# OK, Beeyotches, You've Made Up My Mind For Me **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 4, 2008, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002 "2008-09-04T15:47:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/161 "2008-09-04T19:41:56Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > As much as I admire your passion on this, the quoted bit is as hard to swallow as **Weirddave** ’s claim of being a moderate. It’s the truth. Neither of the two major parties represent me. And frankly, both of them are just massive money machines, devoted mostly to staying in office. Republicans are too prone to dismiss any legitimate role for government, or seek power over things that are none of government’s business. Democrats are too prone to voting ambitious, expensive programs that might work but which discount the people who have to pay for them. I’m a pretty rigorous fiscal conservative. I also have rather strong libertarian leanings when it comes to keeping government out of the lives of citizens. I’m a diehard about censorship and privacy. _Some_ social welfare programs I support because we’re not a level playing field. To me, it makes moral and financial sense to help people succeed rather than marginalize them. Angry, hopeless people don’t benefit anyone, themselves, their families or society at large. So…mixed bag. And one who’s been deprived of genuinely conservative options for a hell of a long time. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/162 "2008-09-04T19:55:52Z")
> [@A\_shameful\_cracka](#): > > That’s what I was asking myself the other night when they had the governor of Hawaii talking about how great Palin is. Here is a Republican governor of a state who has been in office much longer than Palin, runs a much more populous state, was mayor of Maui prior to being governor, and was the first Republican governor in the history of her state, a traditionally Democratic stronghold. Oh yeah, and she’s a woman too. Why was she passed over? Same reason he dissed Olympia Snowe and Kay Bailey Hutchison; not Anti-Choice. > [@](#): > > . . . Governor Lingle is a member of The Wish List which is America’s largest fundraising and campaign political action committee for Pro-choice Republican Women and The Republican Majority For Choice. > > [Linda Lingle - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linda_Lingle) ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/163 "2008-09-04T20:07:40Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > > [@Robot Arm](#): > > > > So, you want integrity. You want positive campaigning. You want to focus on issues and end personal attacks. > > > > And you want someone else to do it first. > > Yeah, it sounds pretty stupid when you say it like that. > > I would have LOVED to have the GOP come up with someone willing to run that campaign. The issues I agreed with, AND the integrity of a clean campaign to boot? Fuggedditabout it! I’d have been quitting my job to go WORK for that campaign. > > But… that didn’t happen. > > And it won’t. Because, as has been clearly demonstrated, it cannot. We’re past that. My boys can’t do it; negative campaign tactics are page one of the GOP playbook. And now we learn that even if the one-in-a-million Dem (and make no mistake: Obama is one-in-a-million) does it, no one will care enough to emulate it. So it’s not really fair to say you want “someone else to do it first” now is it? What you really want is for EVERYONE else to do it first. I’m in the camp with **John Mace**. I agree politically with John McCain more than Obama. The main swing issues for me are the Iraq war and the budget/deficit. One swings towards Obama and one swings towards McCain. But there’s a third issue, which is this Obama phenomenon. Record numbers of new registered voters. Record turnouts in primaries. Getting Generation Y “Why Bother?” engaged. The US’s standing amongst the International community and how a McCain Presidency would affect it versus an Obama Presidency. These are not insignificant concerns, and I’m still deciding if I’m willing to suborn my own best judgment in order to encourage this movement. I think it could be worth it, but I owe it to my country and the principles it is founded on to give due consideration to all the issues. The reaction to McCain’s VP pick has been vocal, and mainly disappointing, especially with the personal angles to many of the attacks. Obama hasn’t been able to quell those personal attacks, although it looks like he’s trying, but it would be ---
**Author:** ![Carl\_Corey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Carl\_Corey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carl_Corey)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/164 "2008-09-04T20:23:41Z")
Would be what? Don’t leave us hanging. ---
**Author:** ![FallenAngel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@FallenAngel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FallenAngel)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/165 "2008-09-04T20:25:45Z")
I saw a statement on another board that really sealed it for me. I’ll summarize the highlights: Obama is just looking for love and validation. He’s not a bad person, but after having been abandoned by his parents, and raised by middle class white people, he had to learn how to act like a member of the minority he physically resembled. He picked Wright’s church because it gave him a sense of inclusion and community, regardless of its racist propoganda and tax evasion. He cooperated with the crooked Daley machine for the same reason. He associated with unapologetic terrorists for the same reason. He associated with crooked developers and slumlords for the same reason: They all included him. It worked for him. He learned the tone and tembre of a gospel preacher. He made connections. He learned how to say the right things in the right way to drum up support. Then someone who has actually worked and accomplished real things takes the podium and you realize Obama is still a small, lost child looking to be loved. Even if the current swell of love and validation lifts him into the Oval Office, his complete inability to do anything while there will carry him out in a tide of failure, and he’ll spend the rest of his life wondering why no one loves him anymore. I was already going to vote against him, but seeing what he’s up against now and how shabby his self-appointed robes really are on close comparison really cemented it for me. ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/166 "2008-09-04T20:30:13Z")
