# Ok, so what the hell happened in Germany in NYE? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 8, 2016, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538 "2016-01-08T23:28:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 37
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2016, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/721 "2016-02-02T11:05:22Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > A major problem that nobody wants except for the extreme right, it may seem a strange statement but they are gaining support and gaining in confidence. This weekend in Dover we had protest from B.N.P. National Front, England First, Combat 18 and possibly Blood and Honour. In Luton another far right so called Christian group verbally assaulted Muslims. The extreme right is coming out of the woodwork on mainland Europe. The growing number of migrants coming to Europe is only strengthening a shift to the far right and the only way to stop it is to stop the migrants. Yeah, only right wing policies can stop the rise of the right wing! ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2016, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/722 "2016-02-02T20:55:17Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > Yeah, only right wing policies can stop the rise of the right wing! And your preference right wing policies or Neo-Nazi right wing policies, because at the moment people are starting to be afraid of seeing THEIR way of life disappearing. Where I live I used to be thought of as a little bit to near the right, I now hear those same people expressing stronger views that mine. In main land Europe ordinary people are looking for answers and they will be looking to the right, they will be feeling that the left and the centre ground parties have let them down. The Dover protest by the BNP and the NF does not surprise me but England First and Combat 18 with their connections to Blood and Honour are a surprise, they must be feeling confident. ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a8b319/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_wuzzy)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2016, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/723 "2016-02-02T22:09:20Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > Yeah, only right wing policies can stop the rise of the right wing! Actually, I think this _is_ the case. Maintaining the policies we have today will only see a continued rise of the right wing throughout much of Europe. I believe the big unknown is whether it’s the populist right who gains or the far right; and just how right wing the policies will need to be to defeat the emerging far right. Nothing said in this debate will have the slightest bearing on what happens politically or socially in Europe. ---
**Author:** ![Memnon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@Memnon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Memnon)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2016, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/724 "2016-02-02T22:20:39Z")
> [@Gary Kumquat](#): > > Yeah, only right wing policies can stop the rise of the right wing! You say that as though it doesn’t make sense. Like it or not, immigration is a [_huge_](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/11816808/Immigration-is-the-publics-biggest-concern-poll-says.html) issue in the UK, bigger than defence, bigger than welfare, bigger, even, than the NHS. Yet successive governments have spent decades doing nothing but facilitating it. And you’re _surprised_ that this constant, determined obliviousness to the will of the electorate is manifesting in far-right popularism? Seriously, what did you _think_ was going to happen? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2016, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/725 "2016-02-02T22:50:35Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > I don’t need a new plan. They just need more personnel and resources to process the influx. They need more resources and personnel intercepting the boats coming across the Mediterranean. They need the heel dragging member countries to accept their share of refugees. They probably should set up camps in Greece, but the Greek government is very resistant to that. > > Directly settling refugees from Turkish, Lebanese and other close camps would probably cut down on both non-refugee migrants and the number of people dying trying to get to Greece but that would require more money and political will. > > The problem is that they still are a bunch of separate countries. It’s not like in the U.S. where the feds could just say “we’re letting x number in and here’s where they are going.” And the realization that your last paragraph is true is why resistance to the concept of a stronger EU will grow. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2016, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/726 "2016-02-02T23:13:56Z")
Or the EU will shrink down to the big guys and fewer, more compliant, little guys then become more earnest in their political union. There’s benefits to the union strengthening but to be truly solid they need more cohesion. They expanded too fast and brought together too disparate cultures and they need to have fewer little guys who need helping out during bad times. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2016, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/727 "2016-02-02T23:55:19Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Or the EU will shrink down to the big guys and fewer, more compliant, little guys then become more earnest in their political union. There’s benefits to the union strengthening but to be truly solid they need more cohesion. They expanded too fast and brought together too disparate cultures and they need to have fewer little guys who need helping out during bad times. You think that this current migration is going to weaken nationalism? We might not only be seeing the rise of nationalism we might also be seeing the welfare state of much of Europe under attack. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/728 "2016-02-03T01:24:59Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > The growing number of migrants coming to Europe is only strengthening a shift to the far right and the only way to stop it is to stop the migrants. So, we should burn the village in order to save it? ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/729 "2016-02-03T06:18:07Z")
