# Ok....Is THIS legal? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 20, 2000, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127 "2000-03-20T03:23:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Rich\_G7subs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85e7bf/32.png) [@Rich\_G7subs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rich_G7subs)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/1 "2000-03-20T03:23:00Z")
This is kind of on KelliBellis thread,but… I recently had to fill out a form for a parking permit with my employers security company(an outside vendor that has nothing to do with my employment or payroll). My beef is that they asked for my Social Security Number.Why do they need my SS# for a parking permit? I filed the form,leaving the SS# blank.The form was returned to me with a note …“If you want a permit…fill out the form,CORRECTLY this time”. Is this Legal? I was under the belief that it was illegal to Require a SS# for anything other than tax/financial/payroll documents. ---
**Author:** ![ASPA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b19c9b/32.png) [@ASPA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASPA)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/2 "2000-03-20T03:35:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by Rich G7subs: > \*\*This is kind of on KelliBellis thread,but…Why do they need my SS# for a parking permit? I filed the form,leaving the SS# blank.The form was returned to me with a note …“If you want a permit…fill out the form,CORRECTLY this time”. Is this Legal? \*\* Let me say start this string this way: you certainly can decline to list the ss#. It’s helpful, if you want the operative relationship to move along quickly and smoothly, to have an alternate listing that they may find acceptable. Certainly, there are equally or more direct answers to be explored in statements of both statutory and case laws. ---
**Author:** ![ASPA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b19c9b/32.png) [@ASPA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASPA)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/3 "2000-03-20T03:44:00Z")
\*\* [QUOTE] Originally posted by Rich G7subs: \*\*This is kind of on KelliBellis KelliBellis ??? ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/4 "2000-03-20T04:54:00Z")
Well, I tried to find something about the legality of requiring SSNs on this type of document in the US Code and couldn’t find bugger-all. The way it was explained to me a few years ago is that you’re under no legal obligation to disclose your SSN but the business requesting it is under no legal obligation to provide you with services without it. There was a great deal of talk about “identity theft” last year and I seem to remember some talk in that context of tightening restrictions on SSN usage in the private sector but I don’t know if anything came of it. ---
**Author:** ![ASPA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b19c9b/32.png) [@ASPA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASPA)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2000, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/5 "2000-03-21T00:47:00Z")
[QUOTE] Originally posted by Otto: The way it was explained to me a few years ago is that you’re under no legal obligation to disclose your SSN but the business requesting it is under no legal obligation to provide you with services without it. I think it goes more like, …without it or a proper alternative. That is because a lot of standardized forms hold the line while the forms are used for the most serious AND the most surface of relationships. Oftentimes the form giver, themselves, will emphasize, “Oh, we’re not collecting ss#, just leave that blank,” or sumthin to that effect. Considered? ---
**Author:** ![Kakkerlak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bb73d2/32.png) [@Kakkerlak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kakkerlak)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2000, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/6 "2000-03-21T02:46:00Z")
IIRC, the myth about Social Security Numbers came from a federal ruling (no, I won’t look it up. Sue me) that decided that the Social Security Number card itself may not be used SOLELY for identification. This was back when America cared a little about the Constitution and the feds didn’t want the SSN becoming a defacto “federal identity card”. As it is, your SSN may be required of you by private enterprises, though they cannot require solely your SSA card. Me, I use a fake one on everything except credit cards and taxes. Hey, does anyone know Al Capone’s SSN? That would be a good one on the parking cops… ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2000, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/7 "2000-03-21T04:57:00Z")
The college I went to used SSN’s as the ID #'s for the college–printed prominently on college ID cards. Before I started college, when I took the ACT, I had declined to supply my SSN, & they put an arbitrary ID # on my ACT records instead. That threw the admissions people a little. When I was in school, I used my actual SSN, & got used to reciting my SSN for various purposes. Not that anyone at the school tried identity theft, but now that I’m posting this where evil young hackers can read it, maybe one will enroll there and try it. Lot of #'s for the taking (though there are probably easier ways). * * * “In my nightmares I am chased by algorithms”–crewman Celes, ST:V ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2000, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/8 "2000-03-21T07:18:00Z")
Or as Dale Gribble says, “Fahve fahve fahve, fahve fahve, fahve.” ---
