# Ok, so what the hell happened in Germany in NYE? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 8, 2016, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538 "2016-01-08T23:28:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/21 "2016-01-09T08:29:24Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Germany has taken in about 800,000 refugees in 2015. > > If a mere 1% of them are “bad apples” that’s 8000 criminals. More than sufficient numbers to account for the miscreants on NYE, which likely numbered in the 100’s at most. > > You’re not taking into account the sheer number of people that flowed into Germany in one year. Oh I’m taking that in to account, you’re downplaying it though. Hundreds of sex assault reports across at least five German cities, but hey Frauleins don’t worry. That’s probably only being done by maybe 1% of the people we just let in the country. We still think there’s a lot of valuable new citizens in there. It’s worth the minor inconvenience of you having to stay hidden on New Year’s Eve. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/22 "2016-01-09T09:15:34Z")
Please. I’m a woman myself, I take the threat of sexual assault seriously. However, this isn’t a feature of MENA culture - [western society has examples of mass sexual assault as well](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tailhook_scandal) There were about 7500 rapes/sexual assaults reported in Germany in 2011, before the “migrant crisis”. It’s not like Germany women were perfectly safe beforehand and suddenly under threat now. Rape has _always_ been a risk for women everyone, let’s not pretend it’s some “other” group that commits it. Men from all cultures, of all sorts, commit rape and sexual assault. It’s a problem for all societies. Absolutely find the perpetrators and participants of this series of crimes and punish them to the full extent of the law. However, do NOT tar the vast majority of people from that region who are law-abiding people who can be relied on to behave within the society they have moved to with the sins a small slice of the group. This sort of thing is exactly the sort of thing to trigger tribal hatred and outrage at “them” touching “our” women. I would like to think Europe is more civilized than that. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/23 "2016-01-09T09:28:08Z")
> [@Claverhouse](#): > > Yeah, Western women in the 1940s and before were downtrodden little things, fearful of offending men and hidden away indoors. > Actually rape was a death offence from ancient Rome to Mediaeval times: swinging them stopped in English law in the 1840s, but it was replaced with imprisonment for life. Which wasn’t a picnic in 19th century prisons. > > It wasn’t the same in Eastern countries so much. Depended whom you raped probably. > > Which is not to say that muslims don’t have useful insights on gender relations that we can adopt. I have recently been enthused with the muslim Shia invention of [**Mut’ah**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fixed-term_marriage), Fixed-Term Marriages, legal with the Twelvers ( the major Shia ). Instead of people being forced to stay in a loveless, boring marriage, it can instead be fixed in advance to 3 days, 3 months, or 3 years., after which both parties can go their own way in friendship and amity. The only caveat being the woman has to refrain from sex for a while after. > > We have much to learn from them. In the West something called a ‘divorce’ exists. Don’t need to abstain after either. ---
**Author:** ![Donnerwetter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/24 "2016-01-09T09:47:24Z")
We are talking about a force of about 1000 young men (I repeat: one thousand) men that entered a comparatively tiny place in the center of Cologne on the busiest night of the year, which is not a trivial thing to organize in itself. For those of you who don’t know Cologne, Cologne main station is only a couple of yards away from Cologne Cathedral, one of the largest and most impressive Christian churches in Europe, it is traditionally the place were young and old welcome the new year and where they would have felt safe. This was an orchestrated and highly symbolic demonstration of power and humiliation of the local population (and all the others who happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time). The sheer magnitude of what happened is breathtaking. > [@](#): > > ‘I’m Syrian, you have to treat me nicely! Angela Merkel invited me,’ one man reportedly told officers > [@](#): > > He described terrified women being forced to “literally run through a gauntlet of extremely intoxicated men” outside the city’s main railway station as “fights, thefts, sex, assaults on women” continued all around. > [@](#): > > “In the course of the operation numerous crying and shocked women and girls approached officers to report sexual assaults by male migrants or groups,” the report said. > [@](#): > > A 17-year-old British girl previously told how she escaped serious injury when a rocket exploded behind her as she celebrated New Year’s Eve with her boyfriend. > > “We heard a woman screaming and crying somewhere in the midst of this crowd, appearing to be escaping from a foreign man, who was shouting back and pointing his finger at her and chasing her with his accomplices,” she wrote. > > “Later on, we saw two men corner women at the cathedral and touch them while they were screaming for help and trying to fight back.” > **[The police report from the night of the Cologne mass sex attacks is horrifying](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/cologne-sexual-assaults-leaked-police-report-reveals-chaos-beyond-description-as-women-attacked-and-robbed-a6802026.html)** > > 'I’m Syrian, you have to treat me nicely! Angela Merkel invited me,' one man reportedly told officers > [@](#): > > He said of the 31 people questioned, nine had been Algerian, eight Moroccan, five Iranian, and four Syrian. > > Two German citizens, an Iraqi, a Serb and a US citizen were also among those seen to have committed crimes during the night. [http://news.sky.com/story/1618820/cologne-police-chief-removed-over-assaults](http://news.sky.com/story/1618820/cologne-police-chief-removed-over-assaults) ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 9:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/25 "2016-01-09T09:54:10Z")
