# Ok, if I shouldn't \_shoot\_ the intruder, then...? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 19, 2009, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060 "2009-01-19T23:15:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Cuckoorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Cuckoorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cuckoorex)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/241 "2009-01-21T03:48:02Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Do I detect an element of doubt? šŸ™‚ No, itā€™s awe. ---
**Author:** ![Jolly\_Roger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/91b2a8/32.png) [@Jolly\_Roger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jolly_Roger)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/242 "2009-01-21T03:48:23Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Not quite right. The ones you have to worry about are the ones who donā€™t give a fuck about making noise even knowing you are in there. If they start heading towards your sleeping quarters, youā€™ve got my permission to blow the shit out of them. Without the tells? Maybe they just want to tuck you in. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/243 "2009-01-21T03:48:24Z")
> [@Cuckoorex](#): > > WHOA You do know I was being a smart ass making that stuff up right? šŸ™‚ Of course I canā€™t tell for sure who the whoa was aimed at. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/244 "2009-01-21T03:50:07Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Do I detect an element of doubt? šŸ™‚ I think its called telleranium. It has an atomic number of 69 times the square root of negative one. ---
**Author:** ![Cuckoorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Cuckoorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cuckoorex)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/245 "2009-01-21T03:51:09Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > You do know I was being a smart ass making that stuff up right? šŸ™‚ > > Of course I canā€™t tell for sure who the whoa was aimed at. Why? Canā€™t you read myā€¦tells? ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/246 "2009-01-21T03:54:00Z")
> [@Cuckoorex](#): > > No, itā€™s awe. Iā€™m assuming you are taking the piss, but although I never pulled off no Oceans Eleven type capers, youā€™d be surprised at some of the shit you have to do to get in some places. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/247 "2009-01-21T03:58:17Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > The main point I was trying to make is that a little home security will usually put off all but the most determined thieves, and youā€™d never have to consider cleaning up blood out of your new sheepskin rug, or possibly having your own spilled. I live in a country where guns are far less easy to get hold of, but if things were different and I was still a burglar, why wouldnā€™t I take a gun, just in case youā€™ve got one? The chances of you surprising me are far less than the other way round, as I am operating on heightened senses, and you have probably just woke up! I think that youā€™re missing a couple of key words there. After ā€œmost determinedā€ you should have ā€œor most mentally messed upā€. While you might have gone about your peaceful burglary while stone cold sober, I know that many burglars have a little something to calm them down or rev them up, depending on what theyā€™ve got available and their personal preference of drugs. I also think, but donā€™t know for sure, that perhaps many burglars might not burgle if theyā€™re stone cold sober. And I have probably not just woken upā€¦Iā€™m a true night owl. Iā€™m just waking up now, when my local time is almost 10 PM. I almost never sleep for more than a couple of hours at a time. For all of my talking, I do most sincerely hope that I never again have to face someone and make a split second decision as to whether Iā€™m going to try to harm him\*. I donā€™t WANT to hurt or kill someone whoā€™s stealing from me. However, I feel itā€™s necessary to think about these things ahead of time, because if the moment does arrive, thereā€™s no time to think. My dad, in one of our self-defense discussions, told me that heā€™d far rather pay for a lawyer than pay for a funeral. Heā€™s a very peaceful guy, and not physical at all, but heā€™d rather have a live daughter who is in trouble with the law than a dead daughter who was a perfect lady and didnā€™t defend herself. \*Twice, Iā€™ve had guys attempt to rape me. Because I was quite a tomboy, I was able to deal out enough damage to get away and get to a safe place. ---
**Author:** ![Cuckoorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Cuckoorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cuckoorex)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/248 "2009-01-21T03:58:42Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Iā€™m assuming you are taking the piss, but although I never pulled off no Oceans Eleven type capers, youā€™d be surprised at some of the shit you have to do to get in some places. Iā€™m sure thatā€™s true; I wasnā€™t intending to target you specifically. Donā€™t worry about it. And donā€™t try to steal my stuff, because like most gun owners\*, I will not only shoot any intruder but I will run up and bash their brains in if they arenā€™t dead already. \*Not that I own a gun. Maybe Iā€™m bluffing, but I am hiding myā€¦tells. ---
**Author:** ![spike404](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@spike404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spike404)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/249 "2009-01-21T03:59:39Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Do I detect an element of doubt? šŸ™‚ Doubt? Yes! Bullshit? Yes! ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/250 "2009-01-21T04:00:06Z")
> [@Jolly\_Roger](#): > > Without the tells? Maybe they just want to tuck you in. See, thats why the NICE guys are the ones not wearing bells. So they donā€™t wake you up when they come to check on you in your own bed in case you are already asleep. The burgle union also requires them to carry bed bug spray. Let me tell you, that stuffs the bomb! The really nice ones even carry air freshners, though in my experience they are often a bit heavy handed in their use of it, but thats just me. I am telling you guys they have it all worked out over there and its quite civilized šŸ™‚ ---