**Author:** ![handy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@handy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handy)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2000, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/9 "2000-03-21T16:12:00Z")
If you don’t want to give it out, give most of it but change one digit to another number. I remember in one book they gave Nixons SS number so you could use that anytime you needed to input one 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![jawbreaker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@jawbreaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jawbreaker)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2000, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/10 "2000-03-21T20:01:00Z")
what is nixon’s SS#? ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2000, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/11 "2000-03-21T20:20:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by jawbreaker: > **what is nixon’s SS#?** 567-68-0515 He didn’t get a card until 1963 for some reason. At least that’s what the Social Security Death Index says. ---
**Author:** ![paintsvillecom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/22d042/32.png) [@paintsvillecom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/paintsvillecom)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2000, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/12 "2000-03-22T00:01:00Z")
I do seem to remember that you do, however, have the right to request why the person/whatever is asking for your SS number. But this is just something that was told to me and I’m not sure if it applies to private individuals/companies, or whether it’s just a rule for when public employees/agencies ask for your number. You could always fire back a memo refusing to give your number until you the security company provides you with (1) their reason for asking for your number, (2) a description of every potential way they will use it, and (3) assurances that your number will be protected. You could also write a note on the form saying that, by disclosing your number to the company, you will hold them liable for any losses you incur from the company’s failure to adequately protect you from its disclosure to any unethical employees they might have on the payroll or any other disclosure. I don’t know that any of the above suggestions would hold up, but I find in business and bureaucracies that the threat of legal action is often just as effective as actually following through on it. Maybe if we all used such intimidation against these privacy-robbing jerks, we might change their policies requiring such things. Anybody got better info? ---
**Author:** ![Beruang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/77aa72/32.png) [@Beruang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beruang)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2000, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/13 "2000-03-24T19:17:00Z")
Oh, geez… ya take a week off, nd suddenly no one can use the Archives anymore! 😉 [http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1\_154.html](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_154.html) ## This from His FIRST book, fer Chrissakes! Get with the program, people! “The dawn of a new era is felt and not measured.” Walter Lord ---
**Author:** ![paintsvillecom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/22d042/32.png) [@paintsvillecom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/paintsvillecom)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2000, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/14 "2000-03-24T19:48:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by Beruang: > **Oh, geez… ya take a week off, nd suddenly no one can use the Archives anymore! 😉 > [http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1\_154.html](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_154.html)** Looking at the link you provided, I do not see anything remotely answering the original question, which is whether it is legal for a private company to require disclosure of a SS# when it isn’t for hiring purposes. ---
**Author:** ![bizerta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3be4f8/32.png) [@bizerta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bizerta)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2000, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/15 "2000-03-24T23:16:00Z")
William J. Clinton: 429 92 9947 Hillary: 353 40 2536 Chelsea: 431 43 0195 078-05-1120 - Hilda Whitcher See what happens when public officials publish their tax returns: Some wacco writes down their SSN. Bit I can’t remember how much he made. Who’s Hilda Whitcher. She was a Woolworth employee whose SSN card facimile was placed into wallets sold by Woolworth back in the 40’s and 50’s. Her’s is the most commonly misused SSN in the world. Back then, the IRS received over 500 tax returns a year with her SSN. I tend to use it when people demand I fill out my SSN on a form. ---
**Author:** ![Dirty\_Devil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Dirty\_Devil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dirty_Devil)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2000, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-is-this-legal/9127/16 "2000-03-24T23:38:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by paintsvillecom: > \*\*…but I find in business and bureaucracies that the threat of legal action is often just as effective as actually following through on it. Maybe if we all used such intimidation…we might change their policies… \*\* Does this paragraph strike anyone else as being rather funny in light of the recent events on this board?