The initial desire to coverup or downplay the crimes is reminiscent of the events in Rotherham. ---
**Author:** ![Donnerwetter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/26 "2016-01-09T10:05:28Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > The initial desire to coverup or downplay the crimes is reminiscent of the events in Rotherham. There was a **massive** attempt to cover up what happened. The headquarters of [WDR](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westdeutscher_Rundfunk) (West German Broadcasting) is literally only several feet away from the scene of events. WDR is the second-largest broadcasting organization in Europe. They could have filmed this by just holding a camera from the windows of their newsroom. If you walk through the center of Cologne for 10 minutes on an uneventful summer’s day, you will typically have stumbled upon WDR 2 camera teams and 3 radio reporters. ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/27 "2016-01-09T11:43:26Z")
> [@Donnerwetter](#): > > There was a **massive** attempt to cover up what happened. The headquarters of [WDR](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westdeutscher_Rundfunk) (West German Broadcasting) is literally only several feet away from the scene of events. WDR is the second-largest broadcasting organization in Europe. They could have filmed this by just holding a camera from the windows of their newsroom. If you walk through the center of Cologne for 10 minutes on an uneventful summer’s day, you will typically have stumbled upon WDR 2 camera teams and 3 radio reporters. The coverage by the BBC was shameful as well, at first it wasn’t really reported, then hid away as a fairly minor story, as the scale of things became clear it was made more prominent but then the tone of the reporting was shifted to ‘its all the fault of the police’. I’ve considered writing a complaint, but I doubt it would do any good. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/28 "2016-01-09T11:51:32Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Lest we be too proud of our own enlightenment, we should recognize the way that Islamic cultures treat women today is little different than the developed world treated all women sixty or seventy years ago, and much of that behavior was justified on cultural and religious grounds as well (and still is in some places). > [@Tithonus](#): > > That’s true, but 60-70 years is still a fairly long time. > [@CarnalK](#): > > With all due respect Stranger, bringing up that we were just as bad 100-200 years ago is of little comfort or value. Thirty. Not 60-70, and very much not 200. Thirty years, and less. Mass assaults, no, but no rights, no defense from a bad husband or a bad father or any other man in a position of authority, divorce nonexistant or initiated only by the husband, having to leave a profession you’d trained for on grounds of commiting marriage… ---
**Author:** ![Donnerwetter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Donnerwetter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Donnerwetter)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/29 "2016-01-09T12:07:49Z")
> [@Disposable Hero](#): > > The coverage by the BBC was shameful as well, at first it wasn’t really reported, then hid away as a fairly minor story, as the scale of things became clear it was made more prominent but then the tone of the reporting was shifted to ‘its all the fault of the police’. > > I’ve considered writing a complaint, but I doubt it would do any good. I wouldn’t necessarily blame the BBC since foreign news media, to some degree, have to rely upon local reports. Hours after the incident, Cologne police had issued an official press release claiming that nothing remarkable had occurred on New Year’s Eve. The first English language news source to break the story, BTW, was Breitbart News London (I didn’t even know they had an office in the UK) and their report was accurate. This came after the now infamous press conference by the Cologne police chief (who was fired yesterday) on Monday. ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/30 "2016-01-09T12:35:23Z")
> [@Donnerwetter](#): > > I wouldn’t necessarily blame the BBC since foreign news media, to some degree, have to rely upon local reports. Hours after the incident, Cologne police had issued an official press release claiming that nothing remarkable had occurred on New Year’s Eve. > > The first English language news source to break the story, BTW, was Breitbart News London (I didn’t even know they had an office in the UK) and their report was accurate. This came after the now infamous press conference by the Cologne police chief (who was fired yesterday) on Monday. You may very well be right regarding the slow reponse, but BBC coverage has been so poor for the past few years that I’m reluctant to give them the benefit of the doubt, and that also doesn’t explain the nature of the coverage. For those who wonder why I use a website I dislike its because I pay £150 per year for a television licence fee I have no choice but to pay, and as I don’t watch TV I’d like something back for my money. And when they aren’t trying to push an agenda they can have some readable articles. btw does anyone else think its rather unfair to blame the police chief for this? It smacks of politicians trying to direct attention away from themselves. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/31 "2016-01-09T13:06:22Z")
