# Ok, so CAN a store check my purchases on the way out? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 27, 2001, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188 "2001-09-27T21:20:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/41 "2001-09-28T17:05:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Johnny L.A. \* > \*\ ***Tretiak** : The usual arguement is “If you haven’t done anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about. And after all, it only takes a minute of your time.” The “moral indignation”, as far as I’m concerned, is that submitting to an unwarranted search (and “if you’ve done nothing wrong”, the search _is_ unwarranted) then it is an erosion of your right to privacy. It’s like the “frog in the pot” analogy: If you give up a little at a time, you don’t notice you’re being boiled. And as I’ve mentioned before, despotic regimes use the same arguement that only the guilty need worry. Sure it’s all fun and games, until somebody forms a _Reich_. (Not to seriously equate bag checks with _Geheimestaatspolizei_, but I like hyperbole.) \*\* And hyperbole it is. You’re free to say no, as I and others have pointed out. When you give your permission, it’s no longer invasion of privacy, because you said it was okay. > [@](#): > > **In addition to all of that, it’s dishonest. “Oh, we’re just checking to make sure you weren’t overcharged.” Yeah, right. And the implication is that everyone who enters the store is suspected of a crime. Many people resent that. There is a tradition in this country that a person is “innocent unless found guilty”. Bag checks assume a person is guilty unless proven innocent.** It’s not dishonest. When I checked receipts, I really did look for overcharging. Found it, too. I saved people a heckuva lot of money. It wasn’t the only thing I was looking for, of course, but so what? I never imply that everyone who enters the store is under suspicion. However, shopliftign happens everyday. **Someone** is doing it. It was my job to figure out who, to save my company and the other 99% of shoppers money. Why do you take offense to that? Let me also note that in the time I worked for “Bullseye”, if someone made a false arrest, they were very often fired, barring unusual extenuating circumstances. If it occurred, there would be a lengthy investigation. ---
**Author:** ![Tretiak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a88e57/32.png) [@Tretiak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tretiak)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/42 "2001-09-28T17:06:40Z")
I am not arguing the “If you haven’t done anything worong then you shouldn’t complain” arguemnt. I simply don’t understand the moral indignation, who says exit checks are unamerican? And I don’t buy the “slippery slope” (aka boiling frog) reasoning, because it presumes we aren’t wise enough in the matters. It also suggests that there is absolutely no leeway. A boiling frog and a slippery slope these are poor analogies because they are outside of human rationale and control. That simply is not the case. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/43 "2001-09-28T17:21:45Z")
> [@](#): > > And hyperbole it is. Hyperbole is often useful to show the potential outcome of a course of action, although only when carried to the extreme. > [@](#): > > However, shopliftign happens everyday. **Someone** is doing it. It was my job to figure out who, to save my company and the other 99% of shoppers money. Why do you take offense to that? Because I am not a shoplifter. I don’t like to be treated as one. “But we search _everybody_.” That means that everyone is treated like a shoplifter. > [@](#): > > A boiling frog and a slippery slope these are poor analogies because they are outside of human rationale and control. That simply is not the case. Tell that to gun owners. The ultimate goal of the anti-gunners is to ban all firearms. But they can’t do it all at once, so they ban certain types. Then when the ban doesn’t work to curtail crime, they ban more types. And so on. If we submit to being treated like suspects, then we get used to being treated like suspects. People who are used to giving up their civil liberties to rent-a-cops will give up those liberties to real cops. ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/44 "2001-09-28T17:41:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ethilrist \* > \*\*Okay, we all seem to be in agreement that at Sam’s/Costco kind of places, there is an agreement that they get to search the cart and check the receipt. Cool. They’re covered. > > What are they looking for? > > If they’re looking to make sure I wasn’t overcharged or double-charged, I always check that myself before I leave the register. Thanks, I’d like to leave now. > > If they’re checking to make sure I’m not being UNDERcharged, think of the hours involved: They have two people on the door, sometimes 3-4, every day. That’s two or three full-time jobs for every store in the chain. Hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars a year are being spent making sure you got charged $5.99 for your pack of batteries rather than $4.99. Sounds like a training issue to me. > > If they’re checking to see if I’m clever enough to hide a sack of frozen halibut in my pants whilst going through the checkout line but dumb enough to take it out and dump it in the cart before I get to the door where I KNOW my cart is going to be checked against the receipt, that’s just about the stupidest store policy I’ve ever heard of. \*\* Perhaps they’re checking to see