ah hell…we’re doomed now. I’ll text Obama and let him know we lost the the Bricker vote. I only hope he merely quits the race and doesn’t hurt himself. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Badger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/848f3c/32.png) [@Dead\_Badger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Badger)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/167 "2008-09-04T20:34:31Z")
> [@FallenAngel](#): > > **Little Child Lost** Jesus H. Christ, that’s really the level of reasoning you put into your vote? You imagine the candidates as an afternoon telemovie protagonist, and pick the one that’s glurgiest? Fuck post-partisanship, then; someone needs to mount a campaign to explain to certain folk that real life is not the Hallmark Channel. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/168 "2008-09-04T20:34:50Z")
> [@FallenAngel](#): > > I saw a statement on another board that really sealed it for me. I’ll summarize the highlights: > > Obama is just looking for love and validation. He’s not a bad person, but after having been abandoned by his parents, and raised by middle class white people, he had to learn how to act like a member of the minority he physically resembled. He picked Wright’s church because it gave him a sense of inclusion and community, regardless of its racist propoganda and tax evasion. He cooperated with the crooked Daley machine for the same reason. He associated with unapologetic terrorists for the same reason. He associated with crooked developers and slumlords for the same reason: They all included him. > > It worked for him. He learned the tone and tembre of a gospel preacher. He made connections. He learned how to say the right things in the right way to drum up support. > > Then someone who has actually worked and accomplished real things takes the podium and you realize Obama is still a small, lost child looking to be loved. > > Even if the current swell of love and validation lifts him into the Oval Office, his complete inability to do anything while there will carry him out in a tide of failure, and he’ll spend the rest of his life wondering why no one loves him anymore. > > I was already going to vote against him, but seeing what he’s up against now and how shabby his self-appointed robes really are on close comparison really cemented it for me. I’m hoping this is one big Whoosh because this is honestly one of the dumbest things I’ve read here in a while. ---
**Author:** ![Carl\_Corey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Carl\_Corey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carl_Corey)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/169 "2008-09-04T20:35:44Z")
> [@FallenAngel](#): > > I saw a statement on another board that really sealed it for me. I’ll summarize the highlights: > > Obama is just looking for love and validation. He’s not a bad person, but after having been abandoned by his parents, and raised by middle class white people, he had to learn how to act like a member of the minority he physically resembled. He picked Wright’s church because it gave him a sense of inclusion and community, regardless of its racist propoganda and tax evasion. He cooperated with the crooked Daley machine for the same reason. He associated with unapologetic terrorists for the same reason. He associated with crooked developers and slumlords for the same reason: They all included him. > > It worked for him. He learned the tone and tembre of a gospel preacher. He made connections. He learned how to say the right things in the right way to drum up support. > > Then someone who has actually worked and accomplished real things takes the podium and you realize Obama is still a small, lost child looking to be loved. > > Even if the current swell of love and validation lifts him into the Oval Office, his complete inability to do anything while there will carry him out in a tide of failure, and he’ll spend the rest of his life wondering why no one loves him anymore. > > I was already going to vote against him, but seeing what he’s up against now and how shabby his self-appointed robes really are on close comparison really cemented it for me. What a load of horseshit. Thank you, Armchair Psychologist! ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Dave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/46a35a/32.png) [@Great\_Dave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Dave)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/170 "2008-09-04T20:37:27Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Yeah, it sounds pretty stupid when you say it like that. > > I would have LOVED to have the GOP come up with someone willing to run that campaign. The issues I agreed with, AND the integrity of a clean campaign to boot? Fuggedditabout it! I’d have been quitting my job to go WORK for that campaign. > > But… that didn’t happen. > > And it won’t. Because, as has been clearly demonstrated, it cannot. We’re past that. My boys can’t do it; negative campaign tactics are page one of the GOP playbook. And now we learn that even if the one-in-a-million Dem (and make no mistake: Obama is one-in-a-million) does it, **no one will care enough to emulate it.** > > Obama is a great man. None of you pig fuckers understand what he was doing here. I didn’t like any of his positions, and I say that about him. Biden is a run-of-the-mill politico, no better or worse than a dozen others. Obama is a different breed. > > But it really doesn’t matter, because no one else is ready for the one lesson he had that I cared about. didn’t finish thread, so apologies if this was covered The fact that some supporters of Obama have attacked McCain/Palin and used dirty politics does not mean that no one has been inspired to follow Obama’s example, shit for brains. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/171 "2008-09-04T20:37:43Z")
