# Ok, so what the hell happened in Germany in NYE? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 8, 2016, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538 "2016-01-08T23:28:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/241 "2016-01-10T18:43:14Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Are you saying that one human being is more valuable than another based simply on where they are coming from? In the sense of the economic utility I am saying the Syrian refugee is a profile that is economically more valuable to a country than the Harraga profile from the Maghreb. The point is made to highlight the error of confounding the different types. it is not a judgement of the moral worth of human beings. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/242 "2016-01-10T18:47:36Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > In the sense of the economic utility I am saying the Syrian refugee is a profile that is economically more valuable to a country than the Harraga profile from the Maghreb. > > The point is made to highlight the error of confounding the different types. > > it is not a judgement of the moral worth of human beings. But it IS a judgement of the economic worth of human beings, is it not? ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/243 "2016-01-10T18:52:11Z")
It is an observation of the different profiles and their economic utility. The Syrian refugee socio-economic profile is a profile of the mass-displacement by the civil war. This has a very different meaning economically for the potential of integration and the utilitarian impact economically than the Harraga who flees the bidonville with no functional education. The quoted sentence is about the rationale action of the Harraga, coming from essentially an underclass, to try to hide among the Syrians who get more morale sympathy and who have more potential economic value since they have greater skills. ---
**Author:** ![botsgotme](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@botsgotme](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/botsgotme)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/244 "2016-01-10T18:57:30Z")
And German girls are sunbathing in public parks and beaches, topless and wearing very little? I think its imperative that German girls start wearing burquas, so as not to offend these refugee’s sense of morality. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/245 "2016-01-10T19:01:24Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > The Sunday after the case on a Sunday morning live program (The Big Question BBC) a Mosque leader denied that they were Muslims and did not attend the Mosque, he was horrified when a member of his congregation stood up and called him a liar, the guilty men attended the Mosque on a regular basis and that the Mosque leader knew them had shaken them by the hand and had spoken with them on many occasions. Considering your habit of getting your facts very wrong, how about providing a link to said episode so we can actually see what happened. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/246 "2016-01-10T19:01:47Z")
**RE botsgotme** et voila the return of the sort of gross ignorance and bankrupt prejudice imagery that was the reason for the casa and the tunis photos. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/247 "2016-01-10T19:03:06Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > Considering your habit of getting your facts very wrong, how about providing a link to said episode so we can actually see what happened. It is why the only response to him is “cool story bro” ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/248 "2016-01-10T19:05:50Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > It is an observation of the different profiles and their economic utility. The Syrian refugee socio-economic profile is a profile of the mass-displacement by the civil war. > > This has a very different meaning economically for the potential of integration and the utilitarian impact economically than the Harraga who flees the bidonville with no functional education. What about refugees from other parts of the world? Should their economic utility be determined before deciding if they should be allowed in? ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/249 "2016-01-10T19:09:18Z")
What about them? This thread is about the incidents attributed to the Faux and the real Syrian refugees and then by extension the policies towards them. I am not making and I am not commenting on the general refugee policies in the world in any fashion. ---
**Author:** ![Lazy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9fc29f/32.png) [@Lazy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lazy)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/250 "2016-01-10T19:15:57Z")
I am starting to read in online comments and articles that what happened in Cologne is a well-known phenomenon in – I’m not sure, maybe North Africa – called “taharrush gamea”. True? Misleadingly half-true? BS? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/251 "2016-01-10T19:17:16Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > What about them? This thread is about the incidents attributed to the Faux and the real Syrian refugees and then by extension the policies towards them. I am not making and I am not commenting on the general refugee policies in the world in any fashion. True, but you brought up the Harraga, apparently in an effort to blame them for the incidents instead of the more “economically viable” Syrian refugees. I’m just astonished that in a thread where you seem to be defending the Syrian refugees, you go on to denigrate an entire class of people yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/252 "2016-01-10T19:18:25Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > I showed actual real life against the idiot stereotypes. And you come back with a grossly prejudiced association of the act of a single terrorist. No, the