# Ok, so what the hell happened in Germany in NYE? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 8, 2016, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538 "2016-01-08T23:28:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 27
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/521 "2016-01-17T11:25:42Z")
Part of the problem is how do you stop a migration of a million or more people? Well, there’s the obvious “solution” involving walls and guns but that’s pretty damn inhumane and repugnant. No one (other than the inevitable few extremists) wants that. But normal border controls aren’t going to stop a mass of humanity that large intent on making the march. Normal immigrant tracking will be woefully inadequate. I don’t have a good answer for the problem, I don’t think anyone does. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/522 "2016-01-17T18:06:49Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Part of the problem is how do you stop a migration of a million or more people? > > Well, there’s the obvious “solution” involving walls and guns but that’s pretty damn inhumane and repugnant. No one (other than the inevitable few extremists) wants that. > > But normal border controls aren’t going to stop a mass of humanity that large intent on making the march. Normal immigrant tracking will be woefully inadequate. > > I don’t have a good answer for the problem, I don’t think anyone does. If the German government wishes to win the next election the run up is all the time they have. I think we shall see large scale deportations to outside of Europe as other European countries will not accept them, the message must go out unless you are pre registered you will not succeed. The Question to be answered is what would the American government and its people do if there was a mass invasion of immigrants that just crashed through the Mexican border? ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/523 "2016-01-17T18:23:05Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > The Question to be answered is what would the American government and its people do if there was a mass invasion of immigrants that just crashed through the Mexican border? Er… First of all what is happening is hardly an “invasion”. Second, the US has been having for a very long time much larger waves of immigration from Latin America. Our response has not been perfect, and many have shamefully responded with bigotry but it has certainly been better. Anyway, I would say that to different degrees Americans recognize that diversity is a blessing and that waves of immigration have enriched America for the better. Hopefully, Europeans will feel the same as their countries are both strengthened and transformed by waves of immigration. It is inevitable, will have some bumps in the road, but will turn out for the better and for better or worse, you can’t fight the future. ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/524 "2016-01-17T18:33:35Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Part of the problem is how do you stop a migration of a million or more people? > > Well, there’s the obvious “solution” involving walls and guns but that’s pretty damn inhumane and repugnant. No one (other than the inevitable few extremists) wants that So now merely wanting one’s nation to have a secure border is inhumane, repugnant, and extremist? I think the _majority_ of Europeans will be in favor of armed border guards and barriers if it’s the only way to keep out millions of homophobic, mysoginistic, anti-Western, assimilation resistant migrants. [UK public opinion towards immigration](http://www.migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/briefings/uk-public-opinion-toward-immigration-overall-attitudes-and-level-concern) > [@](#): > > Existing evidence also clearly shows high levels of opposition to immigration in the UK. In recent surveys, majorities of respondents think that there are too many migrants, that fewer migrants should be let in to the country, and that legal restrictions on immigration should be tighter. > > Figure 2 shows that large majorities in the 2013 British Social Attitudes survey endorsed reducing immigration. Indeed, over 56% chose ‘reduced a lot’, while 77% chose either ‘reduced a lot’ or ‘reduced a little’. The same question yielded similar results on the British Social Attitudes survey in 2008, adding confidence that these are reliable estimates. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/525 "2016-01-17T18:45:28Z")
Well, then, where do they go? These desperate and terrified people, widows and orphans, where do you suggest they go? So far, all you’ve shown us is that you don’t much care what happens to them or where they go, so long as it doesn’t happen here. What is to be done? ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/526 "2016-01-17T18:50:19Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > Er… First of all what is happening is hardly an “invasion”. Second, the US has been having for a very long time much larger waves of immigration from Latin America. Our response has not been perfect, and many have shamefully responded with bigotry but it has certainly been better. Illegal immigrants to the US don’t “crash” through though, they have to sneak. > [@](#): > > Anyway, I would say that to different degrees Americans recognize that diversity is a blessing and that waves of immigration have enriched America for the better. Water is a blessing too, until so much is poured down your throat against your will that you drown. The number of migrants entering Germany last year is as high as the population of the nation’s third largest city. Add another million or two in 2016 and it will approach the population of it’s largest city. > [@](#): > > Hopefully, Europeans will feel the same as their countries are both strengthened and transformed by waves of immigration. It is inevitable, will have some bumps in the road, but will turn out for the better and for better or worse, you can’t fight the future. The dose makes the poison. Mass murder in Europe’s clubs, cafes, and transit systems, enforcement of Islamic blasphemy prohibitions by AK47 weilding extremists, and various incidents of mob sexual assault and rape are quite a bit more than “bumps in the road”. The continuation of Europe’s lax attitude towards immigration is in no way inevitable. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/527 "2016-01-17T18:55:30Z")
The answer to Cain’s question is yes, yes you _are_ your brother’s keeper. And the extent to which you recognize that is a good estimate of your humanity. I hear your “No!”. Where is your “Yes”? ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/528 "2016-01-17T18:58:44Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Well, then, where do they go? These desperate and terrified people, widows and orphans, where do you suggest they go? So far, all you’ve shown us is that you don’t much care what happens to them or where they go, so long as it doesn’t happen here. > > What is to be done? How many homeless people do you invite to live with you each year? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/529 "2016-01-17T19:09:50Z")