> [@Tithonus](#): > > You say that as though it doesn’t make sense. Like it or not, immigration is a [_huge_](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/11816808/Immigration-is-the-publics-biggest-concern-poll-says.html) issue in the UK, bigger than defence, bigger than welfare, bigger, even, than the NHS. Yet successive governments have spent decades doing nothing but facilitating it. And you’re _surprised_ that this constant, determined obliviousness to the will of the electorate is manifesting in far-right popularism? Seriously, what did you _think_ was going to happen? I say that as though it doesn’t make sense, because it doesn’t make sense. As per all previously cited OECD/Oxford University/UCL/other studies, the UK has benefited massively from immigration, and continues to do so. Our predicted economic growth is underpinned purely by expected arrivals of people who will make this net positive difference. Just as well too, when you consider that absent of immigration we’re looking at an overwhelmingly aging population and decreasing birth rates. And this is hardly a recent trend. 1066 ring any bells? Care to dwell on the origins of the anglo-saxons? How’s the royal family’s lineage look to you. So, in your own time, why don’t you explain just why you think a pattern of behaviour that goes back over a thousand years and has consistently been of benefit to us requires to be stomped down by right wing policies? ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/730 "2016-02-03T06:21:13Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > And your preference right wing policies or Neo-Nazi right wing policies, because at the moment people are starting to be afraid of seeing THEIR way of life disappearing. Where I live I used to be thought of as a little bit to near the right, I now hear those same people expressing stronger views that mine. Oh right, I have to support large levels of stupid, because some people are capable of greater levels of stupid? I’m sure that you hang out with lots of people who mirror your own point of view, that’s how it tends to work. Shall I bore you with similar levels of anecdotal data about how the people I know aren’t afraid of their way of life disappearing? ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/731 "2016-02-03T12:12:30Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > Oh right, I have to support large levels of stupid, because some people are capable of greater levels of stupid? > > I’m sure that you hang out with lots of people who mirror your own point of view, that’s how it tends to work. Shall I bore you with similar levels of anecdotal data about how the people I know aren’t afraid of their way of life disappearing? The only thing that bores me is your assumption that everyone who leans to the right is stupid and does not share your great intellect. Another mistake is to assume that that I hang only with my right wing buddies. The truth is that because of the different groups I am involved with the people I have contact with have political views from the extreme left to the extreme right and all points in between, Socially I mix with people who are very wealthy to those who live below the poverty line (for a short period of my life I was a rough sleeper and is someone who has not forgotten his roots) I try to base my comments on the reality of the situation not on how I would like things to be. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/732 "2016-02-03T12:18:04Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > So, we should burn the village in order to save it? If a forest fire is burning out of control you may have to sacrifice a village to save a city ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/733 "2016-02-03T12:19:56Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > The only thing that bores me is your assumption that everyone who leans to the right is stupid and does not share your great intellect. Another mistake is to assume that that I hang only with my right wing buddies. The truth is that because of the different groups I am involved with the people I have contact with have political views from the extreme left to the extreme right and all points in between, Socially I mix with people who are very wealthy to those who live below the poverty line (for a short period of my life I was a rough sleeper and is someone who has not forgotten his roots) I try to base my comments on the reality of the situation not on how I would like things to be. Cool story, bro. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/734 "2016-02-03T12:21:24Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > If a forest fire is burning out of control you may have to sacrifice a village to save a city But what if that fire swerves left and threatens an orphanage, or right and threatens a panda farm! What then? And why won’t anyone consider the poor orphan pandas! ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/735 "2016-02-03T12:58:18Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > But what if that fire swerves left and threatens an orphanage, or right and threatens a panda farm! What then? And why won’t anyone consider the poor orphan pandas! If you had to choose who to rescue from a fire a person or your pet animal what would be your choice, no tine to rescue both? ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/736 "2016-02-03T13:01:01Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > If you had to choose who to rescue from a fire a person or your pet animal what would be your choice, no tine to rescue both? How cute is the person. And which pet? If it’s my cat, frankly she can be a bit of a dick. Could I save my skates instead? It takes ages to get hockey skates good and comfy. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/737 "2016-02-03T14:19:27Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > How cute is the person. And which pet? If it’s my cat, frankly she can be a bit of a dick. Could I save my skates instead? It takes ages to get hockey skates good and comfy. Your comment reminds me of a very camp elderly gentleman I used to know he always used to be confused ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2016, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/738 "2016-02-03T18:52:03Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > Your comment reminds me of a very camp elderly gentleman I used to know he always > used to be confused Cool story, bro. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/739 "2016-02-04T14:37:05Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > Cool story, bro. I think that one thing that we can agree on is we do not want to see more of this happening EXCLUSIVE - Nazi daggers, SS hats and a hangman’s noose: On night patrol with the ‘Soldiers of Odin’, neo-Nazi led vigilantes vowing to ‘keep Europe’s women safe from migrant sex attacks’ Notorious Finland-based group Soldiers of Odin is at the forefront of a fierce vigilante movement sweeping Europe MailOnline gained exclusive access to the anti-migrant group’s patrols and its secretive ‘Nazi-themed’ headquarters Founded by a self-confessed, violent neo-Nazi, ‘Odins’ are one of increasing number of anti-migrant groups Vigilantes claim the police can’t control migrants by themselves, following spate of sex attacks that shocked Europe By Jake Wallis Simons In Kemi, Finland For Mailonline Published: 10:42, 4 February 2016 | Updated: 13:13, 4 February 2016 Read more: [Soldiers of Odin neo-Nazi White Supremacist led vigilantes | Daily Mail Online](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3426685/Nazi-daggers-SS-hats-hangman-s-noose-night-patrol-Soldiers-Odin-neo-Nazi-led-vigilantes-vowing-Europe-s-women-safe-migrant-sex-attacks.html#ixzz3zD5PusmU) Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538/740 "2016-02-04T18:28:49Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > I think that one thing that we can agree on is we do not want to see more of this happening Let me guess. You think the only way to stop neo-nazis is to keep the immigrants out? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538.md?page=36) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-so-what-the-hell-happened-in-germany-in-nye/742538.md?page=38)