So, what happened was a big bunch of Muslims conspired to make themselves despised and unwelcome? A carefully orchestrated plan to make themselves and their fellow Muslims as miserable and persecuted as could possibly be arranged? And nobody ratted them out? Their lines of communication were so secure that no one unreliable was connected, nobody found out but the true believers who came to Germany hoping to be run out on a rail? Anybody else find this a bit hard to accept? ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a8b319/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_wuzzy)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/32 "2016-01-09T13:08:39Z")
> [@Disposable Hero](#): > > You may very well be right regarding the slow reponse, but BBC coverage has been so poor for the past few years that I’m reluctant to give them the benefit of the doubt, and that also doesn’t explain the nature of the coverage. > > For those who wonder why I use a website I dislike its because I pay £150 per year for a television licence fee I have no choice but to pay, and as I don’t watch TV I’d like something back for my money. And when they aren’t trying to push an agenda they can have some readable articles. > > btw does anyone else think its rather unfair to blame the police chief for this? It smacks of politicians trying to direct attention away from themselves. Im sure there is a whole behind the scenes pissing contest going on between mayor, police chief and central government. All will be attempting to put their own spin on this. The police chief seems to have lost this round of this particular contest. With regards to the initial BBC coverage I read elsewhere the first BBC report failed to mention the ethnicity of the perpetrators, but did mention that far right elements were up in arms over the incidents. I don’t know if this is a **true** account of the first BBC report but it does sound exactly what we have come to expect from them. Some details are subtly underplayed. To be fair to the BBC they are not the only ones to do this sort of thing. ---
**Author:** ![Nancarrow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c37758/32.png) [@Nancarrow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nancarrow)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/33 "2016-01-09T13:14:56Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > So, what happened was a big bunch of Muslims conspired to make themselves despised and unwelcome? > > A carefully orchestrated plan to make themselves and their fellow Muslims as miserable and persecuted as could possibly be arranged? > > And nobody ratted them out? Their lines of communication were so secure that no one unreliable was connected, nobody found out but the true believers who came to Germany hoping to be run out on a rail? > > Anybody else find this a bit hard to accept? Well, ISIS exists. So no, I find no part of what you wrote hard to accept. ---
**Author:** ![fisha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@fisha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fisha)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/34 "2016-01-09T13:24:14Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > So, what happened was a big bunch of Muslims conspired to make themselves despised and unwelcome? A carefully orchestrated plan to make themselves and their fellow Muslims as miserable and persecuted as could possibly be arranged? > > And nobody ratted them out? Their lines of communication were so secure that no one unreliable was connected, nobody found out but the true believers who came to Germany hoping to be run out on a rail? > > Anybody else find this a bit hard to accept? Never underestimate stupidity. ---
**Author:** ![Celyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9dc877/32.png) [@Celyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Celyn)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/35 "2016-01-09T13:40:31Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Thirty. Not 60-70, and very much not 200. Thirty years, and less. Mass assaults, no, but no rights, no defense from a bad husband or a bad father or any other man in a position of authority, divorce nonexistant or initiated only by the husband, having to leave a profession you’d trained for on grounds of commiting marriage… Was this really the state of things in 1985? I don’t think it was. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/36 "2016-01-09T13:47:04Z")
Well, OK. How was the plan communicated securely, so that only the trustworthy and reliable found out about it? Really smart people have a hard time doing that, how did a bunch of dumb asses manage it? The more people who are connected to a conspiracy, the more likely it is that someone will tumble, yes? And this one, apparently, involved…hundreds? thousands?..of co-conspirators. And no breaches of security? Remarkable, to say the least. Fucking amazing, to put it about right. OK, I’m a strange guy with some unpopular opinions, I have that on good authority. But I’m the only person who thinks this just doesn’t add up? Well, not the first time, not the last, either, probably. But it _doesn’t_ add up. When something fits so neatly into preconceived notions, slips into place with a _click!_…I get suspicious. ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/37 "2016-01-09T13:58:38Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](#): > > Im sure there is a whole behind the scenes pissing contest going on between mayor, police chief and central government. All will be attempting to put their own spin on this. The police chief seems to have lost this round of this particular contest. > > With regards to the initial BBC coverage I read elsewhere the first BBC report failed to mention the ethnicity of the perpetrators, but did mention that far right elements were up in arms over the incidents. I don’t know if this is a **true** account of the first BBC report but it does sound exactly what we have come to expect from them. Some details are subtly underplayed. To be fair to the BBC they are not the only ones to do this sort of thing. Very true on both points, the first BBC reports I read did mention that the suspects were ‘apparently of Middle Eastern or North African origin’, but then spent the next few paragraphs saying that they weren’t necessarily refugees. Sure, but they were still immigrants at _some_ point. > [@elucidator](#): > > Well, OK. How was the plan communicated securely, so that only the trustworthy and reliable found out about it? Really smart people have a hard time doing that, how did a bunch of dumb asses manage it? The more people who are connected to a conspiracy, the more likely it is that someone will tumble, yes? And this one, apparently, involved…hundreds? thousands?..of co-conspirators. > > And no breaches of security? Remarkable, to say the least. Fucking amazing, to put it about right. > > OK, I’m a strange guy with some unpopular opinions, I have that on good authority. But I’m the only person who thinks this just doesn’t add up? Well, not the first time, not the last, either, probably. > > But it _doesn’t_ add up. When something fits so neatly into preconceived notions, slips into place with a _click!_…I get suspicious. What do you think happened? Genuine non-snarky question. ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a8b319/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_wuzzy)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/38 "2016-01-09T14:08:47Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Well, OK. How was the plan communicated securely, so that only the trustworthy and reliable found out about it? Really smart people have a hard time doing that, how did a bunch of dumb asses manage it? The more people who are connected to a conspiracy, the more likely it is that someone will tumble, yes? And this one, apparently, involved…hundreds? thousands?..of co-conspirators. > > And no breaches of security? Remarkable, to say the least. Fucking amazing, to put it about right. > > OK, I’m a strange guy with some unpopular opinions, I have that on good authority. But I’m the only person who thinks this just doesn’t add up? Well, not the first time, not the last, either, probably. > > But it _doesn’t_ add up. When something fits so neatly into preconceived notions, slips into place with a _click!_…I get suspicious. I cannot say for certain but I suspect these instances of mass abuse are an annual tradition. It doesn’t have to be an organised conspiracy. If you go through reports of such abuse(or are prepared to listen to victims who will now come forward) you’ll probably find similar, but fewer, types of attacks happened last new year also. Im sure this is not the first time muslims (or others) have came together as abusive gangs at a mass celebration. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/39 "2016-01-09T14:32:53Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Well, OK. How was the plan communicated securely, so that only the trustworthy and reliable found out about it? Really smart people have a hard time doing that, how did a bunch of dumb asses manage it? The more people who are connected to a conspiracy, the more likely it is that someone will tumble, yes? And this one, apparently, involved…hundreds? thousands?..of co-conspirators. > > And no breaches of security? Remarkable, to say the least. Fucking amazing, to put it about right. > > OK, I’m a strange guy with some unpopular opinions, I have that on good authority. But I’m the only person who thinks this just doesn’t add up? Well, not the first time, not the last, either, probably. > > But it _doesn’t_ add up. When something fits so neatly into preconceived notions, slips into place with a _click!_…I get suspicious. **Elucidator** , I am one hundred percent with you. I have no idea how to articulate an argument for this which doesn’t make me sound crazy. You’ve done a better job than I could on that front. 😉 Som’m ain’t right about this whole thing and I smell a rat. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/40 "2016-01-09T14:34:11Z")
> [@Rune](#): > > What would make you believe that just because they came to Germany they’d suddenly magically become other people? Would you become another person with an entirely different set of values, if you moved to Germany? > > What happened was that as per the Cologne (why can’t you say Køln like everybody else?!) major, girls should learn to keep an arm’s length distance to men and only move in groups. Also: properly conservative dressed, demure with downcast eyes, and down leave home unless accompanied by a male relative. Cologne is the English pronunciation I have also heard reports of an increase of attacks on woman in Sweden and Denmark by immigrants and we have also experienced sexual attacks on underage girls in the U.K. The last thing that we need is another cover up so as to not upset the immigrants. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538.md?page=3)