**Author:** ![Cuckoorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Cuckoorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cuckoorex)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/251 "2009-01-21T04:04:52Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > I am **telling** you guys they have it all worked out over there and its quite civilized šŸ™‚ Ha! Good one! ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/252 "2009-01-21T04:08:04Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > I think that youā€™re missing a couple of key words there. After ā€œmost determinedā€ you should have ā€œor most mentally messed upā€. While you might have gone about your peaceful burglary while stone cold sober, I know that many burglars have a little something to calm them down or rev them up, depending on what theyā€™ve got available and their personal preference of drugs. I also think, but donā€™t know for sure, that perhaps many burglars might not burgle if theyā€™re stone cold sober. I didnā€™t mean ā€˜determinedā€™ to sound in any way like a virtue. I agree, they are the most fucked up criminals. But most criminals prefer to target the easy, rather than the difficult job. If they wanted to do hard work, theyā€™d get a proper job. As for going on the job drunk or drugged up, the actual robbery was my high, and the financial side was a nice bonus. Iā€™ll admit, the money was always a major factor, but the thrill factor was an equal attraction. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/253 "2009-01-21T04:11:38Z")
> [@spike404](#): > > Doubt? Yes! Bullshit? Yes! If you can think of a way to expose me, you are welcome to try. Remember though, Iā€™m chatting on an American website and feel I should be entitled to take the 5th, if need be. šŸ™‚ ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/254 "2009-01-21T04:22:48Z")
Oh I forgot the beauty of the bell system. See, now a bad burgular will accidently on occasion loose his bells. Now if that happens, you think he is one of the good burgulars. No harm, no foul. He is still able to safely rape, pillage and kill. The sophistication of the system is quite telling. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/255 "2009-01-21T04:29:38Z")
Ah, but, is providing the burglars with bells, cheaper than making a cardboard box look like a reputed alarm manufactures product, is the question you need to be asking. ---
**Author:** ![Cuckoorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Cuckoorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cuckoorex)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/256 "2009-01-21T04:29:51Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Oh > > I forgot the beauty of the bell system. > > See, now a bad burgular will accidently on occasion loose his bells. Now if that happens, you think he is one of the good burgulars. No harm, no foul. He is still able to safely rape, pillage and kill. > > The sophistication of the system is quite telling. Do tell! ---
**Author:** ![spike404](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@spike404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spike404)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/257 "2009-01-21T04:56:04Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > If you can think of a way to expose me, you are welcome to try. Remember though, Iā€™m chatting on an American website and feel I should be entitled to take the 5th, if need be. šŸ™‚ You have to have dark brown eyes. You are full of shit up to your eye-brows. Another guy who watches too much TV. Ah! The anonymity of the internet! Is that you? Cleuseau? ---
**Author:** ![horsetech](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dec6dc/32.png) [@horsetech](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/horsetech)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/258 "2009-01-21T05:03:29Z")
> [@Mojo\_Pin](#): > > I understand youā€™re at least half joking, but maybe someone with different priorities than you would consider a dishonorable life one already lost? > Of course I donā€™t mean me, Iā€™m a total nitwit and a coward, but Iā€™ll bet a samurai wouldnā€™t chase a burglar out his front door at 3 in the morning in his briefs and shoot him in the back. Even if he lived in Texas. A REAL samurai would have dressed in the time it took the burglar to reach the front door. šŸ˜› Most people who know me would be shocked to hear me say anything remotely violent, but I am of the opinion that by violating one of the most basic rules of society and trespassing into my home in order to steal, you have CHOSEN to put YOURSELF in mortal peril. The homeowner has a right to assume the WORST of any scumbag breaking into a house at night with people home. The intruder has already shown themselves to have extremely poor judgment and a disregard for civil society, and you have split seconds and no xray vision to determine whether they wish harm on you and your family. Iā€™m not sure if I could shoot a person without a great deal of training and mental preparation; in fact, Iā€™m pretty sure I would wet myself while fainting, but I believe that people have a right to feel safe in their own homes and those that violate that knowingly and willingly have brought upon themselves the obligation to prove that they are not going to cause harm by either getting the hell out of dodge before the homeowner has time to even reach the room that the intruder is in, or else freezing and putting their hands up in the air. Billfish, you made my evening with the end of your dialogue. Pigs out back . . . ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/259 "2009-01-21T11:39:51Z")
(reference to the Box of Truth deleted, people cited it before me. Great page.) ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2009, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060/260 "2009-01-21T12:09:53Z")
> [@spike404](#): > > You have to have dark brown eyes. You are full of shit up to your eye-brows. > \*\* > Another guy who watches too much TV.\*\* > > Ah! The anonymity of the internet! > > Is that you? Cleuseau? \< sigh \> Well, you are wrong with the brown eyes( blue, actually), completely off the mark regarding the tv watching, and wrong about why Iā€™d wish to remain anonymous, so how much wronger could one person be? I can forgive it and understand a little of your skepticism because you donā€™t know me IRL, but to think everyone you read on the net is bullshitting, without very good cause, wont hold much water. If I knew there was a way to guarantee my internet anonymity, Iā€™d start an Ask the ex-criminal thread and answer questions as freely and as honestly as my devious criminal mind could manage.. As it stands though, Iā€™d only be able to refer to my convictions, of which there were many, prior to 1991. You may feel entitled to think I am a typical dumb criminal from the number of times I have been in court and in prison, but the truth is, it was an occupational hazard and I was a very busy bee. Carry on, o disbelieving one. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-if-i-shouldnt-_shoot_-the-intruder-then/482060.md?page=14)