) > [@](#): > > So… what time is it now? About 8:22 PM? Okay… > > “No.” > In the future, when the world is powered by miracle fungus gas, you have my total permission to remind me about this thread and laugh at me. Will you be willing to admit you’re wrong if its _not_ the fungus, but another organism, using genes from this fungus spliced into it? (And you’ll note that I specifically stated above that I **didn’t** think that this would be our **sole** source for energy.) ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2008, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613/20 "2008-11-08T01:47:42Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > That doesn’t make much sense to me. Other examples of vertebrates get along fine without legs, but mine are not an unexpected product. It’s not impossible to imagine that this fungus makes oily stuff for some purpose beneficial to itself. No, it’s not impossible to imagine… but what would the purpose be? Other fungi do fine in Patagonia. Why does this variety need to generate rocket fuel components? It seems like a lot of work, unless it’s a very small amount. Diesel is kind of a pain to make. Your legs have a clear use, and lots of land animals have them. If they are not needed, as with a crawling or swimming lifestyle, they tend to go away. Some animals have very long legs, like giraffes. But trying to get a fungus to make enough fuel for your rocket is probably something like trying to build a skyscraper out of giraffes. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oil-doesnt-come-from-dinos-it-comes-from-fungus/471613.md?page=2)