that no item was overlooked. If you’re buying a lot of stuff, the cashier can get distracted (ss they oft do) and overlook an item. The point was made here that this cuts down on shoplifting and saves us all money. I have no problem with that. What’s the big f------ deal? I’ve never had to wait more than a few moments even at Costco or Sam’s. If you have a lot of stuff, the checkers don’t even check them. They just glance at the items, glance at your receipt, and highlight it (the receipt, not the item). Unless you’re an Arab. This “wait 30 minutes at the check-out line and another 30 minutes to be checked” is ridiculous. It’s never been more than seconds to be checked no matter how many are ahead of you. People today are too touchy, IMHO. Litigious too. We’re always looking to sue and will do so at the drop of a receipt. We’re touchy about jokes concerning race, religion, or sex. We’re touchy about little things, such as having our receipt checked. I know this is America and we have certain rights. Well, since the recent catastrophe, we may be all more inconvenienced than waiting a few seconds too have our receipts checked. ---
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/45 "2001-09-28T17:46:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Johnny L.A. \* > > > [@](#): > > > > And hyperbole it is. > > Hyperbole is often useful to show the potential outcome of a course of action, although only when carried to the extreme. Granted, but it is an analogy, not proof. It also seems an illogical (and Godwinesque) extreme in this case. > [@](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > However, shoplifting happens everyday. **Someone** is doing it. It was my job to figure out who, to save my company and the other 99% of shoppers money. Why do you take offense to that? > > Because I am not a shoplifter. I don’t like to be treated as one. “But we search _everybody_.” That means that everyone is treated like a shoplifter. I didn’t search everybody, as I stated above. If the alarms went off, I **asked** to look at the receipt and compare it with the purchases made. Period. > [@](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > A boiling frog and a slippery slope these are poor analogies because they are outside of human rationale and control. That simply is not the case. > > Tell that to gun owners. The ultimate goal of the anti-gunners is to ban all firearms. But they can’t do it all at once, so they ban certain types. Then when the ban doesn’t work to curtail crime, they ban more types. And so on. > > If we submit to being treated like suspects, then we get used to being treated like suspects. People who are used to giving up their civil liberties to rent-a-cops will give up those liberties to real cops. Hoo boy. I was wondering when sweeping generalizations would come into play. Short answer: Being asked a question does not violate your rights. Being lawfully detained with probable cause may or may not violate your rights, and you are free to explore that question in court. Well, I think we’ve officially entered GD. The OP has been answered as well as it is going to be. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/46 "2001-09-28T17:53:01Z")
I have never minded that Costco requires you to show your receipt so that they can check your purchases, for one simple reason, and that is the Costco food court. This might sound really stupid, but a lot of times after I’ve done my shopping at Costco, I will stop at their little food court and get a hot dog and soda. You can’t take the cart into the food court area because there’s no room, so I (and everyone else) just leaves it parked outside the food area. In a normal store, I would never ever do this, because I would fear that someone would take my cart and walk out the door with it. At Costco, though, I am pretty sure this will not happen, because any potential thief would need my receipt to get out the door with my purchases. (I also sit where I can keep an eye on the cart, just in case, but the receipt-checking policy does give me peace of mind.) ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/47 "2001-09-28T17:56:04Z")
> [@](#): > > Well, I think we’ve officially entered GD. Perhaps. But I’ve stated my position and have given my reasons. You and other have countered with reasons why you disagree with me. I don’t see that either side will change the mind of the other, so there is no debate. People are different and have different opinions. My opinion is that I don’t like having my bags checked. Others’ opinion is that it’s no big deal. ---
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/48 "2001-09-28T18:07:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Johnny L.A. \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > Well, I think we’ve officially entered GD. > > Perhaps. But I’ve stated my position and have given my reasons. You and other have countered with reasons why you disagree with me. I don’t see that either side will change the mind of the other, so there is no debate.\*\* No offense, but this gave me a big chuckle. I mean, have you **been** to GD? Not a lot of converts to any sides. Otherwise, it would be a much quicker debate, wouldn’t it? **FrdFan** : Chevy sucks! **MoparDude** : No, they don’t, and here’s why. Cite. **FrdFan** : Good point. I shall trade my Mustang for a Corvette forthwith. \*\* > [@](#): > > People are different and have different opinions. My opinion is that I don’t like having my bags checked. Others’ opinion is that it’s no big deal. \*\* ::Nods:: ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/49 "2001-09-28T18:14:40Z")
