# OK, I've seen The Avengers - open spoilers! **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 8, 2012, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234 "2012-05-08T01:37:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/201 "2012-05-11T20:11:01Z")
Just came from seeing it. First, after reading this whole thread, I’m startled that nobody has commented on Loki’s use of the phrase “mewling quim”. Really? In one sense I admired Whedon for sneaking it by the censors, but on the other hand it was over the top. Ruffalo was great. He played a way superior Banner to Norton (and I like Norton), but I did wonder: is anything going to happen with Mr. Blue? A substantial part of the plot ended up being: good guys go up in invisible ship, come under attack, fend off attack with heroics…it felt a little like made-up plot filler. Overall I’m impressed at how this was pulled together…I thought it was too many heroes for one movie, but was proven wrong. Well done to Whedon. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/202 "2012-05-11T20:33:04Z")
> [@](#): > > Just came from seeing it. First, after reading this whole thread, I’m startled that nobody has commented on Loki’s use of the phrase “mewling quim”. Really? In one sense I admired Whedon for sneaking it by the censors, but on the other hand it was over the top. I think that discussion was all in the other thread, before this one split off from it. And who’s Mr. Blue? ---
**Author:** ![Bakhesh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Bakhesh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bakhesh)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/203 "2012-05-11T20:58:52Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I think that discussion was all in the other thread, before this one split off from it. > > And who’s Mr. Blue? Sam Sterns in the Hulk movie (ie the Leader). ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/204 "2012-05-11T21:00:57Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > Just came from seeing it. First, after reading this whole thread, I’m startled that nobody has commented on Loki’s use of the phrase “mewling quim”. Really? In one sense I admired Whedon for sneaking it by the censors, but on the other hand it was over the top. I FORGOT about that. I definitely reacted to that in the theater. I was shocked. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/205 "2012-05-11T21:02:06Z")
I laughed at that line. I was the only person in the theater who did. “Quim” just isn’t a word most Americans are familiar with. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/206 "2012-05-11T21:10:52Z")
In that scene between Loki and the BW, did he really manage to get to her or was she playing him for information the whole time? I really like the ambiguity of that scene. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/207 "2012-05-11T21:14:44Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > In that scene between Loki and the BW, did he really manage to get to her or was she playing him for information the whole time? I really like the ambiguity of that scene. If you look at the later scene with Black Widow and Hawkeye (in the small room, after they free him from the Tesseract’s control), it definitely seems to me as though Loki got to her, even if she covered it well at the time. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/208 "2012-05-11T22:23:43Z")
Personally, I think she was using the technique of “lying close to the truth”: She really does have red in her ledger that she wants to account for, but that the implications of that are not the same as what she told Loki. He was coming very close to getting through to her, but the line was sharp, and she kept him from crossing it. I think that if he really was getting to her, she wouldn’t have snapped out of it so abruptly once she got the information she needed. It’s definitely open to different interpretations, though. And I haven’t seen the Norton Hulk movie. Maybe I should? ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/209 "2012-05-11T22:48:11Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Personally, I think she was using the technique of “lying close to the truth”: She really does have red in her ledger that she wants to account for, but that the implications of that are not the same as what she told Loki. “Lying close to the truth” is a great way of putting it. Loki didn’t truly get to her, she was playing him- and to be able to successfully play _Loki_ is a major and significant character point. It really shows just how strong she is when doing what she does best. Paired with her introduction scene (in this movie) it really shows us how valuable and capable she is. Repeating the “red in line ledger” line when speaking with Hawkeye did have me wonder _for a fraction of a split second_ if Loki had gotten to her, but really it is as you said “lying close to the truth”. Her deception with Loki was so believable precisely because she used elements of truth to build upon. > [@](#): > > And I haven’t seen the Norton Hulk movie. Maybe I should? I really liked it but it is so different that I’m pretty much removing it from in-universe continuity in my mind. The differences in both Banner and The Hulk go way beyond loss of actor continuity. The characters _as written_ were very different. Norton would not have done as good a job as Ruffalo in _The Avengers_ HOWEVER Ruffalo would not have done as good a job as Norton in _The Incredible Hulk_. The characters as written called for entirely different approaches from the actors. [I wrote a more detailed post in this very same Thread (though it’s easy to lose it now that the Thread is so long). I’ll just post here a link to the earlier post rather than quote it in its entirety.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15046337&postcount=84) ---