prejudice is with the terrorist. The association falls under “one of many attacks attributed to the religion of Islam”. Not Muslims, the religion. In Tunis alone there have been 4 separate attacks since 2002. Just Tunis. All related to religious hatred. All aimed at unknown victims for the shear desire to kill. > [@Ramira](#): > > So I guess I must following this logic associate the Americans with the slaughter by drones of innocents and the endless school killings by psychopathic white men… if someone is launching random drone attacks on people based on a “white men” dogma then yes, you would be absolutely correct. > [@Ramira](#): > > I do not think anyone here but the fellow travellers believes this for one moment. I certainly do not. Believe whatever you want. You already believe in a magical being too busy or weak to make a serious appearance and relies on warlords to get the word out. That’s just a diversion from what I asked. So I’ll ask again, has she killed anyone or issued instructions to do so? Because I’ll certainly condemn that. Has she taken on slaves? I’ll condemn that. Has she threatened to punish or kill people who don’t agree with her because I’ll condemn that. Tell my why she’s a bigot and Mohammad wasn’t. Personally, anyone who believes it’s a punishable crime to leave their religion is a walking oxymoron to the concept of an all powerful loving being. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/253 "2016-01-10T19:21:37Z")
It is BS. gamea I am guessing is some bad copying of the Egyptian pronunciation of jamia3, so already someone is drawing something from Egypt and thinking it applies to others. It is simply then “Group harassment.” I presume it is reference to sexual harrassment - which is indeed a huge problem in Cairo. But some bigots are doubtless extrapolating from Cairo to the entire region - it is the Muslim Hive Mind… ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/254 "2016-01-10T19:24:38Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > True, but you brought up the Harraga, I have referenced the Harraga as a large number of the suspects identified in the German police reporting as cited right here in this thread turn out to be actually be Moroccan and Algerian, in our dialect, the Harraga. Very simple. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/255 "2016-01-10T19:36:26Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > The association falls under “one of many attacks attributed to the religion of Islam”. Pure prejudice and a perfect fit to the idea and the definition of the Intolerance towards others - since of course there is no relationship between the subject of ordinary women in Tunis wearing some ordinary clothing and a terrorist incident (by a hard drinking and apparently by reports deeply depressed and mentally disturbed student who did not fire on any of the tunisians who are seen in pictures on the beach, tunisians not in “modest” wear… So it is indeed hard to explain making an association between women dressed normally in Tunis and a terror attack in Tunisia that had nothing to do , except that such a person is doing it through the deep lens of intolerance so that Arab (Tunisian) = Terrorist. The drawing on well-known hate mongerers like Geller who have been raised and discussed many times in discussions here (featuring this person… and only a few months back) and the predilection to link to such cites tells me where the reality lies including the pretension to not knowing… ---
**Author:** ![Donnerwetter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/256 "2016-01-10T19:36:55Z")
> [@Lazy](#): > > I am starting to read in online comments and articles that what happened in Cologne is a well-known phenomenon in – I’m not sure, maybe North Africa – called “taharrush gamea”. > > True? Misleadingly half-true? BS? True. The source of this information is the Federal Criminal Police Office (kind of the German FBI): > **[Sexuelle Belästigung: Das Phänomen „taharrush gamea“ ist in Deutschland...](https://www.welt.de/politik/deutschland/article150813517/Das-Phaenomen-taharrush-gamea-ist-in-Deutschland-angekommen.html)** > > Das BKA plant neue Maßnahmen gegen gemeinschaftlich begangene sexuelle Belästigung von Frauen. Das Phänomen ist in arabischen Ländern schon lange ein Problem und als „taharrush gamea“ bekannt. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/257 "2016-01-10T19:40:38Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > The initial desire to coverup or downplay the crimes is reminiscent of the events in Rotherham. I was reminded of the Las Vegas Tailhook convention of the 90’s when I read about this. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/258 "2016-01-10T19:44:20Z")
> [@Donnerwetter](#): > > True. The source of this information is the Federal Criminal Police Office (kind of the German FBI): > > [Sexuelle Belästigung: Das Phänomen „taharrush gamea“ ist in Deutschland angekommen - WELT](http://www.welt.de/politik/deutschland/article150813517/Das-Phaenomen-taharrush-gamea-ist-in-Deutschland-angekommen.html) Well since the Germans use an **Egyptian dialect** phrase, no it is not Truth it is “German police come to some poorly informed sociological confusions based on the confusion and ignorance.” so we have the extrapolation of the egyptian phrase to non egyptians because… arabs, all the same. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/259 "2016-01-10T19:44:54Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/260 "2016-01-10T19:45:39Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > I have referenced the Harraga as a large number of the suspects identified in the German police reporting as cited right here in this thread turn out to be actually be Moroccan and Algerian, in our dialect, the Harraga. > > Very simple. Yes, and went on to denigrate them and state they were less “economically viable” than Syrian refugees. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538.md?page=14)