> [@Dead\_Badger](#): > > Jesus H. Christ, that’s really the level of reasoning you put into your vote? You imagine the candidates as an afternoon telemovie protagonist, and pick the one that’s glurgiest? Explains a lot about the last 8 years, doesn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/172 "2008-09-04T20:39:48Z")
I’m genuinely sorry that we lost your vote, but I understand that you have to vote your conscience. However, I am not convinced that we ever had a real chance to get your vote in the first place. In my experience, you can predict who someone will vote for with 100% accuracy if you know enough about them, even if they claim to be undecided. I don’t think you ever actually were undecided, but were looking for a reason to cast a comfortable vote. I’m not going to accept responsibility for giving you that reason, when almost anything would have been excuse enough to convince yourself to vote Republican. Don’t lie to yourself. You know what your political leanings are. You know that you could never contribute to something that validated the people you’re in such conflict with here on the dope. You aren’t voting against Obama, you’re voting against us. I understand that, because I’m not voting against McCain, I’m voting against the racists and/or religious fanatics, people born into privilege, the uneducated, the “love it or leave it” patriots, and the xenophobes. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/173 "2008-09-04T20:40:47Z")
> [@WF\_Tomba](#): > > That’s an interesting stat. I suspect that the difference is only because Obama had a much longer nomination fight. The media like to ride on controversies. The data reviewed started the day after Clinton conceded the nomination and ended on the eve of his foreign trip. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/174 "2008-09-04T20:45:27Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > Additionally, there was a running back for the Bengals in the 80’s named Ickey Woods who was famed for his “Ickey Shuffle” \*\*a lame dance \*\*that he performed on the sidelines, due to prevailing NFL rules about celebration dances. BITE YOUR TONGUE! Ickey was THE MAN! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/175 "2008-09-04T20:47:26Z")
**Bricker** , if you’re still reading this far, I hope you will take a weekend off - maybe not this one but the next one, or the one after - after the initial fuss has died down, then come back and re-evaluate matters with a clearer mind. Indeed, I hope that all voters on all sides will periodically re-evaluate their votes. I have no vote in this election, but Obama seems to be a good man, and it does seem he’ll be a good leader. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/176 "2008-09-04T20:57:41Z")
I’ve given up on the idea that change in the way this country conducts elections is going to happen anytime soon. I, for one, was taking **Bricker** at face value until this point. However, I was believing this because I am, in a way with him. In the same way many of my uncles and aunts were Reagan Democrats, I am an Obama Republican. Like many of the quieter Obama supporters, and many of the moderate Republicans on this board and in real life, I found myself stuck with a tough choice this election at the beginning of the year. It got easier as McCain got closer to Bush (who I see as essentially anti-conservative, judging by his stances on spending, the budget, enemy combatants, and wiretapping) but harder as Obama took on some of those stances as well (wiretapping crap again, more spending but at least he’s proposing taxes to cover it). I’m still not sold–There are things Obama could do to lose my vote, and things McCain could do to get it. I’m not afraid Obama’s going to take away my guns. I’m not particularly offended by the idea of single-payer health insurance, which is the most likely universal health care solution in my opinion. Hell, this is rambling. I’ll stop now–but Bricker, there’s a point where you become a caricature of what you claim to hate–and you passed that point with this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/177 "2008-09-04T20:59:33Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Because Republicans voting Democratic gives the Dems huge stiffies and he knows it. Frankly, I’ve been embarrassed more than once at the attention **Airman Doors** gets because of this. You and me both. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/178 "2008-09-04T21:04:07Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > BITE YOUR TONGUE! > Ickey was THE MAN! > 🙂 As I am a Steeler fan, I would expect to differ on exactly what level of MAN Ickey rose to. I just don’t think anyone could regard the Ickey Shuffle as anything other than full-tard. Quite like the juvenile celebration dance of **ShitBricker**. You all missed me greatly, didn’t you? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/179 "2008-09-04T21:04:11Z")
Let your conscience be your guide, **Bricker**. After I abandoned Jesus on account of the deeds of the Borgia popes, I never looked back. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2008, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002/180 "2008-09-04T21:07:47Z")
> [@Shayna](#): > > > [@A\_shameful\_cracka](#): > > > > That’s what I was asking myself the other night when they had the governor of Hawaii talking about how great Palin is. Here is a Republican governor of a state who has been in office much longer than Palin, runs a much more populous state, was mayor of Maui prior to being governor, and was the first Republican governor in the history of her state, a traditionally Democratic stronghold. Oh yeah, and she’s a woman too. Why was she passed over? > > Same reason he dissed Olympia Snowe and Kay Bailey Hutchison; not Anti-Choice. Plus, she’s been divorced twice, with no children. Does that add up to the right “family values”? Her religion might not help with right-wing Christians either (she’s a Jew). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-beeyotches-youve-made-up-my-mind-for-me/462002.md?page=10)