**Author:** ![Beastly\_Rotter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/45deac/32.png) [@Beastly\_Rotter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beastly_Rotter)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/210 "2012-05-11T22:57:03Z")
Saw it yesterday, loved it; it was just so \* tight\* as a movie, nothing wasted, but nothing muddled or confusing: an amazing achievement for a movie that had so much packed into it. The action was terrific, and the script just crackled: too many moments of awesome and funny to list, but I loved Iron Man winding up Thor, and the ensuing fight: “Shakespeare in the Park? Verily, dost thy Mom know that thou wearest her drapes?” Some fine performances, too: for all the money and technology on display onscreen, it never lost sight of the characters. And sometimes you just have to pay good money to hear Samuel L Jackson say “it was a stupid-ass decision and I have elected to ignore it” ---
**Author:** ![SecretaryofEvil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@SecretaryofEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SecretaryofEvil)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/211 "2012-05-11T23:10:17Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > Just came from seeing it. First, after reading this whole thread, I’m startled that nobody has commented on Loki’s use of the phrase “mewling quim”. Really? In one sense I admired Whedon for sneaking it by the censors, but on the other hand it was over the top. I laughed at that line. Next time somebody is being a whiny pussy around me, they’re totally getting called a mewling quim. I thought the funniest lines were (slightly paraphrased) Thor: Hey don’t trash talk Loki, he’s my brother Blackwidow: Your brother just killed 80 people + other bad stuff Thor:… he’s adopted and Stark: So Banner, how do you keep from never getting angry? Smooth jazz? Yoga? Big bag of weed? ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2012, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/212 "2012-05-12T00:20:07Z")
> [@simster](#): > > I am a leaf on the wind, watch how I soar Okay, now, you just cut that out. Don’t make me go back and re-watch _Firefly_ for the fourth time just to see what he referenced in _Avengers._ dammit. ---
**Author:** ![Beastly\_Rotter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/45deac/32.png) [@Beastly\_Rotter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beastly_Rotter)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2012, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/213 "2012-05-12T00:32:28Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > Okay, now, you just cut that out. Don’t make me go back and re-watch _Firefly_ for the fourth time just to see what he referenced in _Avengers._ > > dammit. So that’s what it does. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2012, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/214 "2012-05-12T00:35:40Z")
> [@beastly rotter](#): > > so that’s what it does. shut. It. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2012, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/215 "2012-05-12T02:55:28Z")
Forgot to ask earlier: After Thor crashed to the Earth in the vacuum-sealed chamber from the helicarrier, did he try to lift Mjolnir… and fail? Were we meant to think that he was, at least briefly, unworthy once more? ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2012, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/216 "2012-05-12T02:58:50Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Forgot to ask earlier: After Thor crashed to the Earth in the vacuum-sealed chamber from the helicarrier, did he try to lift Mjolnir… and fail? Were we meant to think that he was, at least briefly, unworthy once more? I just got back from my third viewing and can answer this. He walked towards Mjollnir and looked at it, then started to reach for it as though he were going to pick it up. Then he paused, and instead he flexed his fingers and then curled them into a fist. Then the scene changed. I’m honestly not quite sure what that was trying to imply. The next time we see Thor he’s calling the lightning with Mjollnir firmly in hand. Something else I noticed on third viewing, is a little throw-away scene with Tony Stark and Agent Coulson walking onto the bridge, and Stark is saying to Coulson, “No, I can fly you out for a weekend, Portland is no problem” or something like that, clearly trying to convince him to go see his cellist girlfriend. Nice touch, and I missed it the first two times. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2012, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/217 "2012-05-12T03:00:08Z")
I didn’t read it as “tried” so much as “doubted for a time.” He flexs his fingers like he wanted to pick up the hammer, then doesn’t. He summons it later, to a rather smashing entrance. ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2012, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/218 "2012-05-12T12:58:35Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > I laughed at that line. I was the only person in the theater who did. “Quim” just isn’t a word most Americans are familiar with. I argued in the other thread that Brits wouldn’t either, but others disagreed. I saw it in Sweden where it was subtitled as “fitta” which is the direct translation of “cunt” with the same power, attitude and connotations. There was an audible gasp in the audience. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2012, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/219 "2012-05-13T06:44:46Z")
Thanos Thanos Thanos Thanos… whee! ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2012, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234/220 "2012-05-13T06:56:41Z")
OK, non comic reader here: what’s so cool about Thanos? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-ive-seen-the-avengers-open-spoilers/621234.md?page=12)