> [@](#): > > No offense, but this gave me a big chuckle. I mean, have you **been** to GD? Not a lot of converts to any sides. Actually, no; not recently. Whether it’s legal for businesses to try to search your bags has been answered as well as it can be; and I don’t really feel like debating whether it’s “right”. So we’ll each do as our conscience dictates. ---
**Author:** ![DarrenS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@DarrenS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DarrenS)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/50 "2001-09-28T18:44:36Z")
I’ve heard it said that the purpose of checking bags at the door is not to prevent theft by you, the consumer, but to catch internal fraud by the employees of the store. For exmaple, your buddy works at the huge electronics store - you buy a pack of batteries and a big screen TV, he just rings up the pack of batteries and lets you go. You just got a big screen TV for free that you can later split with him. More hyperbole, but you get my point. FWIW I also bristle at what is know as “the final indignity” in my area - the searching of your bags at the door. In any case the search at my local \ is pretty cursory, they just grab the receipt, without even looking at it make a stroke with a yellow highlighter, glance in the bag and let you go on your way - no time to check anything. Really seems pointless to me. ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/51 "2001-09-28T19:14:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Anthracite \* > \*\ ***Never, under any circumstances whatsoever** allow yourself to be taken out of the public view, guilty or not. If they are intent on taking you away to a back room for Goddess-knows-what, you need to resist in any way possible, demanding that they call the _real_ police to handle the situation. If things have got this bad, don’t try to escape, don’t try to fight or run away, just simply refuse to go with them non-violently, and demand loudly and vehemently that they call the police and let them handle it. This serves two purposes: > > 1. You are not taken and held prisoner by the rent-a-cops in a windowless room somewhere, where a 19-year old tries to interrogate you about your supposed “crimes”. I’ve seen far, far too many hidden camera tapes of these interrogations, and some are downright scary. > > 2. When you are searched by the police and found to be innocent, you now have a nice paper trail of what you were put through, and that you were found to be innocent. \*\* The security company I worked for would not have given you a choice. If you were detained, you were handcuffed, and transported out of public view. If that meant pepperspraying the suspect, and hogtieing them, and physically carrying them into the office, so be it. Of course, in Texas, suing a private citizen for false arrest(which a security commpany is considered), is nearly impossible. In fact, IIRC there was law passed a few years back that said you couldnt, even if they injured you. It depends on the state, but here, they have a right to take you into a back room to wait for the police, and they have a right to use force, if neccesary. ---
**Author:** ![JillGat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9fc29f/32.png) [@JillGat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JillGat)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/52 "2001-09-28T19:42:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by D18 \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by JohnW77707 \* > > **Us pussies have a way of figuring out what our potential client is going to act like on the witness stand.** > > Best damn line I’ve read this week! \*\* Except that it should be “We,” not “Us.” Carry on. (and it’s _not_ me.) Jill ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/53 "2001-09-28T21:31:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by JSexton \* > **Uh huh. “World’s Wildest Police Videotape,” much? You are aware that store security, just like any citizen, can make a citizen’s arrest and detain you? Yes, they can be sued for flase arrest. However, unless they are completely incompetent chuzzlewits, they won’t do so unless they are positive that you stole something. See my “five elements” post above.** What does that videotape crack mean? I’m referring to store security cameras at the local mall, which aired on Channel 9 in KC. Your telepathic powers have failed you. And why don’t you tell me why the store would bother to strong-arm someone who demands simply that they call the police into a back room? Please tell me why the store would not just keep the person there, in plain sight, and call the police? After all - if they are _so certain_ that a crime has been committed, they have nothing to lose, right? Why do you seem so offended by the fact that (horrors!) **real** law enforcement professionals might need to be involved? I’d _love_ to hear your rationale for having rent-a-cops forcibly take someone into a back room, versus standing with them by the front door and waiting for the police. And “citizen’s arrest” does not mean you can be taken wherever they want to take you, and that they can hold you however long they want. Please tell me you’re not actually saying that? Think about it a little. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/54 "2001-09-28T21:38:40Z")
**bdgr** , I think the pertinent point of my quote was: > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Anthracite \* > **…don’t try to escape, don’t try to fight or run away, just simply refuse to go with them non-violently, and demand loudly and vehemently that they call the police and let them handle it.