Is the topic here “What is to be done?”. Or would you rather discuss the moral failings and flawed character of me? Is it that you have an intelligent and humane solution, but won’t release it until you are satisfied that we are worthy? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/530 "2016-01-17T19:30:13Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Well, then, where do they go? These desperate and terrified people, widows and orphans, where do you suggest they go? So far, all you’ve shown us is that you don’t much care what happens to them or where they go, so long as it doesn’t happen here. > > What is to be done? Jordan. They already have the camps set up for them. All they need is monetary support. ---
**Author:** ![Hank\_Beecher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hank_beecher/32/7275_2.png) [@Hank\_Beecher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hank_Beecher)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/531 "2016-01-17T19:35:59Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Is the topic here “What is to be done?”. Or would you rather discuss the moral failings and flawed character of me? Is it that you have an intelligent and humane solution, but won’t release it until you are satisfied that we are worthy? And I take it you are currently oblivious to the irony of your post appearing directly after you called out other posters for being uncaring. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/532 "2016-01-17T19:50:02Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Jordan. They already have the camps set up for them. All they need is monetary support. Jordan has close to 90 000 Syrian refugees, over 1% of Jordan’s population. What do you think the reasonable upper limit should be for them? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/533 "2016-01-17T19:54:00Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > Except, #491 is F# to your C. > > Unless hundreds of German women did simultaneously make up allegations because they hate Muslims. Which may not sit well with the feminist liberals on this board who don’t take claims of sexual abuse lightly. > > (Aren’t you one of them?) > > Pick your poison. Defend the oppressed minority or defend female sexual integrity? > > Or, deflect and attack the conservative. > > Hum-dee-hum. We can do both, actually. But speaking of “picking your poison,” do you really think it’s escaped anyone’s attention that the only time conservatives start caring about sexual assault is when the alleged perpetrators are Muslim? If this had been a bunch of white frat boys in Texas, you’d be dismissing it as a bunch of liberal outrage over boys doing what boys are supposed to do. The contrast becomes even more stark when folks like you try to pretend to care about how gay people are treated. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/534 "2016-01-17T19:55:44Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > If this had been a bunch of white frat boys in Texas, you’d be dismissing it as a bunch of liberal outrage over boys doing what boys are supposed to do… Yeah, you TOTALLY read my mind. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/535 "2016-01-17T19:56:22Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Well, then, where do they go? These desperate and terrified people, widows and orphans, where do you suggest they go? So far, all you’ve shown us is that you don’t much care what happens to them or where they go, so long as it doesn’t happen here. > > What is to be done? The majority are single young males and they are not terrified and they probably out number genuine Syrian Refugees ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/536 "2016-01-17T20:04:02Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Jordan. They already have the camps set up for them. All they need is monetary support. I believe that with proper support building habitable accommodation in Jordon would be preferable for the Syrian refugees, as when it is safe to do so many will want to return to Syria ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/537 "2016-01-17T20:09:27Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Jordan has close to 90 000 Syrian refugees, over 1% of Jordan’s population. What do you think the reasonable upper limit should be for them? Jordon does have the space to build camps. If the intention was to integrate them into the Jordanian population then I would say no because you would create the same problem as in Germany ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/538 "2016-01-17T20:18:09Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > Yeah, you TOTALLY read my mind. In the U.K. we have a problem with white Eastern Europeans who have come to our country with the intent of committing criminal offences, one of the many reasons we want out of the EU. Because of freedom of movement we cannot refuse them entry. The problem is uncontrolled immigration a persons colour has nothing to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/539 "2016-01-17T20:18:27Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > The answer to Cain’s question is yes, yes you _are_ your brother’s keeper. And the extent to which you recognize that is a good estimate of your humanity. > > I hear your “No!”. Where is your “Yes”? How many homeless you shelter? It’s easy to be generous with another’s property. ---
**Author:** ![Grim\_Render](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@Grim\_Render](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grim_Render)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/540 "2016-01-17T20:19:09Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > We can do both, actually. But speaking of “picking your poison,” do you really think it’s escaped anyone’s attention that the only time conservatives start caring about sexual assault is when the alleged perpetrators are Muslim? If this had been a bunch of white frat boys in Texas, you’d be dismissing it as a bunch of liberal outrage over boys doing what boys are supposed to do. > > The contrast becomes even more stark when folks like you try to pretend to care about how gay people are treated. Almost as shocking as the sight of those people suddenly being the only one who cares about sexual assault or gay rights. I find the right starting to care about the rights of women and gays when perpetrators are Muslim less hypocritical than the lefts sudden stop in caring. Although to be fair, that mostly seem to the the Opinionati, with the actual people who normally vote for the left just as shocked as the right. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538.md?page=26) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538.md?page=28)