** I repeat again. I am at the front door, not trying to escape or walk out, surrounded by store security. They believe a crime has been committed. **What possible reason do they have to drag a woman alone to a windowless back room, with no witnesses, and do who-knows-what to her, as opposed to calling the REAL law enforcement personnel?** After all - the store thinks a crime has been committed. What do they have to hide that they need to take you into that back room? Am I really so off-base in thinking that one has a right to wait calmly for the REAL police to come, in plain sight? Is anyone going to second my idea? And if an innocent person is subjected to that, there needs to be a waiver of the corporate protections of employees. The security guards themselves should pay, along with the store, and pay **big**. IMO, of course. ---
**Author:** ![bdgr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a87d85/32.png) [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/55 "2001-09-28T22:00:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Anthracite \* > \*\ ***bdgr** , I think the pertinent point of my quote was: > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Anthracite \* > > **…don’t try to escape, don’t try to fight or run away, just simply refuse to go with them non-violently, and demand loudly and vehemently that they call the police and let them handle it.** > > I repeat again. I am at the front door, not trying to escape or walk out, surrounded by store security. They believe a crime has been committed. **What possible reason do they have to drag a woman alone to a windowless back room, with no witnesses, and do who-knows-what to her, as opposed to calling the REAL law enforcement personnel?** > > After all - the store thinks a crime has been committed. What do they have to hide that they need to take you into that back room? Am I really so off-base in thinking that one has a right to wait calmly for the REAL police to come, in plain sight? Is anyone going to second my idea? > > And if an innocent person is subjected to that, there needs to be a waiver of the corporate protections of employees. The security guards themselves should pay, along with the store, and pay **big**. IMO, of course. \*\* From the retailers point of view, they want the suspect off the floor and out of the public eye as quickly as possible, to minimize the disturbance. If I had had detained a female(I never had to do so, but came real close one time), I would have made damn certain that at least one female employee was with me at all times. In Texas, if I made citizens arrest, I would be within my rights to put that person in a car and transport them to the police station myself, if I so desired(not something I would do). At least, in this state, you dont have a right to wait in plain sight, nor do I think you should. If you come into a store and steal things(I would never detain someone I hadnt personally witnessed commit a crime), then why should the retailer have to worry about making the other customers uncomfortable? Some stores, however, wanted you to keep the suspect out in the open, to make an example. A suspect could peacfully refuse all they wanted, they would still be taken into the office, or wherever else the customer wanted them taken, and they would have nothing to say about it. They gave up that right when they stole something. Thats what an arrest is, is taking away that right. And security people arent “fake” police, they are security. They have a job to do, some of which is similar to law enforcement, but they are not trying to pretend to be law enforcement. My personal pollicy was to let the police handle any sort of search, I would never have searched anyone, male or female. All I would do is cuff them get them out of the way until the police showed up. Security people in this state have had a background check, and are licensed by the state, and carry an extreme amount of insurance. the company I worked never had to use that insurance once that I am aware of. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/56 "2001-09-28T22:00:58Z")
actually, **Anthracite** , from my experience w/professional shoplifters, one reason the security people want to take them out of public view, is 'cause they often travel in groups. So, while they’re restraining suspect, and suspect’s loudly calling out ‘I demand you call the police’, suspect’s confederates can hear commotion, surround the struggle and more stuff happens. Experience : 20+ years working w/offenders, seeing the arrest reports, Basic Info sheets (listing codefendants sometimes), seeing a plan in action, talking to police etc. You’re looking at it from the viewpoint of an innocent person accused, of course (because in your case it would be), the security officer is looking at it from another. (this is not to say that I believe there aren’t dangers w/rent a cops - hell, I’m in Michigan where, what’s the body count now? 3 dead by rentacops?) ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2001, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188/57 "2001-09-28T22:51:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by JSexton \* > \*\* The OP has been answered as well as it is going to be. \*\* Ding! We have a winner. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-can-a-store-check-my-purchases-on-the-way-out/84188.md?page=2)